dr_st wrote:

If you want to run Windows 3.1, just install MS-DOS 6.2 or MS-DOS 6.22, and chances are it will work just fine.

So far it seems you are wasting your own and everyone else's time trying to bend things in a way they were not intended to be bent, for seemingly no good reason.

If there's an LFN version of DOS 6.22, I'd downgrade without wasting more time, the only thing that I liked of 7 than 6.22 was just LFN, which helps me a lot when I make my batch files and try to look for a specific folder when I have long folder names in my CDs.

My copy of 6.22 (original floppies) didn't have that feature (I still use 6.22 in my 386 Epson PC)

MS DOS 6.22 and below don't have long file name support. That only came in Win95 and its inbuilt Dos7 (and was one of its selling features!)
If was me I would still try 6.22 which is the only version of dos that is 100% guaranteed to work with Win3x
if everything runs fine then we know the errors are caused by later versions of Win3x was never really designed for, and look for possible work arounds.
If you still get errors then we know its not casued by dos and will have to start looking at other possible causes.

Ok, I'll then try to install 6.22 over this without formatting (I don't want to lose all the batch files and the drivers I've hardly got to work and I don't have any way to make a backup from that PC, this external CD-ROM drive doesn't even burn CDs) and let's see what happens.

I also need to fix my conventional memory issues that appeared today:

I've used Memmaker 2 times already today and it didn't fix it...

It's sad that I can't get LFN to work on 6.22 with extra software though 😢

It wouldn't be a bad idea to run Antivirus. Same late version of F-Prot for DOS.

Elia1995 wrote:

I also need to fix my conventional memory issues that appeared today:

Let's be clear: things do not normally just "appear". Often, when things go wrong, it is a direct result of something else being changed, though it is of course sometimes very surprising to see what seemingly-unrelated things can go wrong when you make a change. So: when something "appears", think about what you might have changed, go change it back, and see if it "disappears".

Anyway, the output of "mem /c /p" would be more useful than the output of "mem" at this point.

Here you go 😁

For some reason, Memmaker can't move all those programs into Upper Memory.
And yes, I did REM SMARTDRV in autoexec and config, I have no idea why it's still there !!!

I've never really trusted Memmaker.

Elia1995 wrote:

And yes, I did REM SMARTDRV in autoexec and config, I have no idea why it's still there !!!

Well, you'll just have to figure that out on your own, then, because it's definitely there, and no one here knows exactly everything you've been doing. Maybe it's in one of those other batch files you mentioned.

press f8 during "starting ms-dos" and confirm config.sys and autoexec.bat line by line...

look when smartdrv appears, after boot or after trying to start windows.

you can install dos6.22 only if the partition is smaller 2 Gb and its formated fat 16.

you can also try to make a bootdisk for win3.1

what version of dos 7 you are using? mine is from win95c.

also try in config.sys

device=path to your win 3.1 dir/ifshlp.sys

and what is "killer" ??

Sammy wrote:

press f8 during "starting ms-dos" and confirm config.sys and autoexec.bat line by line...

look when smartdrv appears, after boot or after trying to start windows.

Yeah, I fixed it, apparently I forgot to REM a line with it at the very beginning of my autoexec.bat file.

Sammy wrote:

you can install dos6.22 only if the partition is smaller 2 Gb and its formated fat 16.

It's indeed less than 2 GB: the whole hardisk is roughly 500MB (the paper on the hardisk says 500MB, but it only gets up to 406 for some reason) and the current partition is FAT16 indeed, check out my fdisk !!! 😁

Sammy wrote:

you can also try to make a bootdisk for win3.1

with sys a:\ and copy the win command in a floppy ?

Sammy wrote:

what version of dos 7 you are using? mine is from win95c.

It's MS-DOS 7.10, I installed it from 2 floppies my father gave me some time ago.

Sammy wrote:

also try in config.sys

device=path to your win 3.1 dir/ifshlp.sys

Apparently it did nothing... ??? 😕

Sammy wrote:

what is "killer" ??

I have no idea, I just found it in autoexec.bat and I just REM'd it.

Do you have a msdos 6.22 bootdisk? (setup disk 1)

then make a copy from it and delete everything except io.sys, msdos.sys, command.com, doublebuf.sys drivespace.bin

copy himem.sys emm386.exe and ifshlp.sys from windows 3.1 directory to diskette. (and what you need too; keyboard, etc)

create your config.sys and autoexec.bat and load the versions of himem.sys and emm386.exe from Diskette.

so you can boot msdos 6.22 from disk and run win3.1 oder boot dos 7.1 from HDD for games And LFN .

Sammy wrote:

also try in config.sys

device=path to your win 3.1 dir/ifshlp.sys

I think this one is only used in WfW 3.11 (helper program for installable filesystem -> VFAT).

Sammy wrote:

and what is "killer" ??

Do we really want to know ?

Elia1995 wrote:

If there's an LFN version of DOS 6.22, I'd downgrade without wasting more time, the only thing that I liked of 7 than 6.22 was just LFN, which helps me a lot when I make my batch files and try to look for a specific folder when I have long folder names in my CDs.

My copy of 6.22 (original floppies) didn't have that feature (I still use 6.22 in my 386 Epson PC)

Really ? What's next, filenames with hieroglyphs and umlauts ? 😁
Just kidding! I can understand this, but this is asking for trouble.

To have proper LFN support you have to use programs which support this.
For DOS itself, this would be command.com and it's drivers (CD-ROM, MSCDEX).
If you are using DOS 5 or 6 you can use the 4DOS command line replacement.
I think one version had LFN support.

But I'm no expert with that LFN stuff. Once tried it with Calmira and Win 3.1..
Wasn't that stable back then (or I was just stupid). 😀

Hi, I was searching for 4DOS and just found an interesting website about DOS:

http://www.4dos.info/

This site has a lot of useful little utilities.

One of them is DOSLFNJH, a "Small LFN (Long File Name) driver for DOS. Free."

There are several other utilities, like "SoundFX 2000", which is "THE sound card emulator for
DOS programs running on Windows XP, 2000 and NT4."

(Strange, I thought VDMSound was the only one of this kind..)

Anyway, there's also some information about the 4DOS command processor:

"4DOS has been released as open source freeware for use with Freedos (see the announcement here and
here. Also of interest: the Wikipedia entry). I hope this will give this worthy project a big boost.

The license stipulates that 'The Software, or any portion of it, may not be compiled for use on any operating
system OTHER than FreeDOS without written permission from Rex Conn'.

On the other hand, when asked "But what about MS-DOS, PC-DOS, DR DOS etcetera?" in the support forum, Rex
answered: "I don't have any problems with people using it on those OS's (although I'd be surprised if there
was a lot of MS-DOS or PC-DOS action left). That license was written by the FreeDOS people -- it was probably
worded that way because it's impossible to list every possible variation of the DOS OS's." Questions,
anyone?"

So it seems 4DOS is now part of the FreeDOS project. Interesting, didn't know that.
I though they were using FreeCOM, their own creation.

Oh and by the way, I've finally found an explanation for that lock/unlock command!
"Volume LOCK/UNLOCK feature added to protect data and LFN on the (hard) disks"
http://www.cn-dos.net/msdos71/whatsnew.htm

That page also has some information about LFN and "DOS 7.1":
http://www.cn-dos.net/msdos71/dosfat32.htm
http://www.cn-dos.net/msdos71/doslfns.htm

This paragraph is important:
"Older disk utilities, such as Speed Disk from Norton Utilities 8.0 and DEFRAG from MS-DOS 6.x,
will destroy the LFN entries during their operations. Even a simple rename or copy command in
MS-DOS 6.x could cause problems with LFN (the associated LFNs will be lost, and the garbage entries will
appear in the file system)."

I knew it. Long filenames are using directory entries to store information.
So any old school utility like CentralPoint's Compress or MS Defrag will damage LFNs (or cancel with an error message).
So I wasn't wrong about defrag and lock. Back then I was using the DOS version of defrag from the Win95 CD (OLDMSDOS folder)..

Jo22 wrote:

(Strange, I thought VDMSound was the only one of this kind..)

SoundFX 2000 used to be a rather expensive commercial product and hence was easy to ignore since VDMSound was free. Neither is particularly useful anymore.

I though they were using FreeCOM, their own creation.

There's nothing that says they aren't.

"Older disk utilities, such as Speed Disk from Norton Utilities 8.0 and DEFRAG from MS-DOS 6.x, will destroy the LFN entries dur […]
Show full quote

"Older disk utilities, such as Speed Disk from Norton Utilities 8.0 and DEFRAG from MS-DOS 6.x,
will destroy the LFN entries during their operations. Even a simple rename or copy command in
MS-DOS 6.x could cause problems with LFN (the associated LFNs will be lost, and the garbage entries will
appear in the file system)."

Yes, I thought about mentioning that. If I'm not mistaken, Speed Disk / Defrag will stop and insist you run Disk Doctor / Scandisk before they do any real damage - and Disk Doctor / Scandisk will in turn regard every long file name as some kind of disk error. I never used DOSLFN, though, and I'm not sure if it behaves properly.

Here's Windows 3.1's bootlog.txt:

1[boot]
2LoadStart = system.drv
3LoadSuccess = system.drv
4LoadStart = keyboard.drv
5LoadSuccess = keyboard.drv
6LoadStart = nomouse.drv
7LoadSuccess = nomouse.drv
8LoadStart = vga.drv
9LoadSuccess = vga.drv
10LoadStart = mmsound.drv
11LoadSuccess = mmsound.drv
12LoadStart = comm.drv
13LoadSuccess = comm.drv
14LoadStart = vgasys.fon
15LoadSuccess = vgasys.fon
16LoadStart = vga850.fon
17LoadSuccess = vga850.fon
18LoadStart = GDI.EXE
19LoadStart = FONTS.FON
20LoadSuccess = FONTS.FON
21LoadStart = vgafix.fon
22LoadSuccess = vgafix.fon
23LoadStart = OEMFONTS.FON
24LoadSuccess = OEMFONTS.FON
25LoadSuccess = GDI.EXE
26LoadStart = USER.EXE
27INIT=Keyboard
28INITDONE=Keyboard
29INIT=Mouse
30STATUS=No mouse driver installed
31INITDONE=Mouse
32INIT=Display
33LoadStart = DISPLAY.drv
34LoadSuccess = DISPLAY.drv
35INITDONE=Display
36INIT=Display Resources
37INITDONE=Display Resources
38INIT=Fonts
39INITDONE=Fonts
40INIT=Lang Driver
41INITDONE=Lang Driver
42LoadSuccess = USER.EXE
43LoadStart = setup.exe
44LoadStart = LZEXPAND.DLL
45LoadSuccess = LZEXPAND.DLL
46LoadStart = VER.DLL
47LoadSuccess = VER.DLL
48LoadSuccess = setup.exe
49INIT=Final USER
50INITDONE=Final USER
51INIT=Installable Drivers
52INITDONE=Installable Drivers
53[boot]
54LoadStart = system.drv
55LoadSuccess = system.drv
56LoadStart = keyboard.drv
57LoadSuccess = keyboard.drv
58LoadStart = nomouse.drv
59LoadSuccess = nomouse.drv
60LoadStart = vga.drv

61LoadSuccess = vga.drv
62LoadStart = mmsound.drv
63LoadSuccess = mmsound.drv
64LoadStart = comm.drv
65LoadSuccess = comm.drv
66LoadStart = vgasys.fon
67LoadSuccess = vgasys.fon
68LoadStart = vga850.fon
69LoadSuccess = vga850.fon
70LoadStart = GDI.EXE
71LoadStart = FONTS.FON
72LoadSuccess = FONTS.FON
73LoadStart = vgafix.fon
74LoadSuccess = vgafix.fon
75LoadStart = OEMFONTS.FON
76LoadSuccess = OEMFONTS.FON
77LoadSuccess = GDI.EXE
78LoadStart = USER.EXE
79INIT=Keyboard
80INITDONE=Keyboard
81INIT=Mouse
82STATUS=No mouse driver installed
83INITDONE=Mouse
84INIT=Display
85LoadStart = DISPLAY.drv
86LoadSuccess = DISPLAY.drv
87INITDONE=Display
88INIT=Display Resources
89INITDONE=Display Resources
90INIT=Fonts
91INITDONE=Fonts
92INIT=Lang Driver
93INITDONE=Lang Driver
94LoadSuccess = USER.EXE
95LoadStart = setup.exe
96LoadStart = LZEXPAND.DLL
97LoadSuccess = LZEXPAND.DLL
98LoadStart = VER.DLL
99LoadSuccess = VER.DLL
100LoadSuccess = setup.exe
101INIT=Final USER
102INITDONE=Final USER
103INIT=Installable Drivers
104INITDONE=Installable Drivers

Today when I try to boot Windows 3.1, it says this:

Even the sound card drivers got screwed up (check my CT2950 thread, more info over there: Re: Sound Blaster CT2950 makes farting noises...)...

Enough, I don't care anymore of my batch files or whatever, I'll just make them again eventually (nah, I just copied them all on a floppy), I'm going to format this hardisk.

I want to start fresh
So... before starting, DOS 6.22 with 4DOS LFN drivers ? Is that the best options we've figured out ? Or FreeDOS ?
Keep in mind that that PC can't boot from the CD-ROM for some reason, so I can install any DOS as long as it's on floppy disks.

You can get a Free DOS from here:

http://ftp.uni-bayreuth.de/pc/caldera/OpenDOS.701/
Caldera OpenDOS its fine, and free for private use.

matze79 wrote:

You can get a Free DOS from here:

Caldera OpenDOS and Dr DOS 7.03 its fine, and free.

I found its img, but I can't burn it

just get the proper files from the ftp.

its free as long you use it non-commercial.
you can even copy it for friends.

Caldera OpenDOS licensing allows this.

Here are some enhancments for it:
http://www.drdosprojects.de/index.cgi/download.htm

i would replace the chkdsk utility with dosfsck from freedos if you use fat32.

The FTP download at Dr. Dos's website is dead, the mirror aswell.

1Impossible to reach the website
2The page at the address: blah blah
3could temporary be unavailable or it has been permanently moved to a new address.

fsn.hu is up but the OpenDOS mirror folder is gone.

I sorted out the issue I had with "burning" that IMG I got from WinWorldPC...

apparently I forgot notepad open with a txt file which I removed hours ago from my DOS PC, but I never closed notepad here and it kept saying that the drive was in use due to that...

(it was the Bootlog.txt I posted earlier, consider how much time it stayed open without me noticing it 🤣)

Let's hope this version doesn't have issues with Windows 3.1...

AAAAND... it doesn't even boot.

Ah nevermind, I managed to launch the installation by running install.exe after booting in MS-DOS regularly (inserting the floppy later, not on boot).

I hope I'm installing it the right way, I've never installed Dr. Dos before...