Speaking of keyboards... I just got this 1984 model a few days ago:

Also got this Unitek K-155 that has Cherry MX Black switches:

Also got a couple more CPUs.
A PODP5V133 - been wanting one of these for quite a while, but they usually go for about 5x more than I am willing to spend:

Also got the IDT Winchip version of the Evergreen Spectra 233.

Is it too late to take it back, the winchip? ... Just kidding, it's just a very very narrow range of circumstances where you can put that in a system and not find a drop in CPU that's faster. They run pretty cool though, and prolly fly in win 3.x.

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-03-05, 04:55:

Is it too late to take it back, the winchip? ... Just kidding, it's just a very very narrow range of circumstances where you can put that in a system and not find a drop in CPU that's faster. They run pretty cool though, and prolly fly in win 3.x.

Hehe... I know they are pretty bad performance-wise. Just another that I was interested in having for collection purposes and maybe pitting it against other CPUs at some point.

hyoenmadan wrote on 2023-03-05, 03:31:

Ozzuneoj wrote on 2023-03-03, 08:20:

I would like to talk to some Dell experts to learn where this system fits into their history, because there is absolutely zero i […]
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I would like to talk to some Dell experts to learn where this system fits into their history, because there is absolutely zero information about the existence of this machine online aside from the trademark registration in 1993 and one 20 year old post from someone saying they repurposed the chassis of one of these.

It's a Dell Exclaim 486/50 (DX2-50) desktop, with original keyboard, mouse and monitor in original box. As a bonus, someone had upgraded this with a Media Vision multimedia kit, so it has a PAS16, 2x SCSI CDROM and fancy Labtec stereo speakers! So far, everything works, and the CRT is absolutely gorgeous! Perfect blacks, excellent color.
20230302_202829 (Custom).jpg

I found it listed recently and managed to get it for a great price in untested condition. Thankfully, the seller not only packaged it back into the box appropriately (base off of monitor, original packaging in place and double boxed to protect the artwork!!).
20230302_185123 (Custom).jpg

Inside it is incredibly clean and the CMOS battery is, thankfully, external. It had slightly corroded the battery negative battery pin but there appears to be no damage on the top of the board (haven't pulled it yet to check the back). Everything else seems to be working great though! I get a tiny bit of sporadic noise from the power supply so I will probably crack that open and see how things look in there.

To my astonishment, I managed to get the hard drive reading by just setting the drive parameters to auto (not as shown in the picture above... those are the defaults due to the lack of battery) and rebooting the PC. It has DOS, Windows 3.1 and an interesting startup program called Dell Library Menu.
20230302_204141 (Custom).jpg

Also, there are hand-written labels on the pull tabs on all of the drive ribbon cables... but not on the CD-ROM cable which was added later. Surely, the writing didn't come from Dell, did it? 🤣
20230302_191328 (Custom).jpg

Anyway, I plan on making a thread about this but I had to post something now. I'm super excited to get it 100% cleaned up and to get all the kinks worked out.
From my reading online, non-business-oriented Dell PCs were barely a thing in 1993, which is when this was manufactured. It's very well built too. The back of the chassis is painted and looks very "premium", except for the fact that the keyboard "hole" is obviously DIN\AT sized but has a PS/2 port in the middle of it... which tells me this case wasn't tooled exactly for this machine.

Oh gawd... It came with the GOOD AT101 keyboard, and not the later rubber dome "QuietKey" trash!!!
This machine is a good getting just for the keyboard alone!

The keyboard is a Honeywell 101WN and is actually rubber dome as far as I can tell. A few of the keys were stuck down when I got it, so I pulled them with my key puller tool to reseat them and that is literally all the keyboard needed to work perfectly. When I looked under the keys I'm fairly certain it was a rubber dome I was looking at in there... no mechanical switch that I could see.

Personally, I use a Dell Quietkey on my test bench and it works great. From my experience vintage non-dome keyboards are the most unreliable, torturous to repair, overrated bits of vintage gear. Don't get me wrong, I like the feel and sound of them, but I would gladly have all the hours back that I've spent trying to fix the stupid things since I started into retro gear. I could have replaced the caps on probably 50 motherboards and video cards in the time I've spent on keyboards, only to end up with no reliable vintage non-rubber-dome keyboards because some other part always fails on them, some tiny piece isn't aligned properly during assembly so you have to rebuild the entire thing, or some obscure bit is failing\defective and takes ages to find an affordable replacement for.

... I know many will disagree with this, but it has been my experience. I think the only sure-fire way to get a reliable vintage mechanical keyboard (not counting stumbling on a good working one by chance) is to throw cash and time at it until it decides to work properly.

My Non-rubber-dome vintage keyboard experience:

*IBM Model M2 (Lexmark) = bought brand new in box; damaged in storage by bad caps; ruined by horrible design choices and fragility of construction. Horrible plastic key matrix that burns\tarnishes when the cap goes bad, and a circuit board that relies on plastic clip pressure to keep good contact so that all the keys work. And the clips can break very easily, rendering the board worthless without cobbling things.
*IBM Model F (XT)= found in an attic with original box marked "Defective 1984", so it was maybe used for a couple years, max. Something on the board was dead and I was unable to diagnose it, even with help online. Found a replacement PCB affordably after years of waiting for one to turn up. New board must be ever so slightly different size\shape and was a bear to get put back together. A couple flappers got damaged during reassembly due to the struggles I went through. Some keys are now intermittent, so I need new flappers... and hopefully that fixes it. But in the end, the layout is atrocious so I haven't bothered dumping more money into it for new flappers, and there's always a chance that it just won't be reliable anyway.
*KeyTronic XT clone (with caps led) = bad foam and foil switches. Not that hard to get into but I followed some less than perfect instructions online (foam was way too thick) and also managed to use foam that was too stiff as well. Now it's a worthless, over-sensitive mushy mess. Texelec of course now sells replacement pad sets, but again... for $35 more I'd still have the horrible XT layout and I'd rather not fight with pulling out all the hand-made foam and foil pads I meticulously built and installed.
*Franklin Ace 1000 = bad foam and foil switches... didn't even bother trying to replace them after the debacle with the KeyTronic. Though I'm sure it's not too bad once you get a proper set. If they were cheaper I'd have replaced them, but I ended up just selling the machine to a guy who had a use for it.
*Cherry MY point of sale keyboard = I currently use this on my PC 5150 because it is AT\XT switchable, works reliably and has a decent layout, but the keys get stuck if you press them slightly off center and it just doesn't feel as good as most rubber domes. Got 5 of these from someone and they were all in good condition but all felt similarly bad.
*Focus 2001 = It's mechanical, but I can't remember much about this one... it's in my collection and I believe it generally works but I would have to test it again. I don't use it on my test bench because I prefer a normal straight (not L shaped) enter key for working in DOS. It is very loud and "clicky" but feels decent. I think a couple of the clips that hold it together are cracked so the seam isn't tight all the way around and there's no easy way to fix this due to the way it is designed.
*Vendex XT Clone = Alps switches I think... feels great, isn't too loud. Good blend of AT and XT layout while being XT compatible, but for whatever reason just isn't reliable. Half the keys don't register. I have no idea what kind of nightmare lies ahead of me to try to open it up, but I'm hoping it just needs cleaned to work properly. This is most likely the keyboard I will fix to use on my PC 5150. I still don't love the layout but it's better than the Model F layout.

... compare all this to my rubber dome keyboards, and I can only think of one that was objectively horrible and that was a really old Keytronic rubber dome XT\AT switchable. The keys feel absolutely terrible and you simply cannot push a key down without deliberately pressing dead center. All other rubber dome keyboards I have used from all eras have been almost 100% reliable and ranged from "meh" to "surprisingly nice" on the key feel. 🤷

I use modern mechanicals all the time and my refurbished Corsair K70 has been working perfectly for like 7-8 years now. Who knows how it will be when it's 30 years old though. 😮

cyclone3d wrote on 2023-03-05, 04:46:

Also got a couple more CPUs. A PODP5V133 - been wanting one of these for quite a while, but they usually go for about 5x more th […]
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Also got a couple more CPUs.
A PODP5V133 - been wanting one of these for quite a while, but they usually go for about 5x more than I am willing to spend:
PODP5V133-fan.jpg
PODP5V133.jpg

Also got the IDT Winchip version of the Evergreen Spectra 233.
Evergreen_Spectra_233.jpg

Something about seeing intel overdrives is just ultimate nostalgia for me. Nice finds.

hyoenmadan wrote on 2023-03-05, 03:31:

[...]

Oh gawd... It came with the GOOD AT101 keyboard, and not the later rubber dome "QuietKey" trash!!!
This machine is a good getting just for the keyboard alone!

Meh, get ready for a very laborious clean then. Old Alps switches are highly regarded, but only when taken apart, cleaned, possibly lubricated and put back together again. Otherwise they are nasty and scratchy. And yes, this is from personal experience with AT101, SGI Granite and Apple Enhanced II.

You're probably better off getting a modern Matias board. I picked up a NOS Tactile Pro from 2005 era or so. It was a revelation. Despite being the single loudest board I have every typed on (and I own Model Fs) the switches felt beautiful - and I understood what all the fuss about Alps was about. I'd never been able to attain that on any of my famous vintage ones.

Visually nearly flawless Tualatin board with an ISA slot for the price of two cups of coffee is highly suspicious. All the caps must have dried up and there's going to be magic smoke.

E: We have a boot without errors!

Bought an other voodoo 2 12 mb CIB. It includes an sli cable which I will use to hook up to my own identical card ive had since the 90s.

A001 wrote on 2023-03-05, 12:29:

Visually nearly flawless Tualatin board with an ISA slot for the price of two cups of coffee is highly suspicious. All the caps must have dried up and there's going to be magic smoke.
785.jpg

E: We have a boot without errors!

well that was a nice find! You're next project perhaps

will be a great basis for all kinds of set ups

dionb wrote on 2023-03-05, 11:52:

hyoenmadan wrote on 2023-03-05, 03:31:

[...]

Oh gawd... It came with the GOOD AT101 keyboard, and not the later rubber dome "QuietKey" trash!!!
This machine is a good getting just for the keyboard alone!

Meh, get ready for a very laborious clean then. Old Alps switches are highly regarded, but only when taken apart, cleaned, possibly lubricated and put back together again. Otherwise they are nasty and scratchy. And yes, this is from personal experience with AT101, SGI Granite and Apple Enhanced II.

You're probably better off getting a modern Matias board. I picked up a NOS Tactile Pro from 2005 era or so. It was a revelation. Despite being the single loudest board I have every typed on (and I own Model Fs) the switches felt beautiful - and I understood what all the fuss about Alps was about. I'd never been able to attain that on any of my famous vintage ones.

See my post above. This is actually a Honeywell 101WN, which is not mechanical.

I'm not too pleased to hear that Alps switches are ALSO a pain to clean, because that is what my Vendex keyboard uses, and that is the one I was most likely to actually try to use.

Honestly, I'm about done with vintage mechanicals. Starting to seem like the biggest waste of time and energy in this hobby. It's like fixing up a vintage carbureted motor to use in a daily driver. Yeah, it's neat, it's retro and the whole thing is built to be user serviceable, but reliability, consistency and efficiency are so far behind something more modern that keeping it working acceptably becomes a hobby\job all on it's own.

Unless you want pulling keycaps, setting springs in place and doing keyboard diagnostics to become your new past-time, just use a decent quality rubber dome.

Ozzuneoj wrote on 2023-03-05, 19:50:

See my post above. This is actually a Honeywell 101WN, which is not mechanical. […]
Show full quote

dionb wrote on 2023-03-05, 11:52:

hyoenmadan wrote on 2023-03-05, 03:31:

[...]

Oh gawd... It came with the GOOD AT101 keyboard, and not the later rubber dome "QuietKey" trash!!!
This machine is a good getting just for the keyboard alone!

Meh, get ready for a very laborious clean then. Old Alps switches are highly regarded, but only when taken apart, cleaned, possibly lubricated and put back together again. Otherwise they are nasty and scratchy. And yes, this is from personal experience with AT101, SGI Granite and Apple Enhanced II.

You're probably better off getting a modern Matias board. I picked up a NOS Tactile Pro from 2005 era or so. It was a revelation. Despite being the single loudest board I have every typed on (and I own Model Fs) the switches felt beautiful - and I understood what all the fuss about Alps was about. I'd never been able to attain that on any of my famous vintage ones.

See my post above. This is actually a Honeywell 101WN, which is not mechanical.

I'm not too pleased to hear that Alps switches are ALSO a pain to clean, because that is what my Vendex keyboard uses, and that is the one I was most likely to actually try to use.

Honestly, I'm about done with vintage mechanicals. Starting to seem like the biggest waste of time and energy in this hobby. It's like fixing up a vintage carbureted motor to use in a daily driver. Yeah, it's neat, it's retro and the whole thing is built to be user serviceable, but reliability, consistency and efficiency are so far behind something more modern that keeping it working acceptably becomes a hobby\job all on it's own.

Unless you want pulling keycaps, setting springs in place and doing keyboard diagnostics to become your new past-time, just use a decent quality rubber dome.

Haha, I understand about that retro car part. In fact I have from was 1987 2.2L with 3 speed auto caravan 2003 to 2009 but engine must had issues long before that, that I'll tell you about in abit. I drove it like this and had to buy off a vw bus owner's their weber carb, instead of dealing with worn out holley carbs that Chrysler used. The weber is direct fit and worked well. instant start every time and decent MPG. Last 3 years of it's life, one of 4 cylinder engine eventually got stiff when weather is cold that starter's torque could not overcome, many time barely got started, progressively worse with each last years, and had to use engine heater most of time.

How I know that engine had issue with one cylinder was one spark plug is dry sooty, from the beginning.

Cheers,

Ozzuneoj wrote on 2023-03-05, 19:50:

[...]

See my post above. This is actually a Honeywell 101WN, which is not mechanical.

I'm not too pleased to hear that Alps switches are ALSO a pain to clean, because that is what my Vendex keyboard uses, and that is the one I was most likely to actually try to use.

Here's a three-part walkthrough/tutorial:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Mhmb2kBuwQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RnvC80Vjuts&t=2s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMst2mNTHRM

Honestly, I'm about done with vintage mechanicals. Starting to seem like the biggest waste of time and energy in this hobby. It's like fixing up a vintage carbureted motor to use in a daily driver. Yeah, it's neat, it's retro and the whole thing is built to be user serviceable, but reliability, consistency and efficiency are so far behind something more modern that keeping it working acceptably becomes a hobby\job all on it's own.

Unless you want pulling keycaps, setting springs in place and doing keyboard diagnostics to become your new past-time, just use a decent quality rubber dome.

Tbh, old Cherry MX boards are pretty trouble-free, I tend to just chuck the keycaps into the washing machine, plastic casing into the dishwasher, and do a rubbing alcohol toothbrush clean between the switches and it's as good as new. Of course, Cherry switches are hardly the best out there, but old Black boards type pretty nicely and blue are authentically irritatingly high-pitched and loud. For serious typing, old IBM Model M Enhanced keyboards (3rd generation or older, not the rattly newer 4th gen Lexmark/Unicomp ones) are still a very good option. 2kro means you don't want to game on them, but they are tough as old bricks and unlike the model F have perfectly normal layouts (because they defined what we still consider normal). A well-treated F can also be pretty trouble-free. I'm typing this on a modern F board (someone restarted the factory last year 😉 ) but I also have a 1985 vintage F122 'battleship' keyboard that actually types better and has a pretty 'regular' layout. The only thing keeping that from being my daily driver is its monumental size.

I think you've had bad luck with awful M2 build quality/repair and foam&foil which is like prodding a dead cephalopod at the best of times, and wrong thickness/consistency foam is hardly that best of times. Alps are real Rolls-Royces (i.e. you need a mechanic on-site to keep them in working order, but if you do they are unmatched) and Cherry MX Volvos: uninspiring but tough and reliable.

Still, you are right that mechanicals of any vintage are more of an acquired taste, cost more and can require more effort to keep working than simple rubber dome boards. At work I therefore compromise: I have an IBM Model M QuietTouch, i.e. a Model M case with rubber dome innards. Not as nice as the real buckling spring boards, but probably the best rubber dome I own. Still only does 2kro though.

I have a local source for a Cherry MY POS keyboard, worth $50 or not? Also local source popped up for Perixx modern USB keyboard with a trackball between letters and keypad, are they good or bad, I've always wanted one of those Ms with a trackball in. This would I know not be the same, and if I was choosing one, spending MSRP I'd get one with a right side trackball, but at significant discount???

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-03-06, 03:13:

I have a local source for a Cherry MY POS keyboard, worth $50 or not? Also local source popped up for Perixx modern USB keyboard with a trackball between letters and keypad, are they good or bad, I've always wanted one of those Ms with a trackball in. This would I know not be the same, and if I was choosing one, spending MSRP I'd get one with a right side trackball, but at significant discount???

I got my Cherry MY keyboards free in a huge lot with other stuff. Only one or two were worth using, and those are only okay. I like that they are compact and all the keys work, and the models like mine tend to be AT\XT switchable. So, for that purpose they are handy... but eh... I wouldn't spend much on one unless you were able to test it and get a feel for it.

Not sure if this is really considered retro but its for sure old enough, Ive been on the look out for a Phenom 1100T BE and saw this complete combo, board, ram, CPU, cooler and IO shield for 150 AUD ~100USD with free local postage and jumped on it, its tested and working.

Have always wanted one of these 6 core beasts, might pair it with a pair of 4890s in Xfire, should make for an entertaining machine for DX10 benchmarks and music/video streaming. (I say streaming but not across a network rather from the internet)

*It does need a cooler looking cooler, I have a crazy Thermaltake volcano vane cooler I might throw on it.

Hey you jerk, just wanted to one-up my 1090T I haven't put together yet? (just kidding) Though I haven't put it together, up to my elbows in Blue Lightning right now, it's the Tualatin of 386es, which of course are the K6-3+ of socket 370, which might be the X6 of super7, or are they the v40 of AM3???? I got lost.

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-03-06, 04:59:

Hey you jerk, just wanted to one-up my 1090T I haven't put together yet? (just kidding) Though I haven't put it together, up to my elbows in Blue Lightning right now, it's the Tualatin of 386es, which of course are the K6-3+ of socket 370, which might be the X6 of super7, or are they the v40 of AM3???? I got lost.

Blue Lightning is one of the coolest CPU names, wish IBM had made more of them on their in house process, its almost as cool as Blue Thunder ...

I think it was a pawn in the game with Intel "Guarantee us X million units of CPU a year and we do solemnly swear to stop making x86 of our own design" and they got that signed and sealed and turned around to Cyrix, "Hey, wanna make CPUs with us?" and Intel left all "Not like that!"

BitWrangler wrote on 2023-03-06, 03:13:

I have a local source for a Cherry MY POS keyboard, worth $50 or not? Also local source popped up for Perixx modern USB keyboard with a trackball between letters and keypad, are they good or bad, I've always wanted one of those Ms with a trackball in. This would I know not be the same, and if I was choosing one, spending MSRP I'd get one with a right side trackball, but at significant discount???

Nope, not worth $15. The MY switches are horrible. Akin to typing on wet newspaper.
If you want one, pay shipping and you can have one for free.