tomb raider...again

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tomb raider...again

Postby gronk » 2003-5-01 @ 17:46

I know this has been beaten, but with tr aod coming out soon i've got the itch to play tr. yes, i have win xp, 9500 radeon and an audigy card.
i've got vdm sound and glidos but i have not loaded them yet. i've loaded tr but after completing the installation the program acts like it's going play the intro movie, but nothing happens just a black screen. Is this normal? If I load the vdm program will this take care of the start problem?
I'm under the impression I should be able to run tr without either vdm and glidos, but i just get the black screen.
i hit alt and the desktop is all lines, but i can shut down from the start button no problem. when I start up again, desktop is cool, but if i try to run the game, just a black screen.
I wish I was smarter with tech stuff! TR4 runs great! But i really want to revisit TR!
Thanks for you help!
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Re: tomb raider...again

Postby Nicht Sehr Gut » 2003-5-01 @ 22:54

Originally posted by gronk [B] i've loaded tr but after completing the installation the program acts like it's going play the intro movie, but nothing happens just a black screen. Is this normal?
Hard to tell from your description. Is this the basic Tomb Raider install? The basic Tomb Raider install using VDMSound? ...or Tomb Raider with GliDOS using the Voodoo Rush executable?

When in doubt, start with a basic TR install with no sound. Confirm that it starts up and runs properly (access menu and start the game, etc...). Quit, then run the setup program with VDMSound and save the settings. Start the game with VDMSound and confirm normal operation again. If everything still works properly, replace the TOMB.EXE with the Voodoo Rush executable as advised in the documentation.

If it still gives you black blank screens, it might be video card related as VESA support in XP is poor compared to Win9x.
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-02 @ 08:29

That's good advice: set it up with no audio as an initial test.

But when you do try with audio, it is madness to do so without VDMSound. Also it takes some of the uncertainty out of installing TR if you use the installer wizard from the Glidos site.

With an ATI card, you may be forced to use Glidos, because of the VESA problems.
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Postby gronk » 2003-5-02 @ 14:11

Thanks for your replies.
I'm just trying the basic install, without vdm and glidos at this point. It starts up and I get the menu. I set up sound using the manual select of 'soundblaster' 220, 1, 7 then click 'complete install' and installation completes and then i get black screen. No game. And it stays that way.
Sounds like maybe i'll only get it to run with vdm and glidos?
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Postby Nicht Sehr Gut » 2003-5-02 @ 14:12

Originally posted by Glidos [B]But when you do try with audio, it is madness to do so without VDMSound.
Well I wasn't saying that, but I wouldn't call it madness. There's always the possibility of digital audio working in native XP, but not working with VDMSound (rare, but it happens...).

Occasionally something may interfere with VDMSound that will still allow native XP audio (although most I have heard of will break both audio systems...).
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Postby gronk » 2003-5-02 @ 14:25

So, since i'm a shade on the dork side, you are saying that i'm going to need vdm installed to get tr to run with regular graphics?
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-02 @ 15:04

I'm saying the best bet for normal graphics is with VDMSound. Nicht is saying something slightly different, and he may well be right.

I don't ever try stuff without VDMSound on XP and 2000, but then I know my audio drivers wont handle legacy. Yours might as Nicht says.
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Postby gronk » 2003-5-02 @ 15:29

i wouldn't know how to find out if my audigy card handles legacy...i'm assuming since i don't get the game to run that whatever it's doing ain't working.
i'm going to try it with vdm...hopefully nothing melts.
Thanks for your help.
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Postby Nicht Sehr Gut » 2003-5-02 @ 15:49

Originally posted by gronk [B]So, since i'm a shade on the dork side, you are saying that i'm going to need vdm installed to get tr to run with regular graphics?
What I'm saying is start over. Start with a basic install, using NO SOUND. Confirm that you can get the game working first. Don't presume that everything works. One you have the game working without audio, then try configuring it and running it with VDMSound. If that works, THEN try it with GliDOS.

When you are running it with GliDOS in XP, you are actually running:

1) Tomb Raider
2) VDMSound
3) GliDOS

So if something is wrong, it could be any one of those three OR any combination of those three that may have a problem.

IOW, the problem could be:

1) Just a Tomb Raider problem
2) Just a VDMSound problem
3) Just a GliDOS problem
4) A Tomb Raider + VDMSound problem
5) A VDMSound + GliDOS problem
6) A Tomb Raider + GliDOS problem
7) A Tomb Raider + VDMSound + GliDOS problem

And this is without even considering that the OS may be part of the problem. See how it can get messy very quickly?

By taking it one step at a time, you reduce the number of possible troublemakers. So if (for example) you install Tomb Raider without sound into XP and you can't get it to work properly, the problem is either with your "Tomb Raider", or XP, or due to the combination of these two. You automatically know it's nothing to do with GliDOS or VDMSound because you were not using them.

[Off-Topic Rant ON] <NOT referring to you gronk>
This is what drives me crazy. People who just click on something, it doesn't work, then they immediately presume they know why:
I remember DOOM sounded cool.... Installed DOOM in XP... Used VDMSound with it... Played and sounded terrible... Conclusion: VDMSound sucks and it's obviously part of a hoax designed to lure in innocent PC users and use them unwittingly as beta-testers
[Off-Topic Rant OFF]
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Postby gronk » 2003-5-02 @ 16:49

cool, i follow. i'll do a clean reinstall and select no sound and see if the game runs. if it does, i'll go from there.
i really appreciate the help...
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-02 @ 17:56

Nicht Sehr Gut wrote:[Off-Topic Rant ON] <NOT referring to you gronk>
This is what drives me crazy. People who just click on something, it doesn't work, then they immediately presume they know why: [Off-Topic Rant OFF]

I don't know. Computers just seem to excel at throwing people off the sent when they fail. I think its just because you've been at it so long (and bitten so many times) that you can keep your mind open and solve these problems.
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Postby Snover » 2003-5-02 @ 18:07

Nicht Sehr Gut wrote:This is what drives me crazy. People who just click on something, it doesn't work, then they immediately presume they know why...
AH, good times.
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Postby Nicht Sehr Gut » 2003-5-02 @ 21:37

Originally posted by Glidos [B]I don't know. Computers just seem to excel at throwing people off the scent when they fail.
Paul, that's not the problem. "I don't know"=not a problem, "I think I know"=not a problem, "I have no idea"=not a problem, "I know it's this, and it's all your fault, you suck, you owe me, tell me how to fix this, and whatever you say better agree with what I think it is"=Problem.

It's like some guy who gets stomach pains, declares that it's his appendix because he can tell, then demands that the Doctor take it out without an examination. It's only a few people that do this, but most people do start with certain presumptions.

Since XP was released, the public is getting it's first real taste of the NT OS, and their perceptions are already colored by their experience with Win9x. We really need a "Welcome to NT/2000/XP" guide, and the very first chapter needs to be: "This is NOT Win9x", and the second chapter needs to be
"D.O.S.--R.I.P.",...

You know what I mean...
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-03 @ 14:03

Nicht Sehr Gut wrote:Paul, that's not the problem. "I don't know"=not a problem, "I think I know"=not a problem, "I have no idea"=not a problem, "I know it's this, and it's all your fault, you suck, you owe me, tell me how to fix this, and whatever you say better agree with what I think it is"=Problem.


I'm with you there. You come across one of these recently?
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Postby gronk » 2003-5-05 @ 17:11

i just wanted to say thanks again for the help. i was able to get tomb raider going with 'no sound card' selected. i then installed vdm sound, changed the sound selection to 'soundblaster' 220 1 7 and sound! i'll be able to play this game with sound for the first time! very cool.
maybe i'll try the glidos...
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-05 @ 22:34

Great! Glad your problem is solved.
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Postby Nicht Sehr Gut » 2003-5-06 @ 00:23

Originally posted by Glidos [B]I'm with you there. You come across one of these recently?
No, but those that do usually start with a similar problem, and won't go back to the beginning to look for the problem. They presume that you are trying to "trick" them because you don't have an answer. When the reality is that trying to troubleshoot without actual access to their PC is difficult, especially when the user makes presumptions about the problem.

Fortunately, Gronk was willing to go through the steps to fix the problem instead of arguing with us (having said that, it would’ve been nice to know what was done differently so that it worked this time...).

I just don't want to see another HomerJ situation. I might've actually been able to help him, had I found my "Realm of the Haunting" CD's before he went crazy on us. Instead; frustration, lack of answers, and heavy dose of paranoia caused him to post one of the most bizarre "explanation" for his problems that I've ever seen.

Actually, I think it was because someone recently used the "Calvin" icon, which I hadn't seen since the HomerJ "incident".
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-06 @ 07:57

There's another annoying one,which goes something like this:

User> I have this really nasty problem with Glidos. Please help.

Me> It could be such and such. Here's a specially hacked version of something or other, which might help fault find the problem.

User> Thanks! Great! That works.

Me> Good. Now I need to work out how to do it properly. And I'll need some help. Can you try doing another experiment?

User> As I said, it works now. Problem solved.

Me> But that was only a hack. I need to do it properly.

Me> Hello! Anybody out there?...

Me> Hello
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Postby Glidos » 2003-5-06 @ 08:01

... and then years later:


Same User> You remember that problem I had ages ago. Well, when I upgraded to v1.100001 of Glidos, the problem came back. How come you haven't fixed such an old problem? I had to upgrade because I needed the new Windows 3000 fix, but v1.100001 doesn't work for me.
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Postby Kaminari » 2003-5-06 @ 09:41

It's fortunate that I like to experiment ;)
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