Sourceforge...

Developer's Forum, for discussion of bugs, code, and other developmental aspects of GliDOS.

Sourceforge...

Postby Stiletto » 2002-9-20 @ 14:54

Paul, as I'm sure you're aware, OpenGlide has a SourceForge project all set up:
http://openglide.sourceforge.net/
http://sourceforge.net/projects/openglide/

Have you contacted the authors to permit you to apply your patches, get on the developer's list, etc.?
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Postby Glidos » 2002-9-20 @ 19:31

I tried to contact them, but no luck. I don't think it has been touched since it was first put up. I tried to contact them early on, at a time when I could have done with some help. Now I'm probably happier working on it alone, so if you think you might be able to track them down, don't on my account.
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Well, you are almost right

Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-26 @ 17:07

Hey all,
Well, I did put OpenGLide on SourceForge and announced that it was now OpenSource, but almost no one offered help or wanted to help, so as my time was short I just putted it there and quit working on it.
I am very happy knowing the fixes and changes you did on OpenGLide, nice work, very nice. Of course if I would code OpenGLide again I would have made it different, but it was a nice and fun wrapper to do.
I would like to know and maybe integrate your main changes in OpenGLide so maybe we can release a better windows version.

best regards,

Fabio Barros

P.S. Currently I am working on PS2PE and PCSX2 (both PS2 emulators), check pcsx2.ngemu.com.
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Postby Stiletto » 2002-9-26 @ 17:42

Hi Fabio, did you get my email? :)
...

Sorry Paul, had to do it. :)

....

Fabio - quick question: I heard Let of Glid3D fame is working on emulators now too, but I cannot remember where I heard that or what he's working on. Do you know?
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Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-26 @ 18:08

Yes I got your email and already replied.

I dont know where let is, but if I do I will let you know, and if you do, let me know... :)

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Postby Glidos » 2002-9-26 @ 22:07

Hey, it's Fabio. Magic! It's so nice to get to talk to you at last. I've been wandering around in your code for years now, and always wondered about the guy behind it.

My original interest was in getting DOS based Glide games to work (particularly Tomb Raider I), so I was putting all my effort into the DOS to Windows bit. When it came to the actual rendering, I really didn't want to redo all the work that had already been done in the development of Glide wrappers, so I went looking for an existing wrapper. Tried loads, and OpenGlide was the best by far. Didn't quite handle TR1: no chroma keying and the textures would suddenly go bang, but very close. Then found it was open source, and that was it.

I have a CVS repository that starts with the version you put up on source forge, and has all my changes. I should let you have that. There are lots of little fiddles here and there, but the biggest change is to the texture caching. I think I have that working nicely now. I'm just putting paletted textures back in, but should have that done soon. We'll I have it working for P8 textures; I just need to sort something out for AP88, and then I think I have everything that Red Baron needs.

You should have a look at the Red Baron threads here. You will see how much people like OpenGlide.
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Ideas, lots of them

Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-26 @ 22:48

Hey, currently I have plenty of ideas to implement in OpenGLide, using the OpenGL 1.3 features will greatly improve speed and compatibility in OpenGLide, I dont know how far you got but I will try GLIDOS soon.
I just need some old dos games that I will need to search.. :)
Red Baron 2 I have... :p

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Postby Glidos » 2002-9-27 @ 04:50

Glad you are still interested in this. I just want to finish this paletted texture extension stuff for AP88, and I'll upload my CVS repository to the files area here... well, if you want to have a look straight away, I could put up a version now, and give you an update later. Or is it better if I create a user name for you on my Linux box and check out a working copy. Not sure how we should do this. I wonder if there's a way to make the sourceforge copy look like I made my changes there, so that the design history doesn't get lost?

Glidos is like a DOS client and a Windows server. The server loads OpenGlide in its original Glide2x.dll form, so the changed version of OpenGlide is still useable for Windows programs. The very latest version of OpenGlide has not been released with Glidos yet; it's on the "Red Baron" page of http://www.glidos.net.

BTW, for a DOS game to try Redguard is the prettiest.

Hey Stiletto, I know I wasn't to keen on your idea at first, but actually thanks.
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Postby Nicht Sehr Gut » 2002-9-27 @ 06:21

Glidos wrote:Hey Stiletto, I know I wasn't to keen on your idea at first, but actually thanks.
All hail Stiletto for bring these two greats together! Let's throw them a ticker-tape parade!

Hmm. Kind of low on funding at the moment. How about I just tear up some paper and throw the pieces in your general direction?
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Postby Glidos » 2002-9-27 @ 08:08

Quick thought: it would be nice to get OpenGlide development back on source forge, and without losing the design history. Fabio, if I register on SourceForge (or manage to remember my old registration) can you add me with admin privleges to the OpenGlide area? If so I'd have thought it would be possible for me to update the CVS files directly with my versions, thus looking like it was always kept on SourceForge. Presumably I'd be able to ssh in or something, and see the files directly.

BTW, you wont like some of my changes. Early on when I was just interested in Glidos, I hacked bits out I didn't need, like window creation and all the MMX code. Of course, the use of CVS means nothing is lost, but there are some bits that might want reinstating. There's also a hack just to get the Tomb Raider shadow to work; I need to push that out of OpenGlide, up into Glidos.
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Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-27 @ 12:01

Hey, I will try to do that right now, wait.... :)
Hummm, what is your SourceForge login? :)
and yours Stiletto?
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Postby Glidos » 2002-9-27 @ 12:13

Great! I think I have three logins now, but I have no idea what two of them are. If I actually start using SourceForge then hopefullly I'll be able to remember the passwords. :)

Anyway, the one I've just set up, and for which I'll know the password for at least a week is "glidos".

I hope it is possible to access the internal CVS files directly. Guess we'll have to see.
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Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-27 @ 12:56

Well, I have added you as admin and released a package so everyone can download the first version.. :P
Does anyone want to be on the dev team?
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Postby Stiletto » 2002-9-27 @ 15:28

Here's my SF account info:
http://sourceforge.net/users/swstiletto/

Problem is, I doubt I'd be able to code anything, really.

But as Paul can attest to, I have other talents. :)
http://www.glidos.net/ackno.html

Thought: Do too many cooks spoil the broth? I could try to dig up some of the other Glide wrapper authors (like Let, as I mentioned). Or the people who worked on OpenGlide after 0.04 and made all those letter releases. Etc., etc.

Should we clue the eVoodoo people into this?
For Fabio: http://evoodoo.emulation64.com , search our forums for previous news items on them. Feel free to respond to old posts.

Additional note: Paul, I'm trying to make GliDOS hit the news at ye olde Glide wrapper site - http://www.glideunderground.com
Sent an email to Khalid Shaikh, one of the first Glide wrapper authors, and to one of the news posters there. I know it's mostly dead, anymore, but I thought it might be a prestigious thing.

Fabio: Ever hear of BigRRed? It was a Glide - RRedline wrapper, quite odd at the time... Rendition users can still download it here: http://www.renditionrevival.com/files.html

Tying in old things:
A point of view from a guy at NVIDIA as to what NVIDIA thinks of Glide wrappers:
Now, this is just my own personal opinion, and in no way reflects the views or position of NVIDIA, but I don't think anyone would mind or pursue action against a glide wrapper. Maybe it mattered back when there were glide products on the shelf, but not anymore. At most, a cease and desist type restriction would probably be the most severe action taken.


Miscellaneous thoughts I've said before, spewing now:
- I'd eventually like to see a NVIDIA NV-1 "wrapper". However, most of the technical discussions I've had with former NVIDIA employees lead me to believe that a wrapper is technically impossible for this card. However, an emulator could possibly work.
(Search VOGONS for other miscellaneous threads on the NV1)

- Want to make a completely compatible wrapper? Write a Voodoo 1/2 emulator. MAME authors would be in your debt. :)

- Oh, and go back over VOGONS for my various lists of Glide games to get going in GLIDOS/OpenGlide.

- Other wrappers gave out their source. Perhaps OpenGlide could start spin-offs, wrapping Glide to other 3D API's.

- Linux port?

- My big number one long-term wish for GliDOS/OpenGlide - Glide3x wrapping. Only Let's Glid3d and eVoodoo have ever hit this mark at any level of support.

- Support all of eVoodoo's supported games, show them up but don't kick them out!

Wow, my mind is spinning... :) Hope this project doesn't end like other Glide wrappers (Let's Glid3D, BigRRed, Khalid Shaikh's...)
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Postby DosFreak » 2002-9-27 @ 15:36

The Radeon Glide Wrapper Author just released a new ver...he's considering adding support for other video cards...
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Postby Stiletto » 2002-9-27 @ 15:47

http://home.t-online.de/home/zsack/
So it has! I forgot to mention that one - Glide-Wrapper-Still-In-Development #3. (closed source? prolly based on OpenGlide)
Email the author: ashopa@gmx.de

His comments in his README, compatibility and changelog documents are, as always, interesting.
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very interesting wrapper.. :)

Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-27 @ 17:03

Well,
Lets start slow as you have many questions Stiletto... :p

1. Yes I used BigRRed a lot I had an Diamond Stealth based on the verite2100, nice board.. :), BigRRed was the first Glide wrapper as far as I know and was good at it.
2. Latter came Khalid with his and mine OpenGLide, but at first I did not published it so another guy release his first, but my screenshots were better.
3. In that time I was asked by 3dfx attourney to remove OpenGLide from the web, I did, but 1 year latter 3dfx contacted me to work for them, but as I was doing my interviews it was bought by NVidia and my job fell from the roof... :)
4. I would love a Linux port but I need someone to do it.
5. I would love to port it to Direct3D as some Glide stuff may only be done fast and right in it, like Locking of buffers and things like that.
6. With the current OpenGLide it is not difficult to do a Glide3 emulation.

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Postby Stiletto » 2002-9-27 @ 17:45

1. Maybe some day we can find the author and dig out the source. :)

2. I remember all that. I got into Glide wrappers with UltraHLE, mostly because my home PC had a Voodoo2 and my one at work did not... and then I got out of N64 emulation (only took about a month for me to lose that interest) but kept a watchful eye on the topic of Glide wrappers. We've mentioned many other wrappers here at VOGONS too, including a D3D-OpenGL wrapper and a OpenGL-D3d wrapper. :)\

3. Glad you're back at it again... Do you think Glide wrapper authors are in as much legal trouble nowadays?

4. Not me, but I can fish around... :)

5. Shall I collate all the Glide-D3D wrapper sourcecode, then? Or won't that be needed?

6. See this - another author hard at work! And he needs help! Let's corrupt him over to the Dark Side to help add to OpenGlide... :)
http://www.glideunderground.com/Forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=119&FORUM_ID=5&CAT_ID=7&Topic_Title=Glide3GL+Status&Forum_Title=Glide+Wrappers
Would you like to email him? :)

... and As to my comment about too many cooks spoiling the broth?

Time to hit the promotion trail again... *sigh*

I see you updated this page already:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/openglide/

There's a comment long outstanding here in the forum:
http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?thread_id=118195&forum_id=59816
Did you ever email him or anything?

There's also a long outstanding bug tracker event here:
https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=498360&group_id=18883&atid=118883

Something for you or Paul to look at. And with my new-found abilities there in SF, I took care of a message post and a bug tracker event. :)

Thank you!
"I see a little silhouette-o of a man, Scaramouche, Scaramouche, will you
do the Fandango!" - Queen

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Postby Stiletto » 2002-9-27 @ 17:49

Note: Website needs redesigned then... http://openglide.sourceforge.net

Snover?
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Postby GoldFinger » 2002-9-27 @ 17:59

Hummm, why?
simplicity is a god's bless.... :P
Sure it needs a redesign, if he wants to do it, tehn, great!
Thou shall ask thee!
Lets do something worth.
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