VOGONS


First post, by ultra_code

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Hello VOGONS members!

I have a simple question regarding USB switches.

My situation is this: I have two retro gaming machines (well one complete one anyhow, a Win98 P3 one, which you can check out in my signature; the other, a Win98/XP P4 one, is still a work-in-progress on the OS side of things), and for the Win98 one, I frequently enter MS-DOS mode to play DOS games. Now, for that occasion, I have to hook up my USB/PS/2 keyboard (the one included in the V7 CKU200US USB/PS/2 keyboard+mouse combo, which you can find here) using the provided USB-to-PS/2 adapter to the PS/2 port for the keyboard to work at all.

Fast-forward to today, where now have a whole desk setup that I am, well, setting up to have both my retro PCs, my "early modern-to-modern" PC (will run all Windows OSs from XP-10), and finally my soon to be modern PC (which I want to be a Ryzen+ PC, whenever Ryzen+ comes out later this year; anywho, enough modern stuff for this retro forum). Now that I can, I want to KVM/switch my whole desk to easily switch between the 4 PCs I will have stationed there. So, that naturally makes me think about what I have been leading up to for the past 2 paragraphs regarding the USB/PS/2 keyboard and USB switches. 😀

Can I just hook up a USB switch to the USB/PS/2 adapter plugged into my P3 RGM's PS/2 port and, because the USB/PS/2 keyboard will be "on the other side" of the switch, things will work out as expected?

Sorry for the possibly unnecessary rambling. Thanks!

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Reply 1 of 7, by Kubik

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If it's a mechanical USB switch, it should work. If it's an electronic switch, it probably won't work, although it depends on how the switching is done - if there are analog switches, it still might work. However, given the fact it's a whole KVM switch, I would expect it to be smart and thus working as a sort of repeater for USB.

I assume you mean this kind of USB to PS/2 adapter, right? https://mi7.rightinthebox.com/images/384x384/ … 31998142940.jpg
It's just two connectors wired together, there's no active translation between USB and PS/2. The whole idea is that the keyboard or mouse attached to this adapter is smart, and recognizes if it's connected to USB or PS/2, and then uses the corresponding protocol. I don't think your USB switch will be able to switch to PS/2 mode 😀

Reply 2 of 7, by chinny22

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I gone the other way round, I have a PS2 KVM and using the adaptors like Kubik linked to have a USB mouse and keyboard.
Then on the 1 PC I have that doesn't have PS2 ports I use something like this
http://www.aten.com/gb/en/products/kvm/kvm-mo … a/#.WmHYP9IV-M8

Some KVM's let you purchase USB or PS2 style cables to suit your requirements, but that costs more and I think most if not all I've come across are still PS2 style for the physical keyboard/mouse

Reply 3 of 7, by ultra_code

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Kubik, here is a photo of the adapter that came with the keyboard+mouse combo, and, yes, it looks the same as the one you linked.
ufGmckHm.jpg
Just want to show you what I have.

Now, then: I'm a bit confused now, Kubik. You first say this:

If it's a mechanical USB switch, it should work. If it's an electronic switch, it probably won't work, although it depends on how the switching is done - if there are analog switches, it still might work. However, given the fact it's a whole KVM switch, I would expect it to be smart and thus working as a sort of repeater for USB.

Then this:

It's just two connectors wired together, there's no active translation between USB and PS/2. The whole idea is that the keyboard or mouse attached to this adapter is smart, and recognizes if it's connected to USB or PS/2, and then uses the corresponding protocol. I don't think your USB switch will be able to switch to PS/2 mode 😀

For the latter, are you saying that applies to electronic switches, or are you now saying either won't work?

And for reference, here are the USB switches I plan to buy:

There are three things going for them. One, they are cheap. Two, they say they support Win98 and XP (although not DOS, but I am willing to bet it does because of Win98 support; one of them says it supports Win3.1), which, for the price, I am willing to believe. Three, they seem to be mechanical.

So, should they work or no?

Thanks for your replies!

Last edited by ultra_code on 2018-11-05, 17:53. Edited 1 time in total.

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Reply 4 of 7, by Kubik

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Yep, those look like mechanical switches, so they might work, assuming there's no smart electronic inside.

To clarify - the second paragraph is meant for those USB/PS/2 adapters. Let me rephrase it.

The USB/PS/2 adapter on the picture is just two connectors, USB and PS/2, wired together. There's no electronic inside those adapters that would convert USB to PS/2 and vice versa. The whole idea behind these USB/PS/2 "adapters" is to have a smart peripheral (mouse or keyboard) that can be used with either USB or PS/2. When you plug the peripheral directly into an USB port, the peripheral acts as an USB peripheral. If you plug the peripheral into that "adapter" and then the "adapter" into PS/2 port, the peripheral itself recognizes it's plugged into PS/2, and starts communicating as PS/2 peripheral, instead of USB one.

That's why it wouldn't work with electronic USB switch (unless it uses some sort of analog switches or silicon "relays"). The "adapter" expects that the device you plug into it is smart, so that it recognizes if it's plugged into USB or PS/2. I don't think that an electronic USB switch does support this.

With a purely mechanical switch, it basically doesn't matter - the switches inside just connect wires. The keyboard will see the adapter through the switch and will assume it needs to use PS/2.

Reply 5 of 7, by ultra_code

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Okay. All has been clarified now. 😀

Well, I think it is time just to try it. I'm going to order those switches, and hopefully they work *crossing-fingers*. I'm sure it will.

Anywho, thank you guys for clarifying. I'll post back here the results once I get everything hooked up.

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Reply 6 of 7, by gdjacobs

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Not to drag things off topic, but this is exactly how it was done when PS/2 began replacing serial (RS232) as the most common mouse connector for PC compatibles. The mouse had circuitry that was able to interface with both and you used an adapter to plug into whichever style of port you wanted to use.

All hail the Great Capacitor Brand Finder

Reply 7 of 7, by ultra_code

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Hello! Just checking back in to make a final post!

First of all:

gdjacobs wrote:

Not to drag things off topic, but this is exactly how it was done when PS/2 began replacing serial (RS232) as the most common mouse connector for PC compatibles. The mouse had circuitry that was able to interface with both and you used an adapter to plug into whichever style of port you wanted to use.

Interesting. 😀

Second of all, I finally got the switches in the mail, and I hooked up one for my USB/PS/2 keyboard to both a USB port and to the USB-to-PS/2 adapter via extension cables and tested it out, and guess what. It WORKS! It is mechanical after all!

I first tested the switch "switched" to the PS/2 port, and was successful in entering the BIOS, then successful in having it work under Win98, and, the point of the PS/2 keyboard functionality, my keyboard worked under MS-DOS mode. I then shut the PC down, "switched" to the USB port, and again was able to enter the BIOS and enter Win98 with keyboard functionality. Hip-hip-horay!

If I have to make one interesting point in regards to adapters on the market, it seems that the cheaper adapters (which are mechanical) are the best when working with older systems (although, as I have learned with VGA adapters, that is not the case; that would be a topic for another "topic"), which I can imagine might be ironic to some when the general wisdom for most things in life are "the more expensive the product is, the more likely it is better". There's my two cents.

Any who, thank you those who responded and confirmed my initial thoughts. Have a good day!

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