(re: capturing a MIDI file, and loading the result into my MIDI sequencer)

OK, I just did the above, and saw this. Note that the patches are "1" based, the banks are "0" based, and bank "003" is the GS "SFX" bank.

When you see the sandstorm in the intro:

Patch: 123
Bank: 003
Preset: Wind

After the vehicle stops in the intro:

Patch: 125
Bank: 003
Preset: Door

So... in other words, if your SoundFont that you're using does NOT contain those intruments/samples/patch mapping, then strange results will be heard.

A GM SoundFont (as well as GS SoundFont that don't include those) will "fall back" to whatever the closest patch is.

e.g. If you were using a standard GM SoundFont, the "Wind" would sound like GM's "Seashore", and the "Door" would sound like GM's "Telephone Ring".

yeah i know read my previous post 😀

robertmo wrote:

I already know all that. ---snip--- I only tried soundfonts that have all above effects with following results: ---snip--- [SF2] […]
Show full quote

I already know all that.
---snip---
I only tried soundfonts that have all above effects with following results:
---snip---
[SF2] Eternal Hydrogen II - 3MGMGS.sf2
frozen/stuck/looped? wind
too silent harvester1
---snip---
GeneralUser GS SoftSynth v1.44.sf2
wrong rocket
too silent wind
---snip---
In all above cases when I say "too silent" it is almost always not heard at all.

I think that you've answered your own question 😉 Seems to me that the samples in the SoundFonts that you've tried are not loud enough, are of poor quality, and/or are completely the wrong sample for the desired instrument etc...

(Edit) This isn't a limitation of the BASSMIDI Driver (or the BASSMIDI Audio Libraries), but simply the SoundFonts that you're using. Like you've (and I've) replied previously, it doesn't seem that there is one available that will make it sound like it should.

That being said, if there was a way to directly convert the VSC's sound bank file (in the VST version it's embedded in the "VSC.dll" file, and IIRC in the standalone driver version it's the "VSC.dat" file) to SoundFont format, then it would sound perfect. Unfortunately there isn't any way (or utility) currently available that can do that.

I updated the VST MIDI driver to fully support Windows 8. this includes the config util to update the default midi synth.

I installed BassMidi and the Weeds soundfont. It's not working in DosBox, but it does work when I play a midi file in Windows Media Player or VLC. Seems odd to me. I've tried a couple games, and all of them use the default Windows midi. I've set BASSMIDI Driver (port A) to default.
My options file looks like this:
mpu401=intelligent
mididevice=default
midiconfig=0

red mammoth wrote:

I installed BassMidi and the Weeds soundfont. It's not working in DosBox, but it does work when I play a midi file in Windows Me […]
Show full quote

I installed BassMidi and the Weeds soundfont. It's not working in DosBox, but it does work when I play a midi file in Windows Media Player or VLC. Seems odd to me. I've tried a couple games, and all of them use the default Windows midi. I've set BASSMIDI Driver (port A) to default.
My options file looks like this:
mpu401=intelligent
mididevice=default
midiconfig=0

Your "midiconfig" line just _might_ be incorrect.

After ensuring that the BASSMIDI Driver and SoundFont are working correctly in Windows (you already said that it did though), start DOSBox to a simple DOS(Box) prompt.

At DOSBox's DOS prompt type:

MIXER /LISTMIDI

...and press enter.

The dsiplayed results will look something like this:

1 0 = SB Live! Synth A [CF20]
2 1 = Out To MIDI Yoke:  1
3 2 = Out To MIDI Yoke:  2
4 3 = Out To MIDI Yoke:  3
5 4 = Out To MIDI Yoke:  4
6 5 = MT-32 Synth Emulator
7 6 = BASSMIDI Driver (port A)
8 7 = BASSMIDI Driver (port B)
9 8 = SB Live! Sw Synth [CF20]
10 9 = SB Live! Synth B [CF20]
1110 = SB Live! MIDI Port [CF20]
1211 = YAMAHA XG WDM SoftSynthesizer
1312 = Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth

For the above example, the "midiconfig" line would be "midiconfig=6" (for BASSMIDI Driver port A) or "midiconfig=7" (for BASSMIDI Driver port B).

rfnagel there's Roland VSC missing on your list 😀

robertmo wrote:

rfnagel there's Roland VSC missing on your list 😀

Hehe, I use the VST version, as well as VST versions of Edirol Hyper Canvas, Edirol Orchestral, and Edirol Super Quartet 😀

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedet … s/?id=133654016 😀

There's also a VST YAMAHA XG hence my notice 😉

robertmo wrote:

There's also a VST YAMAHA XG hence my notice 😉

I also have that one, but found quite a few glitches when running it on my PC. The WinDoZe driver version works just fine though 😀

(note: not really an explaination of why I use the VSTs mentioned previously, just a side comment on the VSC VST)

mixer /listmidi shows this:

10 = BASSMIDI Driver (port A)
21 = BASSMIDI Driver (port B)
32 = Microsoft GS Wavetable SW Synth
43 = MT-32 Synth Emulator
54 = Out To MIDI Yoke:  1
65 = Out To MIDI Yoke:  2

The rest is just MIDI Yoke stuff.

My midi config is midiconfig=0. My soundfont is under BASSMIDI port A. I know that I hit apply.

The game I'm trying to run is KGB/Conspiracy. I went to the game's install program, and the music device is currently set to Sound Blaster Pro. Maybe it has something to do with that. I've also tried other games, and they have the same problem: the music works, but it sounds like the default midi.

This might be related: I downloaded the Vista MIDI Picker program (I use windows 7 64-bit). It runs fine, but the only MIDI Output Device available is (Unknown Device). Maybe that's related.

You'll want to set the game MIDI to something like "General MIDI", "MPU-401", "Sound Canvas", "SC-55", etc.

Setting it to Sound Blaster Pro means you're going to get OPL FM music, which isn't MIDI at all.

You shouldn't need Vista MIDI Picker if you're using the latest BASSMIDIDRV, as the latter has a "MIDI picker" feature built-in.

The other choices are:
Adlib music card
Adlib Gold
Sound Blaster (=Adlib music)
Sound Blaster Pro
Roland MT-32 (LAPC1 Midi card)

None of these seem to be midi. That's the problem. Thanks for all the help, guys.

MT-32/LAPC-I was the MIDI standard before General MIDI, but the two are not compatible.

You could use Munt Reloaded (an MT-32/CM-32/CM-64/LAPC-I software synthesizer that is available in Windows MIDI driver form, like BASSMIDIDRV but for MT-32 MIDI), although it requires getting hold of ROMs that aren't legal to distribute.

Edit: I think all of the other cards you listed use OPL2/OPL3 FM synthesis for music. DOSBox has built-in support for this, but it doesn't generally sound as good as MT-32 music would.

mudlord wrote:

I updated the VST MIDI driver to fully support Windows 8. this includes the config util to update the default midi synth.

Does it have anything to do with solving problem from this thread?
WARNING: Currently impossible to change default midi device in Win8

yes, it should.

Watching this video about Doom 2:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RKJsseejs2U

I don't hear any noticeable echo - map 1 bgm.

Test using the Patch93 soundfont:
http://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=34949
--> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1tmN1a3cDMg

(using Polyphone to examine the sf2 is even more fun!)

Regarding the Picked Bass:
- BASSMIDI Driver, I'm pretty sure I get some 'room bouncing' echo on map1. Boomy feel.
- Coolsoft VirtualMIDISynth, there might be some reverb. Definitely less than BASSMIDI.
- Roland VSC, definitely sounds different than BASSMIDI (no echo effect). Clean but maybe a little weak on the bass.
(turn up volume on high to hear difference with all 3)

Question:
mkII starts at reverb 40. When a GM reset is sent, does it zap the SC-55 reverb to 0? Or is it totally something to do with the patch + soundfont?

Does anyone know more why I'm hearing this difference? Thanks!

Did some testing.
- CoolSoft is setting reverb to 0 on a GM reset. BASSMIDI uses the default value (40). So that's where the extra echo comes from. Forcing CoolSoft to use 40 reverb makes it the same as BASSMIDI.

- At reverb 0, patch93 soundfont has this strange climbing / falling echo effect on Metal Pad. Does not happen at reverb 40 but too much echo. Soundfont has some basic values for reverb - instrument + preset.

Someone mentioned the sf 2.01 spec says:
reverb = clamp (I + P + C)

I = instrument %
P = preset %
C = cc91 / 127 * 0.20

I+P = min reverb. Some of the presets are at 40%. Metal Pad preset = 40% reverb, 40% chorus min (instrument = 0). Removing the preset values gets rid of the mountain echo effect on Metal Pad. And gets closer to the youtube sc-55 recording.

Guess I'll play around with the sf2.

Personally I've settled on SGM-V2.01 as a decent all-around General MIDI soundfont. I'll give patch93 a chance, though. I've got yet another SC-55 soundfont named "Roland SC-55 v1.1.sf2" in addition to the Scc1t2.sf2 one that someone mentioned in the ZDoom thread.

SGM-V2.01 is nice and smooth. I'd use it for regular MIDI stuff - still feel picky and incorrigible and prefer imitation samples of sc-55 stuff for gaming. They have that texture I can't find elsewhere.

But I just can't get over the reverb bath of Patch93 even though I like it when it works. Roland SC-55 v1.1.sf2 looks similar to scc1t2 but the latter has some improved sfx i.t. They're not bad at all, just needs some more default reverb presets maybe.

Played around with the Roland VSC some more. The Doom1 Metal Pad 'climb / drop echo' does happen here too when reverb is 0. But I noticed when all the channels are set to reverb 0 (ala CoolSoft), it's extremely dry. Reverb 40 sounds much closer to the yt recording.

CoolSoft also missed MIDI off notes (hangs), reverb changes (boops) and other strange mixing events. So other than the GUI instrument mixer, that's off my list now.

I think I've narrowed it down partly to the reverb models as to why I can't get that 'grittiness' I want. The real unit has this 'violence' that makes it unpredictable and less boring for me than the softsynths.

Settling on Roland VSC for now again - has the right volume balance and the samples are acceptable. Using default chorus ~15-20 helps too with the fullness I'm missing.

Thanks for the SGM sf2 though - like that also.