Yeah, back then I didn't really care. If the game had a Tandy,CGA,EGA,VGA option then yeah I'd pick the one with the most colors but if the game didn't have an obvious way to switch color modes I would just assume that that's how the game was meant to be played and I wouldn't give it a second thought. Nowadays with the games being cheap and/or practically free and the wonderful documentation of the Internet we have the ability to research much more effectively and find the "best" version of a particular game.

I should really update that old thread of mine to reflect the true facts. Not many Ultima fans played the PC ports back in the day, they only became more widespread as the PC began to dominate and its competitor platforms became obselete.

If Origin did not really want to support composite color graphics, they would have completely filled in the serrated tiles, including the border, paved stones and hit/spell and water tiles. That would have looked better in RGB CGA, but probably not so good in composite CGA.

Great Hierophant wrote:

I also notice that the issue with King's Quest in Tandy mode (text on the opening scroll being serrated) has been fixed. Good work.

That's right. Another thing that was fixed was the SQ3 hangup when it's set to use the Tandy DAC, but did they just fix the hangup, and it's now like in MESS, or DOSBox actually supports the Tandy DAC now and Roger can be heard in the intro? I also saw that Tandy support when machine is not set to Tandy was added, does that mean the AGI games will only produce Tandy sounds, and will never produce PC speaker sounds?! (I would've checked but my last compiled CVS is from November 2)
One Tandy related issue that wasn't fixed is the aspect ratio of the old versions of Zak and Maniac. That's a shame.

I have two off-topic questions about Sierra, I hope they can be answered:
1. If Space Quest 4 is loaded by runing SCIDHUV.EXE without the -N switch, the maximum score becomes 340, instead of the real maximum score which is 315. Does anyone know about it and can explain it?
2. Which Sierra CD-ROM games have a manual-check type of copy protection? I know of KQ6, Freddy Pharkas and QFG4, but recently I learned that SQ6 also have some sort of a manual-check copy protection, so I think there may be more I don't know of.

SQ6 doesn't have a manual copy protection. You do need it to be able to solve the homing beacon puzzle, but that wasn't intended to be a copy protection measure.

Edit: Oh wait, it does. I forgot about the periodic table of elements thing.

IIRC, KQ5 had manual check. At some point you need to push a boat to water, that triggers it. Not sure if it was floppy or CD version though.

SirGraham wrote:

(SQ4 SCIDHUV -N) Does anyone know about it and can explain it?

The -N switch makes the interpreter look for SCRIPT.%03d-style file names instead of the default %u.scr-style file names. Thanks to the switch, the interpreter finds the SCRIPT.000 files, which contains the 315 max score. Without the switch, the game looks for a 0.scr file, doesn't find it and thus uses the old file from within the RESOURCE.000 file, which has the incorrect 340 max score. This is why running the interpreter with the -N option is required; the batch files included on the original disks do that.

By the way, on the other board you wondered about the road color in "Adventure in Serenia". Servo recently made screenshots of that game. Top picture is Servo's screenshot, bottom picture is what my algorithm currently produces.

vasyl wrote:

IIRC, KQ5 had manual check

KQ5's documentation check is only present in the floppy version.

Hey NRS, just out of curiosity: in what emulator have you implemented your algorithm? Or are you just processing screenshots?

HunterZ wrote:

Or are you just processing screenshots?

Yes.

To all who may point at the text colors, Servo is using a Tandy 1000, not an IBM PC, and the font is different enough to produce different fringing colors.

I note that Servo's picture, between the borders, is of a screen resolution of 560x400. Judging by Servo's screenshot, the CGA is cutting off every eighth pixel or inserting an "in between color" pixel in between every two sets of three similarly-colored pixels in order to keep the picture underscanned. NRS's screenshots are in a more proper 640x400 ratio.

Great Hierophant wrote:

the CGA is cutting off every eighth pixel or inserting an "in between color" pixel in between every two sets of three similarly-colored pixels in order to keep the picture underscanned.

That's not the CGA but Servo's TV capture card which does this. Professional digital TV equipment stores an NTSC picture at a resolution of 720x480. Had Servo used that as a capture resolution, the CGA's usable image would span 640 pixels.

> Another thing that was fixed was the SQ3 hangup when it's set to use
> the Tandy DAC, but did they just fix the hangup, and it's now like in
> MESS, or DOSBox actually supports the Tandy DAC now and Roger
> can be heard in the intro?

Never heard any roger, but Tandy DAC should work (uses the soundblaster).

> I also saw that Tandy support when machine is not set to Tandy was
> added, does that mean the AGI games will only produce Tandy sounds,
> and will never produce PC speaker sounds?!

It's off by default for machines!=tandy

> That's a shame.

Why?

How do the Tandy 1000s deal with PC Speaker sounds?

On a real TV or color composite monitor, with an output of 640 pixels would the picture still be underscanned or would some of the sides be cutoff? (The aspect ratio of the TV being 4:3.) I would gather that there would be borders on the top and bottom because the TV is showing 480 visible lines and the CGA only outputs 400 lines.

wd wrote:

Why?

Because an incorrect aspect ratio is unseemly to behold.

Great Hierophant wrote:

On a real TV or color composite monitor, with an output of 640 pixels would the picture still be underscanned or would some of the sides be cutoff?

TVs are overscanned, therefore, some parts of the picture get cut off. This is why the CGA underscans the picture, to compensate for that. The Nintendo Entertainment System, on the other hand, has no such compensation; as a result, on most TV sets the top and bottom 8 lines (or even more) are not displayed, leading many emu authors in the old days to incorrectly believe that the NTSC NES doesn't even generate those lines at all.

Kippesoep wrote:

SQ6 doesn't have a manual copy protection. You do need it to be able to solve the homing beacon puzzle, but that wasn't intended to be a copy protection measure.

Edit: Oh wait, it does. I forgot about the periodic table of elements thing.

Well, if the manual is required to solve a puzzle, that's a manual-check copy protection of the "lighter" kind (the "heavier" kind being those annoying random copy protection questions that can usually be found in the beginning of some floppy games). However, I think the developers said that all the puzzles in this game can be solved without the manual, but I don't see how that's possible. Perhaps they just said that to cover up the fact that some copies were shipped without the manuals (like the copy I had, if I remember correctly; I think that's why I used a walkthrough).

NewRisingSun wrote:

The -N switch makes the interpreter look for SCRIPT.%03d-style file names instead of the default %u.scr-style file names. Thanks to the switch, the interpreter finds the SCRIPT.000 files, which contains the 315 max score. Without the switch, the game looks for a 0.scr file, doesn't find it and thus uses the old file from within the RESOURCE.000 file, which has the incorrect 340 max score. This is why running the interpreter with the -N option is required; the batch files included on the original disks do that.

Yes, I usually used the batch files but I was curious. Incidentally, running the game without the switch will cause a crush sooner or later, because the game will look for *.V56 files instead of VIEW.* files.
Is SQ4 the only game that requires this switch? I don't remember any others.

NewRisingSun wrote:

By the way, on the other board you wondered about the road color in "Adventure in Serenia". Servo recently made screenshots of that game. Top picture is Servo's screenshot, bottom picture is what my algorithm currently produces.

Well, in that thread we weren't sure if your algorithm is correct, or MESS's algorithm is correct, because they displayed different colors. Now, since we consider Servo's screenshots to be "the authority", we know that your algorithm is the correct one (did you change the algorithm a little, btw? The road seems much less greener now; since that screenshot is no longer on-line, see here). So, I don't see why it shouldn't be included in the next release of DOSBox, along with the Hue control we talked so much about (I thought Qbix already agreed to add this control, but I haven't seen it in the CVS update list), to make DOSBox the most accurate composite CGA emulator.
By the way, I saw that Servo also posted screenshots from Ulysses, did you check this game with your algorithm as well? I guess it would be the same as Serenia.

Great Hierophant wrote:

To all who may point at the text colors, Servo is using a Tandy 1000, not an IBM PC, and the font is different enough to produce different fringing colors.

I noticed that the red and blue artifacting surrounding the text are switched in the two screenshots, is that what you mean?

wd wrote:

> Another thing that was fixed was the SQ3 hangup when it's set to use > the Tandy DAC, but did they just fix the hangup, and it […]
Show full quote

> Another thing that was fixed was the SQ3 hangup when it's set to use
> the Tandy DAC, but did they just fix the hangup, and it's now like in
> MESS, or DOSBox actually supports the Tandy DAC now and Roger
> can be heard in the intro?

Never heard any roger, but Tandy DAC should work (uses the soundblaster).

Well, Roger had one line of speech in the intro ("Where am I") if you used the Tandy DAC. NewRisingSun said it on this thread a few posts ago (page 9).

wd wrote:

> I also saw that Tandy support when machine is not set to Tandy was > added, does that mean the AGI games will only produce Tan […]
Show full quote

> I also saw that Tandy support when machine is not set to Tandy was
> added, does that mean the AGI games will only produce Tandy sounds,
> and will never produce PC speaker sounds?!

It's off by default for machines!=tandy

I don't understand what you mean.

wd wrote:

> That's a shame.

Why?

Well, it's not really a shame, it's just that other than this small problem DOSBox provides an almost perfect Tandy emulation (at least for the games I'm playing).

SirGraham wrote:

Incidentally, running the game without the switch will cause a crush sooner or later

I wasn't aware of such power.

SirGraham wrote:

So, I don't see why it shouldn't be included in the next release of DOSBox

It's not finished, it requires 16-bit or 24-bit color, and it's too slow; that's why.

SirGraham wrote:

I thought Qbix already agreed to add this control, but I haven't seen it in the CVS update list

Someone from the team wrote me an email telling me he is going to implement it. He wanted to keep that cheap autoguess feature; I'm not sure if I was successful at talking him out of it.

SirGraham wrote:

Great Hierophant wrote:

To all who may point at the text colors, Servo is using a Tandy 1000, not an IBM PC, and the font is different enough to produce different fringing colors.

I noticed that the red and blue artifacting surrounding the text are switched in the two screenshots, is that what you mean?

Yes, that's what he's referring to.

Well, Roger had one line of speech in the intro ("Where am I") if you used the Tandy DAC. NewRisingSun said it on this thread a few posts ago (page 9).

Yes, but I don't believe anyone has confirmed actually hearing it via Tandy DAC yet (although I could be mistaken)

wd wrote:

> I also saw that Tandy support when machine is not set to Tandy was > added, does that mean the AGI games will only produce Tan […]
Show full quote

> I also saw that Tandy support when machine is not set to Tandy was
> added, does that mean the AGI games will only produce Tandy sounds,
> and will never produce PC speaker sounds?!

It's off by default for machines!=tandy

I don't understand what you mean.

He's concerned that if AGI games detect the presence of Tandy sound hardware when DOSBox is not in Tandy mode, there will be no way to experience the IBM PC Speaker sound that those games can output on non-Tandy machines. I don't think anyone has addressed this question yet.

HunterZ wrote:

Yes, but I don't believe anyone has confirmed actually hearing it via Tandy DAC yet (although I could be mistaken)

Well, as I wrote before, I heard it with my Tandy DAC emulator, if that counts.

HunterZ wrote:

He's concerned that if AGI games detect the presence of Tandy sound hardware

It's impossible to detect the presence of Tandy PSG chip directly. The Tandy TL series' DAC may be detected with Int 0x1a Ah=0x81, but no games other than those who want DAC output do this. AGI simply detects a Tandy by looking for the string "Tandy" in the BIOS segment, and a PCjr by checking for byte FD at FFFFE.

TVs are overscanned, therefore, some parts of the picture get cut off. This is why the CGA underscans the picture, to compensate for that. The Nintendo Entertainment System, on the other hand, has no such compensation; as a result, on most TV sets the top and bottom 8 lines (or even more) are not displayed, leading many emu authors in the old days to incorrectly believe that the NTSC NES doesn't even generate those lines at all.

If the CGA used the TV's natural resolution of 480 lines, the graphics would be interlaced and be shown at 29.97Hz. I would rather think that it is really forcing the TV to output a low resolution progressive scan display of 240 lines @ 59.97Hz just like the NES and most other consoles up to the Playstation did. The CGA would still have 20 line top and bottom borders, but these would be partially hidden by the TV's overscan. As for its horizontal resolution, 320 pixels could probably be made to fit into the visible viewing area with a reasonable adjustment in pixel size ratio, (i.e. something less than the 1.6:1 ratio on an RGB monitor.) (After all, the NES allows 256 pixels to cover the whole screen and more rather than underscanning them ala the Sega Master System.)

It's not finished, it requires 16-bit or 24-bit color, and it's too slow; that's why.

I thought that 16-bit SVGA modes are included in unofficial builds of DOSBox. Even though the 16-24 bit color modes may be slower, these are games that run on a CGA and therefore an IBM PC (5150). Since some SVGA games utilize modes like 640x480x65536, 16 bit will come sooner or later. The games that utilize composite color modes certainly don't require the emulation resources of, say, Doom or Daggerfall. RGB CGA emulation can do just fine in 8-bit palette modes because the CGA can never show more than 16 distinct colors (dithering can make it seem like more, though.) Since we need some way to differentiate between RGB and composite CGA for games running in 320x200, RGB can use 8-bit and composite can use 16 or 24 bit.

What does (non-) interlacing have to do with this? CGA underscans, NES doesn't. Simple.
The slowness I'm talking about is not the slowness of a 16-bit/24-bit video mode, but the slowness of the gaussian filter used by the code.

NewRisingSun wrote:

SirGraham wrote:

I thought Qbix already agreed to add this control, but I haven't seen it in the CVS update list

Someone from the team wrote me an email telling me he is going to implement it. He wanted to keep that cheap autoguess feature; I'm not sure if I was successful at talking him out of it.

Well The hue control resides nicely on my harddisk. It will make it into cvs builds eventually but I'm in no hurry.
(It works nicely btw)

You haven't succesfully talked me out the cheap autoguess feature.