VOGONS


Reply 800 of 907, by Paul_V

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I've not been tinkering with Vortex for a while now (practically gave up on trying to slow this SoC down to a 286 level PC),
yet I've stumbled upon something I think might be of interest:

Several old Microsoft KB articles mention problematic or incompatible controllers, which cause Code10 errors on win98\me, such as:
https://www.betaarchive.com/wiki/index.php/Mi … IDE_Controllers

Googling one of the aforementioned controller from KB, I managed to extract the following article from cache:

Spoiler

Article ID : 282881
This article was previously published under Q282881

IMPORTANT: This article contains information about modifying the registry. Before you modify the registry, make sure to back it up and make sure that you understand how to restore the registry if a problem occurs.

SYMPTOMS
When you dock a laptop in an ICH2-M I/O Controller Hub, when you view the device in Device Manager, a yellow exclamation point may be displayed on the IDE controller (and possibly the network adapter). When you view the properties of the device, the following message is displayed:
This device is either not present, not working properly, or does not have all the drivers installed. (Code 10)

CAUSE
The ICH2-M I/O Controller Hub is a new device and it not directly supported by Windows 98 or Windows Millennium Edition (Me). Therefore, the device is detected incorrectly.

ICH2-M is a multi-function controller which includes a PCI-PCI bridge. The PCI-PCI bridge is incorrectly detected as a positive decode bridge. However, this bridge has the functionality of a subtractive decode bridge. A subtractive bridge passes unclaimed input/output (I/O) and memory cycles to the devices behind it, but a positive bridge does not.

RESOLUTION
WARNING: If you use Registry Editor incorrectly, you may cause serious problems that may require you to reinstall your operating system. Microsoft cannot guarantee that you can solve problems that result from using Registry Editor incorrectly. Use Registry Editor at your own risk.

To override the detection of the PCI bridge as positive bridge, follow these steps:

1. Start Registry Editor (Regedit.exe).
2. Locate and click the following key in the registry:
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\VxD\PCI
3. On the Edit menu, click Add Value, and then add the following registry value:
Value Name: 24488086
Data Type: Binary
Value: 00 00 04 00
4. Quit Registry Editor.

MORE INFORMATION
ICH2-M has multiple devices and functions. It contains a PCI-PCI bridge, a PCI-IDE controller, a USB controller and an LPC (similar to an ISA) bridge. The ICH2-M PCI-PCI bridge behaves like a subtractive decode bridge. It passes through all the cycles that are not claimed by the PCI-IDE or USB controllers. Although it behaves like a subtractive decode bridge, software detects it as a positive decode bridge. This behavior occurs because the ICH2M PCI-PCI bridge supports the I/O window and memory window registers in its PCI configuration space (which retains the values written by software).

Spoiler

Intel 82371AB/EB PCI Bus Master IDE win98 .reg file fix:
----
REGEDIT4

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\VxD\PCI]
"71118086"=hex:0C,00,00,00
----

Something similar to mask conflicting features of the bridge may be required for Vortex also.

Reply 801 of 907, by Paul_V

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I asked a colleague at work to install WIN98 to an SD card on ebox-3330, which has a Vortex86DX2 onboard.
Works out of the box with "Legacy IDE" and SD card options enabled.

Then I was sent a backup of it's BIOS, removed original VGA ROM (DX2 has it's own integrated VGA) and inserted Volari ROM instead.
Flashed it to my Vorted86DX board and got the same Code10 issue.

Which rose more questions than answers...

I have a suspicion that unused slave device pins on primary IDE channel may need to be disabled\shunted manually.
But I cannot compare the circuitry, since I don't own ebox-3330 or similar DX2 based board with SD slot.

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Last edited by Paul_V on 2023-05-02, 19:04. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 802 of 907, by Duffman

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@Paul_V

That screenshot shows that it's at least possible to get Win98 to work properly with an SD card.
I'm just hoping I can achieve something similar like that with just a registry hack or something.

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 803 of 907, by Duffman

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@Paul_V

Do you know of any documentation out there on what all these PCI binary values mean?

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 804 of 907, by Paul_V

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Duffman wrote on 2023-05-06, 06:32:

@Paul_V

Do you know of any documentation out there on what all these PCI binary values mean?

I'm not sure I undertood correctly what you mean.
Feel free to PM me, so we don't flood the topic.

Reply 805 of 907, by Duffman

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I went looking through IOS.VXD using IDA Pro disassembler and found something that might be useful for us.
There is a 'ForcePMIO' binary registry key that could solve our problem. There is an inverse 'ForceRMIO' key as well that isn't useful for us, but to check it worked in a VM when I tested it though.

From what I gather, the key belongs in

HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\FileSystem

and set to 1 if we want to use it.

I've given it a try and my initial impression feels like it's running snappier, but I need a tool that works in win98 to actually check if it's doing anything.

Any suggestions?

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 806 of 907, by Mu0n

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I tried adding that binary key, value 01, had to create the key since it wasn't present.

Tried copying a multi-gig file through a network shared (on my weeCee win98se, sent from modern win10 machine) and the same behavior happens. Goes up to 1MB/s for a sec or two, throttles back down to 0 for several seconds, rinse repeat.

see attached image to see if I messed up the binary key in the registry.
I haven't followed the discussions in the last 10 pages much, I assume we're still talking about the weeCee and not another variant of Vortex86 SOM?

Attachments

1Bit Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9YYXWX1SxBhh1YB-feIPPw
DOS Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUn0Dp6PM8DBTF-5g0nvcw

Reply 807 of 907, by Duffman

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I figured it wasn't actually working, but I don't have anything installed to measure if it was making a difference.
I'll have a look through IOS.VXD again, maybe there's a way to force ESDI_506.PDR to initialize hidden in there.

What tool are you using to measure MB/s?

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 808 of 907, by Mu0n

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Duffman wrote on 2023-05-18, 00:40:

What tool are you using to measure MB/s?

Windows 10 file copying dialog and my experience and memory about previous times when I copied large files.

1Bit Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9YYXWX1SxBhh1YB-feIPPw
DOS Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUn0Dp6PM8DBTF-5g0nvcw

Reply 809 of 907, by Duffman

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I found some documentation on WIN98/ME IOS

https://www.scribd.com/document/56093391/IOS-Guide#

edit : PDF

https://web.archive.org/web/20200427173941/ht … 09/56093391.pdf

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 810 of 907, by Duffman

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@rasteri @Nachtrave @Muon @Paul_V

So I did some hacks to rloew's IOS.VXD and ESDI_506.PDR and I've gotten rid of the yellow exclamation mark in device manager.

20230519_180956_WEECEE_no_yellow_exclamation.jpg
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Still not sure if these hacked files are actually working though, can you guys do some testing to check?

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  • Filename
    TBPLUS_WEECEE.zip
    File size
    338.46 KiB
    Downloads
    86 downloads
    File license
    Public domain

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 811 of 907, by Mu0n

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Duffman wrote on 2023-05-19, 10:26:
@rasteri @Nachtrave @Muon @Paul_V […]
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@rasteri @Nachtrave @Muon @Paul_V

So I did some hacks to rloew's IOS.VXD and ESDI_506.PDR and I've gotten rid of the yellow exclamation mark in device manager.

20230519_180956_WEECEE_no_yellow_exclamation.jpg

Still not sure if these hacked files are actually working though, can you guys do some testing to check?

Would you kindly offer instructions in how to use the files? I may have had the wrong assumptions.

I see:
-install.bat
-installd.bat
-installw.bat
-patchpci.exe

I assumed I had to use installw.bat but I got:
"TBPLUS WINDOWS PATCHES ALREADY APPLIED - RUN UNINSTW TO REMOVE"

which is strange, because I've only run it that one time just now.

I then ran uninst
then ran install c:\windows
then rebooted

I no longer have the exclamation point in hard disk devices

testing a large 1 GB file transfer still does the slowdown thing. After a good 4 minutes of leaving it to oscillate, it estimates the total transfer at 30 mins, which is insanely long for this - so same behavior as before, sadly.

Attachments

1Bit Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9YYXWX1SxBhh1YB-feIPPw
DOS Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUn0Dp6PM8DBTF-5g0nvcw

Reply 812 of 907, by Duffman

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rloew wrote a readme.txt that explains it all.

-install.bat - install both drivers.
-installd.bat - install DOS drivers only.
-installw.bat - install windows drivers only.
-patchpci.exe - PCI.VXD patch for VIA controllers.

OK, now I know this hack doesn't actually work, thanks for testing.
Since it's broken you can uninstall.

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 813 of 907, by Duffman

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Success with the NT4 SP6 atapi driver?

20230520_202135.jpg
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20230520_202113.jpg
Filename
20230520_202113.jpg
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Strangely it's feeling slower than the real mode driver, I sould do a fresh 98SE install in case I've broken it.

NT4 SP6 atapi driver attached.
To install place ATAPI.MPD into C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM\IOSUBSYS

Then with regedit search for any occurrence of ESDI_506.PDR and replace it with ATAPI.MPD and then restart.

Attachments

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 814 of 907, by Mu0n

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ok, I tried it and eesh, I confirm it feels very slow.

The whole boot and login process feels much slower.
Copying files over the network from a modern PC takes ages before a speed is shown and it's up to around 177k/s instead of the usual 1000k/s peaks I got from before. To top it off, I think it still throttles down and halts for a few seconds at a time, just like before!

once the whole transfer time estimation shows up, it's 4 hours instead of 30 mins!

wild bonus: I also get a D: that's a direct copy of my C:, same files, capacity, everything.....

1Bit Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9YYXWX1SxBhh1YB-feIPPw
DOS Fever Dreams: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIUn0Dp6PM8DBTF-5g0nvcw

Reply 815 of 907, by Duffman

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Since the nt4 sp6 ATAPI driver seems to get some results, I'm going to have another go at porting the XP ATAPI driver.

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 816 of 907, by Windows98_guy

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Can someone please confirm the list of parts for the WeeCee board revision 0.3 (the original from Rasteri that you can get from PCBWay)?

I like to confirm i have all the correct parts before moving on with troubleshooting my WeeCee.

I've attached the picture of the parts lists i downloaded from PCBWay - i only added a few comments, where needed.

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Reply 817 of 907, by Duffman

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I think you're all good.
You can always ask here if you run into trouble with it.

MB: ASRock B550 Steel Legend
CPU: Ryzen 9 5950X
RAM: Corsair 64GB Kit (4x16GB) DDR4 Veng LPX C18 4000MHz
SSDs: 2x Crucial MX500 1TB SATA + 1x Samsung 980 (non-pro) 1TB NVMe SSD
OSs: Win 11 Pro (NVMe) + WinXP Pro SP3 (SATA)
GPU: RTX2070 (11) GT730 (XP)

Reply 818 of 907, by Vridek

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Windows98_guy wrote on 2023-06-03, 09:15:

Can someone please confirm the list of parts for the WeeCee board revision 0.3 (the original from Rasteri that you can get from PCBWay)?

I like to confirm i have all the correct parts before moving on with troubleshooting my WeeCee.

I've attached the picture of the parts lists i downloaded from PCBWay - i only added a few comments, where needed.

So use CS4237B-KQ instead of CS4237B-JQ. Do not use 24LC04BT/SN EEPROM... I'm having a problem with it and it says on flash that it has insufficient memory (4kB is probably not enough). Before that 24LC16B/SN was used. What do you want to help with at WeeCee?

Reply 819 of 907, by Windows98_guy

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Vridek wrote on 2023-06-04, 17:53:
Windows98_guy wrote on 2023-06-03, 09:15:

Can someone please confirm the list of parts for the WeeCee board revision 0.3 (the original from Rasteri that you can get from PCBWay)?

I like to confirm i have all the correct parts before moving on with troubleshooting my WeeCee.

I've attached the picture of the parts lists i downloaded from PCBWay - i only added a few comments, where needed.

So use CS4237B-KQ instead of CS4237B-JQ. Do not use 24LC04BT/SN EEPROM... I'm having a problem with it and it says on flash that it has insufficient memory (4kB is probably not enough). Before that 24LC16B/SN was used. What do you want to help with at WeeCee?

Ok, so I checked the sound chip - it is a CS4237B-KQ, so that's fine, I guess the list is incorrect and I didn't even noticed it. I used 24LC16B/SN for EEPROM, not 24LC04BT/SN.

The biggest problem that I have at the moment is that my WeeCee doesn't detect any microSD cards. Adjusting the boot options in the BIOS to "boot from SD card" doesn't seem to work. I'm guessing I didn't solder it properly, but I already tried to reflow solder on it twice. Maybe I didn't properly solder the pins of the SOM304 module?