Be sure to have the HDD in CHS-Mode in the BIOS if you prepare it for the 486 system. The other way around usually won't calculate right (LBA -> CHS).
Check how the 486 BIOS-behaves if you set more than 1024 cylinders. You may set it to 1024 even if the HDD has more. (1024 / 16 / 63 ).
Make sure you use the same setting when preparing the HDD even in another PC.

fdisk might have a problem if you want to make d: a primary boot drive (probably C: is already).
Better make a bootdisk with the system, sys.com and fdisk.exe.
As d: is formatted with /s after putting it in the 486 boot from disk. Then activate the partition with fdisk, do a sys a: c: and a fdisk /mbr
Writing boot code is usually more reliable in the computer where it should boot.

About the noise - simply use a newer HDD. It doesn't hurt the HDD if you just use the first 504 MB. All P-ATA HDDs should still support CHS.
My CF cards support DMA fine, I may do benches if interested.
For more luxury there are even 3.5" or 5.25" bays for CF cards. Though I use a adapter directly at the mainboards IDE connector since I usually copy the stuff via LAN.

Noise was the main reason I decided to try to dampen the sound by adding cardboard to the insides of the case. It worked reasonably well, is dirt cheap and easy to implement.
There are other ways to quieten harddrives but those involve spending more money which might not be worth it if you could spend that money on a flash card

elianda wrote:

Be sure to have the HDD in CHS-Mode in the BIOS if you prepare it for the 486 system. The other way around usually won't calculate right (LBA -> CHS).

This seems to be an early 486 board. There are no such options like LBA available. I can set type 47 and either enter the parameters by hand or use auto detect. Auto detect actually finds the parameters correctly, but fdisk only sees the 504 MB.

Check how the 486 BIOS-behaves if you set more than 1024 cylinders. You may set it to 1024 even if the HDD has more. (1024 / 16 / 63 ).

I tried that already. I ran the disk with the auto detected correct values. I also tried the bios maximum you mentioned. It makes no difference. With ghost, it works, without ghost, it won't boot. The partition is accessible both ways.

Make sure you use the same setting when preparing the HDD even in another PC.

Since I have a burner replace the 5.25 floppy drive, I will backup to CD, probably using ghost. Haven't tried it yet. Digging out the HDD is too much of a job here. There are only two bays total, and they are taken up by CD and 3.5 inch drive.

fdisk might have a problem if you want to make d: a primary boot drive (probably C: is already). Better make a bootdisk with the […]
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fdisk might have a problem if you want to make d: a primary boot drive (probably C: is already).
Better make a bootdisk with the system, sys.com and fdisk.exe.
As d: is formatted with /s after putting it in the 486 boot from disk. Then activate the partition with fdisk, do a sys a: c: and a fdisk /mbr
Writing boot code is usually more reliable in the computer where it should boot.

In the past, the sys command always worked. Next time I might try the extra commands. I used ghost, resized to 252 MB and then added a second partition with fdisk. Except for the 32bit file access, it seems to work. Win 3.11 uses its own 32 bit driver, which could fail for various reasons. EIDE may be one of them. The large HDD is much faster, even without 32 bit access.

About the noise - simply use a newer HDD. It doesn't hurt the HDD if you just use the first 504 MB. All P-ATA HDDs should still support CHS.

You can be very proud of me - that is exactly what I did yesterday. The WD 2.5 GB drive is only used up to 504 MB. But it is rather quiet and much faster. I have a bunch of 40 GB disks as well, but I burn up the smaller ones first. I am unsure if I ever manage to fill the 504 MB anyway.

My CF cards support DMA fine, I may do benches if interested.
For more luxury there are even 3.5" or 5.25" bays for CF cards. Though I use a adapter directly at the mainboards IDE connector since I usually copy the stuff via LAN.

I have already looked into this: I found an adapter for a back slot. That would faciliate data transfer since the CF card would also fit into my regular machine's card reader.

Can I use a bigger CF card? Can I boot from it? Use ghost? Can I create partitions analogous to a HDD? Like 504 in Fat 16 and the rest in FAT32 or NTFS? And what card do you have?

ux-3 wrote:

Can I use a bigger CF card? Can I boot from it? Use ghost? Can I create partitions analogous to a HDD? Like 504 in Fat 16 and the rest in FAT32 or NTFS? And what card do you have?

Yes.
A CF card is Flash Memory with an IDE-Interface. It behaves and works exactly the same as a usual HDD. The layout of the pin connections is identical only the physical layout is smaller, so all you need is a passive adapter.
For just one drive per channel something like this will be sufficient:
http://www.reichelt.de/?ACTION=3;GROUP=M79;GR … f2e2cf7746742a7

I've had bad luck with large CF disks on old mainboards.

h-a-l-9000 wrote:

I've had bad luck with large CF disks on old mainboards.

What happened?
I'm interested because at one point all file systems (FAT32) on the 8GB CF card in my 486 got corrupted. The exact reason is unknown, and I used to blame it on an overclocked CPU / fastest possible timings in the BIOS / crappy onboard IDE controller / the possibility that the machine crashed during a write operation.
Fortunately I had a backup, and it never happened again. Apart from this single incident, I'm very happy with the CF card solution.

Do-not-want-reactions from the BIOS in my case.

Your BIOS does not want you??

Well, I would be thinking about a size of 2GB and a reader like this:
http://www.google.de/products/catalog?hl=de&q … 9&os=tech-specs

However, the OS list does not contain DOS.

Update: The MiroCRYSTAL 8S VLB card did arrive. It seems to work allright. I just didn't get the win drivers to install in win 3.11. Perhaps the disks are too old?

Yeah, bad disks are pretty likely. You should be able to use a generic S3 801/805 driver for it, though. You can get both the official MiroCrystal drivers and the generic S3 ones here.

ux-3 wrote:

Update: The MiroCRYSTAL 8S VLB card did arrive. It seems to work allright. I just didn't get the win drivers to install in win 3.11. Perhaps the disks are too old?

If you want the Miro drivers I believe they are here: http://www.mpoli.fi/files/hardware/DISPLAY/MIRO/index.html

I tried univbe. It reports VESA 1.2 compliance and identifies the correct chipset. The audio pauses are not affected though.

I DLed the linked miro drivers. The same problem during install occured. Perhaps the old Win 3.11 install has some fault. At the moment, I reverted to TSENG ET4000AX, since this card seems better suited for very old games. If in doubt about compatibility, a swap takes only a minute.

I have ordered a CF card and adapter for a back slot. I ordered a 4 GB card, cause I hope to be able to use the remaining space with other machines . 2GB would have cost the same.
I am curious if and how it works.

Yes it is possible to convert again back to new 486 by replacing all the defaulted and corrupted parts of the cpu with the new one. After that it will work smoothly without any trouble.

ux-3 wrote:

I just found a working 486. It has opti chipset, 1 MB Tseng ET4000 ISA graphics, 4MB, 200 MB HDD, two floppy drives, AMD 486DX 4 […]
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I just found a working 486. It has opti chipset, 1 MB Tseng ET4000 ISA graphics, 4MB, 200 MB HDD, two floppy drives, AMD 486DX 40 MHz. Two Slots have an extension, I assume VLB. It booted and when I typed win, it started win 3.11.
Win 3.11 looks incredibly cool and sharp on a 15" TFT.

Problems: I have no serial mouse. And the onboard rechargable battery leaked heavily. So I need to get rid of it and find some replacement. It is a little barrel with 3.6V and 60 mAh. I hope corrosion is not too bad already.

Would it be possible to swap the cpu for any other 486, like Intel DX2/66?

I used to run a AMD DX2 80mhz in in my old 486. There is also a DX4 120 that will work with the 40mhz bus. I'm not sure if any of the overdrive upgrades worked with the 40mhz bus that AMD used but I would try to retain that speed if possible. It's a noticeable improvement over 33mhz.

sliderider wrote:

ux-3 wrote:

I just found a working 486. It has opti chipset, 1 MB Tseng ET4000 ISA graphics, 4MB, 200 MB HDD, two floppy drives, AMD 486DX 4 […]
Show full quote

I just found a working 486. It has opti chipset, 1 MB Tseng ET4000 ISA graphics, 4MB, 200 MB HDD, two floppy drives, AMD 486DX 40 MHz. Two Slots have an extension, I assume VLB. It booted and when I typed win, it started win 3.11.
Win 3.11 looks incredibly cool and sharp on a 15" TFT.

Problems: I have no serial mouse. And the onboard rechargable battery leaked heavily. So I need to get rid of it and find some replacement. It is a little barrel with 3.6V and 60 mAh. I hope corrosion is not too bad already.

Would it be possible to swap the cpu for any other 486, like Intel DX2/66?

I used to run a AMD DX2 80mhz in in my old 486. There is also a DX4 120 that will work with the 40mhz bus. I'm not sure if any of the overdrive upgrades worked with the 40mhz bus that AMD used but I would try to retain that speed if possible. It's a noticeable improvement over 33mhz.

I don't think Intel ever made 486 cpu's which used a 40mhz fsb. Only one with 50mhz

Tetrium wrote:

sliderider wrote:

ux-3 wrote:

I just found a working 486. It has opti chipset, 1 MB Tseng ET4000 ISA graphics, 4MB, 200 MB HDD, two floppy drives, AMD 486DX 4 […]
Show full quote

I just found a working 486. It has opti chipset, 1 MB Tseng ET4000 ISA graphics, 4MB, 200 MB HDD, two floppy drives, AMD 486DX 40 MHz. Two Slots have an extension, I assume VLB. It booted and when I typed win, it started win 3.11.
Win 3.11 looks incredibly cool and sharp on a 15" TFT.

Problems: I have no serial mouse. And the onboard rechargable battery leaked heavily. So I need to get rid of it and find some replacement. It is a little barrel with 3.6V and 60 mAh. I hope corrosion is not too bad already.

Would it be possible to swap the cpu for any other 486, like Intel DX2/66?

I used to run a AMD DX2 80mhz in in my old 486. There is also a DX4 120 that will work with the 40mhz bus. I'm not sure if any of the overdrive upgrades worked with the 40mhz bus that AMD used but I would try to retain that speed if possible. It's a noticeable improvement over 33mhz.

I don't think Intel ever made 486 cpu's which used a 40mhz fsb. Only one with 50mhz

No, they didn't but he's starting with an AMD 40mhz and that did run on a 40mhz bus. I am assuming he will be wanting to keep the faster bus and upgrading to a DX2 or DX4 by AMD instead of going Intel and limiting himself to 33mhz max.