Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby oeuvre » 2019-4-13 @ 12:51

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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby Carlos S. M. » 2019-4-14 @ 21:30

Keep in mind the "Ryzen Windows 98 attempt" Kugee (the youtube who did that video) did was only an experiment and was never meant to be a serious project, he was aware of many of the limitations of Windows 9x in such modern system and he tried to counter some issues with workarounds, but still didn't run that well considering DOS Disk Access kills a LOT of perfomance, especially in newer CPUs.

He currently uses Windows 7 on his Ryzen PC and mentioned 7 ran much better on his Ryzen than 98 ever did
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby chinny22 » 2019-4-17 @ 09:54

Ok the subject is a bit out of date now but seems to be a bit of confusion. We have moved on from a Ryzen system all together.
OP is now building a win9x box using a P3 with no AGP (hence the GF FX PCI)

Tanman9990 Maybe create another post with the P3 build if you have any more questions, feel free to put a link in this thread though.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby buckeye » 2019-4-17 @ 16:41

oeuvre wrote:just cause you can doesn't mean you should...


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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby Baoran » 2019-4-26 @ 20:21

I generally don't consider a computer being win98 computer unless all devices in the pc have win9x drivers installed and working in win98.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby Orkay » 2019-4-30 @ 00:34

I'm a bit late to this thread, but as the creator of the latter video mentioned in the OP, I may as well address some of the things that were discussed here:

Admittedly, I didn't know much about support for native PCI Express devices in Windows 98, as I've never been interested in a lot of hardware from beyond 2001. As someone pointed out, my hasty assertion that the Radeon X300 was "one of the few" PCI Express cards supported here is wrong, and I apologize for that mistake. The only reason why I used a Radeon X300 is because that's all I had handy. The display output on my RX560 glitches out in Windows 98, not that it should be of any surprise.

As for where I installed Windows 98, it was neither an IDE nor a SATA drive; I just popped it onto a 32GB USB flash drive. It was pretty nice to not have it interfere with my existing Windows 7 installation at all, but I'd imagine the best possible way to avoid a lot of the extreme slowdowns Windows 98 suffers from on a Ryzen computer would be to plug a compatible IDE/SCSI controller into a PCIe adapter. I've yet to try this myself, and I don't feel like opening up my primary workstation just to follow up on this stunt right now. I did try using an Ultra320 PCIe controller well before I got my adapter, and while that worked, it was only to the same extent as the USB drive - I couldn't install any real drivers for it.

Regarding the point about power management, it's not that it crashes if it tries to sleep or anything, it's that it simply cannot recognize any power management features of my computer at all, which thereby leaves them disabled. That is, except for the monitor sleep timeout; that works as expected. I can guess that my computer has done away with APM functions entirely, as well as earlier revisions of ACPI. Windows 98 is partially aware of my computer's ACPI firmware, but only to the extent where it attempts to load a failsafe ACPI driver that still can't use any power management functions.

The worst thing about running Windows 98 on the setup I used is that the system would frequently freeze in brief intervals, possibly due to virtual memory swapping. The one thing I wanted to do most at that point was get the filming all done and over with so I could go back to using a normal computer and have that perfect stunt video I desperately wanted ready to get out there and outrank all of my other videos (it was going well for a while, but fell flat upon reaching #3).

To say the least, no, a Ryzen is not ideal at all for installing Windows 98... but hey, we deal with obsolete hardware and software here, so all the naysaying is just a nuisance. With a few more Asmedia 1083 PCIe to PCI adapters and the usual selection of 98-compatible PCI cards, you could run a much faster Ryzen-based Windows 98 computer, or even one running Windows 3.1. I've considered getting more PCIe adapters so I can install Windows NT 4.0 on a Ryzen with a more full-fledged configuration, but that will have to wait for another day. I'd need some kind of horizontal open chassis, and even then, I don't trust the adapters will handle the weight of larger PCI cards all that well. Plus, those Molex power wires hanging there... I'm worried about them breaking off.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby canthearu » 2019-4-30 @ 02:23

Hmmm, USB boot drive running windows using INT 13 real mode drivers would definitely kill performance and add to stuttering, along with generally anaemic performance of most USB drives under random workloads. Would probably work a lot better just using a small SATA hard drive and INT 13 real mode drivers.
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Power Managerment - It is cool it never crashed for you. When I was trying WIndows 98 on a PCIe nForce Athlon X2 system, I got crashes whenever power management tried to kick in.

Heh, I use the corner of my desk as a test bench, hang the PCI/PCIe/ISA cards off the edge of the desk and monitor behind. Sit on a towel to minimise desk scratches. Doesn't get more ghetto then that.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-5-01 @ 07:50

An FX5500 is equivalent to what AGP Geforce card ?
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby agent_x007 » 2019-5-01 @ 19:14

infiniteclouds wrote:An FX5500 is equivalent to what AGP Geforce card ?
GF 6200 in DX9.
It can do a good bit better if DX7/8 is needed (since it should have 128-bit bus vs. 64-bit on 6200).
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-5-02 @ 05:35

agent_x007 wrote:
infiniteclouds wrote:An FX5500 is equivalent to what AGP Geforce card ?
GF 6200 in DX9.
It can do a good bit better if DX7/8 is needed (since it should have 128-bit bus vs. 64-bit on 6200).


Not familiar with the 6200 AGP. I imagine the FX5500 is slower than any of the AGP FX cards (up to 5900) ... is it faster than say Geforce 3s or G4 ti series?
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby Carlos S. M. » 2019-5-02 @ 07:39

infiniteclouds wrote:
agent_x007 wrote:
infiniteclouds wrote:An FX5500 is equivalent to what AGP Geforce card ?
GF 6200 in DX9.
It can do a good bit better if DX7/8 is needed (since it should have 128-bit bus vs. 64-bit on 6200).


Not familiar with the 6200 AGP. I imagine the FX5500 is slower than any of the AGP FX cards (up to 5900) ... is it faster than say Geforce 3s or G4 ti series?


Most AGP 6200s are 64 bit generally, i'd say in many cases a 9250 128 bit, a 3ti or any of the 4 tis should be able to outperform it, i don't know about the 128 bit 6200, such variant existed which is generally a cut down 6600, also the original 128 bit NV43 model is the least common 6200 variant, notably the AGP version of it (most 6200s are ethier the NV44A based AGP model which is 64 bit only or the Turbocache variant for PCI-e).

Edit: from what i heard, Geforce 4 Ti 4200 crushes FX 5200/5500 in DX7/DX8, maybe can catch 5600 or even 5700 series, Geforce 3 is probably faster than a FX 5500 too, i do know the Radeon 9000/9200/9250 cards (128 bit variants of course) could rival and/or outperform the FX 5200/5500 in DX7/DX8 games
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-5-02 @ 18:59

Carlos S. M. wrote:
Edit: from what i heard, Geforce 4 Ti 4200 crushes FX 5200/5500 in DX7/DX8, maybe can catch 5600 or even 5700 series, Geforce 3 is probably faster than a FX 5500 too, i do know the Radeon 9000/9200/9250 cards (128 bit variants of course) could rival and/or outperform the FX 5200/5500 in DX7/DX8 games


Oof.. if an PCI FX5500 is more like a Geforce 2 then a W98 system without AGP sounds out of the question for me. Particularly pointless if you're using a post-AGP era CPU. What good is all that CPU power if you're heavily bottlenecked by the GPU.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby Ozzuneoj » 2019-5-05 @ 04:14

Dumb question, but what about a PCI-E GeForce FX series or a Quadro equivalent?
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby infiniteclouds » 2019-5-05 @ 08:22

The Win98 support would be pretty bad
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby agent_x007 » 2019-5-07 @ 14:01

Can't you just force PCX 5900 driver on Quadro FX 1300 under Win98 ?
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby HYRO » 2019-10-06 @ 09:11

I'd go with this parts for best comatibility and best parts:
- CPU - Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4GHz with Lin-Lin adapter
- Motherboard - Slot1 Asus P3B-F or Socket 370 Abit BX133- RAID
- RAM - Micron 143MHz or better of your choice
- Graphics card - Nvidia Geforce FX5950 Ultra
- Sound card - Creative Sound Blaster AWE64 GOLD
- HDD Controller - ULTRA133 TX2 EIDE Ultra ATA-133PCI
- HDD - IDE SSD or any standard UDMA133 HDD of your choice

- USB2.0 - NEC PCI USB 2.0 card
- Video accelerator - 3DFX Voodoo 1 if playing old games or Voodoo 3 3000 PCI SGRAM if used mostly in Windows.

That sould be enough I think.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby Orkay » 2019-10-06 @ 13:53

HYRO wrote:I'd go with this parts for best comatibility and best parts:
- CPU - Pentium III-S Tualatin 1.4GHz with Lin-Lin adapter
- Motherboard - Slot1 Asus P3B-F or Socket 370 Abit BX133- RAID
- RAM - Micron 143MHz or better of your choice


I tried using a 1.4GHz Pentium III on my P3B-F with a PowerLeap adapter, PC133 SDRAM, and PCI cards only, but it wasn't able to handle a 133MHz FSB in the long run. Popped a 1.4GHz Tualeron in there with a 100MHz FSB and it's dandy again, but I'm not sure if I'm missing something regarding the 133MHz overclock.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby HYRO » 2019-10-09 @ 16:39

From what I know, if You will change the FSB, you will also change it on AGP and PCI bus, not every card will handle higher FSB.
Try lower the RAM memory clocks it helps sometimes.
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Re: Ryzen 7 most powerful windows 98 computer?

Postby mothergoose729 » 2019-10-09 @ 17:18

Ozzuneoj wrote:Dumb question, but what about a PCI-E GeForce FX series or a Quadro equivalent?


The FX 1300 has official win 98 drivers. I know of two users who have tried it. One had a decent amount of success, the other couldn't get hardly anything to work. I think it probably comes down to how the motherboard chipsets handles PCIE-AGP bridging. Something like a socket 478 with PCIE is more likely to work than a more modern socket.

Speaking in general, of all the platforms I have tried under windows 98, my socket 478 board has been by far the most stable and best supported. My Asus 865PE chipset has SATA, gigabit LAN, USB 2.0 ect and it cost me next to nothing on ebay. Almost completely painless, even better than my slot 1 boards in that way.
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