Phil doesn't post here anymore but he still reads.
Geforce 2 is a NV15 Core.

Geforce 4 MX 440/460 is not a geforce 4 at all. Its a Modified Ge force 2 Core adding Lightspeed Memory Architecture (LMA) the AKA NV17 core.

Geforce 4 is NV28 Core.

For what its worth NV15 cores can run very earlier drivers. While NV17 Cores cant.

But you knew that already. Any amount of googling would reveal this already.

GeForce 2 Ultra can destroy GeForce 4 MX in 16-bit color and with trilinear filtering.

Yeah those videos are very subjective. His results are OK but if you skip to Quake 3 test it shows the GF2 GTS does not beat the GF3 or 4....also his choice of GF3 and GF4 is nothing like my cards, his are like basic cheap OEM which could have all sorts of variations. It would be have better if he used name brand and model cards for the comparisons. (or did I miss that, hmm i watch 3 times do not think so) ....imho.
Another thing never mentioned is DirectX as all those game require DX and how that impacts drivers and games....you have a newer game and it requires newer DX which requires newer driver :0
I like a lot of Phils stuff but those videos are some what misleading....just my opinion 😀

Geforce2 quadro with early drivers. Quality, stability and performance are hard to beat.

The geforce 4 MX is a geforce 2 that can only run drivers version 28 dot something onward.
But the best drivers for the geforce 2 are earlier ones. This is the dilema!

Warlord wrote on 2023-06-27, 23:31:

Phil doesn't post here anymore but he still reads.

why?

why?

Criticism.

matti157 wrote on 2023-06-28, 09:49:

Warlord wrote on 2023-06-27, 23:31:

Phil doesn't post here anymore but he still reads.

why?

People kept badgering him over his GPU benchmark methods/comparisons, and they got pretty nasty about it.
He was most definitely being held to a different standard due to his YouTube channel, which is a shame because it drove him off.

But that's a long time ago, practically history by now.
Best way to talk to him is to communicate directly on any platforms he is active on, eg. YouTube.

Daniël Oosterhuis wrote on 2023-06-28, 10:25:

matti157 wrote on 2023-06-28, 09:49:

Warlord wrote on 2023-06-27, 23:31:

Phil doesn't post here anymore but he still reads.

why?

People kept badgering him over his GPU benchmark methods/comparisons, and they got pretty nasty about it.
He was most definitely being held to a different standard due to his YouTube channel, which is a shame because it drove him off.

its crazy how angry people get over this kind of stuff. its all suppose to be a fun hobby for everyone to just chill and get along but so many people hear something they dont agree with and stright away see red

It's too bad Phil doesn't post on Vogons anymore. We're missing out on some interesting discussions.

He does seem to read the forums though, and keeps up with the recent developments in the retro PC community.

Fujitsubo wrote on 2023-06-28, 10:32:

Daniël Oosterhuis wrote on 2023-06-28, 10:25:

matti157 wrote on 2023-06-28, 09:49:

why?

People kept badgering him over his GPU benchmark methods/comparisons, and they got pretty nasty about it.
He was most definitely being held to a different standard due to his YouTube channel, which is a shame because it drove him off.

its crazy how angry people get over this kind of stuff. its all suppose to be a fun hobby for everyone to just chill and get along but so many people hear something they dont agree with and stright away see red

I am thankfull to everyone, not just to Phil, for all the effort and passion and content they create and put online. Without it we would not advance, we would not make questions.
I'm also ok with criticism, as long as it is constructiv and well founded.
Besides I would very much admire if someone criticized a benchmark methodology and also took the effort to design a new way to bechmark addressing the faults they criticize.

But, geforce 2 with drivers 8 vs geforce 4 mx with drivers 28 or above, and the question of directx?

Some geforce 4 mx do have 128MB 128 bit ram 8x agp!

Some geforce 4 mx do have 128MB 128 bit ram 8x agp!

Very few games can utilize that on GeForce 4 MX with reasonable performance. Besides, 128Mb GF4MX usually had very crappy specs and VRAM quality, so it should be completely outmatched by GF2Ultra in normal scenarios.

Jo22, it's sad that you didn't like that he became a bit popular and assumed the worst about why he left, but genuinely absurd that you have the gall to state whether his manner of speech and accent are "okay" or not. Also, if you didn't like him, why were you consuming so much of his content that you were worried your own accent would be affected?

^Please never mind. I realized for myself that this isn't the right time/place to being 'brutally' honest (by English standards) ,
so I decided to delete the whole post. It's also a cultural thing, maybe.

In a German forum, I would likely get away with it, because people are used to act a litte bit grumpy, cheeky or sarcastic
torwards to each others without appearing as mean (things aren't being eaten as hot as it was cooked.)

It would be probably the most fair approach if I had sent a PM to Phil about that matter a long time ago instead.
But that would be even more hurtful and a questionable move, perhaps.
("Yo bro! Your accent is neato, but my ears are bleedin'. Yo. Ey.").

And I don't like to win the "jerk of the week" award. 😔 So it's not an option, either. It's a Teufelskreis, kind of.
You want to be honest and ask questions or provide feedback, but it adds nothing meaningful, but is making things just worse.
Or as my grandma used to say "The truth.. *sigh* The truth is the ugliest of them all."

About the accent.. It's not just him, it's a general thing. Happens with fellow Germans, too.
I usually mute the audio here or turn it down, focus on the subtitles, watch the diagrams.
Because the longer I listen to it, the more I get used to it and I'm worried to unlearn my existing English eventually.
Seriously. That may sound like an insult, but I can't help it. 🤷‍♂️
It's easy to someone like me to fall back into Engrish/Denglisch mode if not being careful.

Last but not least, it's a purely individual thing. In other places and ears, it may sound very nice.
It relates like music, maybe. So who am I to judge? Turkish people love loud "music" that lets my ears bleed, for example.
In these days everything is relative and every comment a potential mine.

Edit: Just to be be clear, I had never any issues with him or his success.
I did ignore all that and did treat him like any other Vogons user.
It just was surprised to learn that he left because of "criticism",
because back then it seemed to me as if everybody was acting like a fan, rather.

I understand where you are coming from.

Certain people start talking like those that they are around, even if they are already adults.

Still though, I don't have issues listening to people with accents unless they have a very heavy accent and are therefore really hard to understand.

Thank you for your understanding. ^^

Confused UngaBunga wrote on 2023-06-27, 22:42:

If the geforce 2 is faster than a geforce 4 when using early drivers, and a geforce 4 mx460 is the best geforce 2 ever, then whi […]
Show full quote

If the geforce 2 is faster than a geforce 4 when using early drivers, and a geforce 4 mx460 is the best geforce 2 ever, then which card and driver and directx version you choose.
Uppon your answer rests the lifes of all of gotham! Muah ah ah....

So choose carefuly. Tic tac... tic...tac...

Edit: Oh, by the way, I'm refering to these two videos from Phil Computer Lab, https://youtu.be/HRhm4aGNI3o
also
https://youtu.be/_qWvc94DjJE
a channel that has one of the most interesting content retrogaming wise!

On the first link, Phil only tested with a Pentium III CPU. It would be more interesting if he bothered to test with different CPUs, considering that Pentium 4 computers get a boost in performance with later drivers.

Phil actually retested it on P4 2.8Ghz in the pinned comment. Same thing - gradual performance decrease with newer drivers.

I see, didn't notice the pinned comment from Phil until now as I rarely read them. 😜

The performance impact between drivers is larger with Expendable and Drakan on both computers.