Hmm that sounds interesting. I guess I need to give Windows 95/98 a try one day...

I have a Live! 5.1 Digital and Audigy LS lying around here. They actually look quite alike. I guess the LS was a "value" card or something like that. The layout is almost the same as the Live! 5.1 Digital.

But the catch is the game must be able to run from within windows right?

PS: My SC-55 has Reverb and Chorus buttons on the front. Never played with them though 🤣

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

Hmm that sounds interesting. I guess I need to give Windows 95/98 a try one day... I have a Live! 5.1 Digital and Audigy LS lying around here. They actually look quite alike. I guess the LS was a "value" card or something like that. The layout is almost the same as the Live! 5.1 Digital. But the catch is the game must be able to run from within windows right?

Your SBLive! and Audigy will be able to load even some of the larger soundfonts, as they use shared PC system to load them (instead of SIMMs/memory modules like the AWEs).

For W9x, the game will have to be able to run in a DOS shell, as in native DOS these sound cards don't support soundfonts (the AWEs didn't either). But, when I was running W98SE (as late as about a year ago), I found that almost EVERY DOS game that I had ran fairly well in a DOS shell.

Now, that being said; WinXP (on a powerful enough PC) and using DOSBox, results in the same... you can use any soundfont for MIDI music playback. That's how I do it now, along with my custom soundfont.

BTW for you (or anyone else with a SBLive! and Windows XP SP2 or higher), to save you a bunch of chugging through Creatives Labs' absolute MESS of a web site... drivers and apps (in the order that you should install them):

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! Drivers - LiveDrvUni Pack (English)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
(1 - LiveDrvUni-Pack(ENG).exe)
Release Date: February 28, 2003
http://support.creative.com/downloads/downloa … DownloadId=1926
asia.creative.com/support/downloads/dow ... &details=1
ccfiles.creative.com/manualdn/Drivers/O ... k(ENG).exe

Creative PlayCenter 3
---------------------
(2 - PlayCenter3_02_52.exe)
Release Date : February 28, 2003
http://support.creative.com/downloads/downloa … DownloadId=1831
http://ccftp.creative.com/manualdn/Applicatio … nter3_02_52.exe

This package upgrades all versions of PlayCenter from v1.01.xx to v3.02.52 for
users running Windows 2000 and Windows XP. For NOMAD users, this package also
supports Windows 98, Windows 98 SE and Windows Millennium Edition.

This update:

1. Is required to update PlayCenter for use with the Live! DriverUni-Pack.
2. Upgrades the latest PlayCenter3 from previous PlayCenter from version
1.01.xx to 3.02.52.

Requirements:

This update will install ONLY if the following requirements are met:

* A previous version of PlayCenter or SBLive! DriverUni-Pack is installed.

Notes:

* If an earlier PlayCenter v1.55 is detected, users will be prompted to
uninstall PlayCenter v1.55 before the PlayCenter3 installation will proceed.
* If an earlier PlayCenter is not detected, installation will proceed without
WMA support for users running Windows 2000.
* For PlayCenter 3 to work properly, users will be prompted to download the
latest NOMAD 2 and NOMAD JukeBox drivers from www.NOMADworld.com if an older
NOMAD 2 v 1.4.2.12 or NOMAD JukeBox v1.3.3.0 is detected.

Creative PlayCenter Download for Creative Sound Blaster Live! series audio
cards version 3.02.70
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
(3 - PlCFull_PCApp_3_02_70.exe)
Release Date : December 24, 2003
http://support.creative.com/downloads/downloa … DownloadId=7488
http://ccfiles.creative.com/manualdn/Applicat … APP_3_02_70.exe

This download replaces the Creative PlayCenter application in your computer.
This version of PlayCenter is only applicable to Creative Sound Blaster Live!
series audio cards.

Fixes:

* Resolves functionality issues that occur after the LiveDrvUni-Pack file is
installed.
* Resolves playback issues that occur when Repeat or Random mode is selected in
Windows 2000 with Hyper-Threading systems.
* Resolves the playback issue that occurs when your computer returns from
Standby mode.

Requirements:

* Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000
* Creative PlayCenter installed
* Creative Sound Blaster Live! series audio card installed

Notes:

* To check if you have installed the LiveDrvUni-Pack driver update file, do the
following:
1. Click Start -> Settings -> Control Panel.
2. Locate and open the c:\windows\system32\drivers folder (replace c:\ with
the drive letter your operating system is installed on).
3. Right-click the ctaud2K.sys file and click Properties.
4. Click the Version tab.
5. Check if the version number is 5.12.1.252.
6. Click the OK button.
7. Repeat steps 3 to 6 for the ha10kx2k.sys file and check if the version
number is 5.12.1.250.

* If the ctaud2k.sys and ha10kx2k.sys files match the version numbers above,
you have installed the LiveDrvUni-Pack driver update file and may proceed to
install the Creative PlayCenter download.

* To install the download, double-click the download file and follow the
instructions on the screen.

Creative PlayCenter patch for Creative Sound Blaster Live! series audio cards
version 3.02.71
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
(4 - PlCPatch_PCApp_3_02_71.exe)
Release Date : February 23, 2004
http://support.creative.com/downloads/downloa … DownloadId=7579
http://ccfiles.creative.com/manualdn/Applicat … APP_3_02_71.exe

This patch upgrades your Creative PlayCenter application from version 3.02.67
to 3.02.71. It is only applicable to Creative Sound Blaster Live! series audio
cards in Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000.

Fixes:

* Resolves playback issues that occur when Repeat or Random mode is selected in
Windows 2000 with Hyper-Threading systems.
* Resolves the playback issue that occurs when your computer returns from
Standby mode.

Requirements:

* Microsoft Windows XP or Windows 2000
* Creative PlayCenter version 3.02.67 or later installed
* Creative Sound Blaster Live! series audio card installed

Notes:

* To check the version number of your Creative PlayCenter, do the following:
1. Launch Creative PlayCenter.
2. Click File -> About PlayCenter.
3. Check that your Creative PlayCenter application's version number is
3.02.67 or later.
* If your Creative PlayCenter application is version 3.02.67 or later, you may
proceed to download and install the Creative PlayCenter patch.
* If your Creative PlayCenter application is an earlier version, you must
download and install the PLCFULL_PCAPP_3_02_70.exe file included with the
"Creative PlayCenter Download for Creative Sound Blaster Live! series audio
cards". To install the PLCFULL_PCAPP_3_02_70.exe file, do the following:
1. Go to http://www.creative.com.
2. Click the Support link and select your region.
3. Click the DRIVERS SEARCH link.
4. Click the Search by file name box and type PLCFULL_PCAPP_3_02_70.exe.
5. Click the Search button.
6. Click the Download Now button.
* To install the patch, double-click the patch file and follow the instructions
on the screen.

Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! DriverPack - MiniDisc Center (English only)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
(5 - MiniDisc1_01_15.exe)
Release Date : July 17, 2002
http://support.creative.com/downloads/downloa … ?nDownloadId=97
http://ccftp.creative.com/manualdn/Applicatio … Disc1_01_15.exe

This package upgrades the Creative MiniDisc Center to version (1.01.15).

This update:

1. Enables the use of Creative MiniDisc Center with the Live! DriverPack.

Requirements:

This update will install ONLY if the following requirements are met:

* Live! DriverPack is installed.
* Creative SB Live! series audio card installed.
* For Windows 2000 & Windows XP users ONLY.

Creative Disc Detector Patch
----------------------------
(6 - DDInsUpd.exe)
Release Date : April 1, 2003
http://support.creative.com/downloads/downloa … DownloadId=2146
http://ccftp.creative.com/manualdn/Applicatio … 46/DDINSUPD.EXE

This patch is for products bundled with Creative Disc Detector. When Disc
Detector is installed in your computer, the Autorun or Autoplay feature in
Windows may become disabled.

Download this patch only if the Autorun or Autoplay feature is disabled; there
is no need to download it otherwise.

INSTALLING THE CREATIVE DISC DETECTOR INSTALLATION PATCH UTILITY

1) Copy the DDInsUpd.exe file into any folder on your hard disk.
2) Double-click the DDInsUpd.EXE file. The utility runs automatically.

If for some reason, you need to reinstall Disc Detector, run this patch again.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Wow that's some amazing information right there... Bookmarked!

I like the idea with XP and DOSBox.

Any idea if sound fonts are supported with newer cards / Vista / W7? E.g. X-Fi range perhaps? Or did Creative stop using sound fonts with these new cards?

EDIT: Looks like it does!

rfnagel, thanks very much for your help, really appreciated! I was able to edit your 55MB .sf2, to make it equal to approximately 28MB, and load it in to the AWE64! Also, I played some .mid tunes using the Weeds GM3 sound font bank, and found one that I particularly liked. It's from the old Roland SCC-1 installation files, which includes 6 demo .mid files. I like demo2.mid the best, and I've included it as a download link below -

http://www.mediafire.com/?z8337opr3337jo7 (3D stereo enabled)

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

Wow that's some amazing information right there... Bookmarked!

Glad to be of help 😀 I remember when first building my current rig, I had NO choice but to use WinDoZe XP (couldn't find W98SE drivers for the hardware). I figured "How hard could it be to find the WXP drivers for my new SBLive?".

With Creative Lab's trashpile of a web site, EXTREMELY difficult! Especially trying to figure out, what should I install first, what should I install second, etc...

BTW, at first I had no plans of installing the Creative Playcenter (I'd just as soon use a nother media player). I later found out/discovered that the Creative Playcenter can temporarily load a specific custom soundfont for specific MIDI files "on the fly" 😀

If you play a MIDI file in Creative Playcenter, and there is a matching soundfont filename (e.g. "A Really Great Tune.mid" and "A Really Great Tune.sf2"), Playcenter will first load the soundfont (temporarily) into memory, and then play the MIDI file. When closing Playcenter, it will unload the custom soundfont. Cool! 😀

This is something that I had always wished for... way back in my W311 days, and then on to my W98SE days.

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

I like the idea with XP and DOSBox.

That is REALLY the way to go! I have an Intel P4 2.666Ghz CPU with 512MB RAM; running Windows XP (and recently installed) Service Pack 3; and I can play just about 99.9% of my old DOS games... all with GREAT MIDI music from my SBLive! and my custom soundfont 😀

I've said it here at Vogons before, and I'll say it again... if it wasn't for DOSBox, I'd **STILL** be using my old AMD500 and P233MMX with Windows 98 SE <grin>!

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

Any idea if sound fonts are supported with newer cards / Vista / W7? E.g. X-Fi range perhaps? Or did Creative stop using sound fonts with these new cards? EDIT: Looks like it does!

Yep yep, the newer Creative Labs sound cards (such as the X-Fi) do indeed support soundfonts, and Creative Labs even has a special Vista driver CD for them (dunno about W7 though).

Heh, when I first got my SBLive! I even bought the X-Fi Vista driver CD (it was only a few bucks), as among other things, it also included a new largish GM compatable soundfont "28MB Creative Labs GM Release 1.0" (28MBGM.sf2).

Hehe, a side note, I disovered that Creative Labs made an error when compiling this one... the soundfont is *MISSING* patch #34 (Picked Bass)! Whoops <grin>!

retro games 100 wrote:

rfnagel, thanks very much for your help, really appreciated!

Yer welcome!

retro games 100 wrote:

It's from the old Roland SCC-1 installation files, which includes 6 demo .mid files. I like demo2.mid the best

Hehe, based on your pic of the directory listing, I'm now gonna have to see if I can dig up those MIDI files on the Internet <grin> 😀

P.S. (re: the SoundFont Control Panel applet) Heh, that's how mine on all of my AWE32s used to look ALL of the time... all "red" with hardly any "green" <LOL>! 😀

The X-Fi cards are actually really really really easy to install 🤣

Under XP / Vista / 7 you just pop in the Driver CD. If you like install everything or just the items you want. After installing and rebooting and runs an "auto updater" which goes on line and updates every single component.

Vienna SoundFont Studio clearly lists the X-Fi so it looks good.

I loved XP but ever since I purchased Windows 7 I'm officially done with XP. It's a real joy to work with, partly thanks to Vista as pipe cleaner 🤣

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

The X-Fi cards are actually really really really easy to install 🤣 Under XP / Vista / 7 you just pop in the Driver CD. If you like install everything or just the items you want.

Hehe, I got my SBLive! as a used card (US$12... not a bad deal 😀 )... didn't have any driver CD for it at all. Had a helluva time finding everything on Creative's web site.

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

After installing and rebooting and runs an "auto updater" which goes on line and updates every single component.

For me, online updaters are usually a no-go... too damned slow on my miserable dialup connection out here in the woods <grin>.

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

Vienna SoundFont Studio clearly lists the X-Fi so it looks good.

I'm not sure what version was installed with your CD-ROM, I'm assuming maybe v2.4? If so (what I was talking about before), snag version 2.3... that v2.4 is a REAL mess <IMHO>. The ONLY reason that I have v2.4 installed (along with v2.3) is that version 2.4 can change the SBLive's soundfont cache to from "dynamic" to "static"... can't seem to find ANY other utility to do that.

I found the demo MIDI files here: http://personal.inet.fi/peli/militarist/scc1-e.html (Roland SCC-1 Utility disk -> http://personal.inet.fi/peli/militarist/scc1/SCC201U.ZIP ). Looks like they're some of the same that I already have from the Roland Sound Canvas SC-88 Pro demo MIDI files, and the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas demo MIDI files 😀

Anyhoo, on the same page I found this: Roland SCC-1B Utility disk -> http://personal.inet.fi/peli/militarist/scc1/SCC1B.ZIP ... which among other things, includes the old "Band in a Box" for DOS. MAN! I hadn't seen that one in EONS <grin>!

Ahhh.... the memories 😀

Ok got a X-Fi XtremeMusic underway. 40 bucks shipped isn't too bad I believe...

Had a look on the Creative support site and found the basic "no thrills" drivers for Windows 7 64 bit.

And also this application:

SoundFont Bank Manager […]
Show full quote

SoundFont Bank Manager

SoundFont Bank Manager is an application that gives you easy access and precise control over your SoundFont banks. With SoundFont Bank Manager you can:

•load, replace or remove SoundFont banks onto your computer's memory.
•organize, create and copy SoundFont presets.
•allocate or adjust the cache memory for SoundFont banks.
•audition all your SoundFont banks and presets with the virtual keyboard.

I guess is all I need?

I will also source a X-Fi Windows 7 installation disc (which has all the extras), but usually I prefer the barebone drivers directly from the Creative site.

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

Ok got a X-Fi XtremeMusic underway. 40 bucks shipped isn't too bad I believe...

Good deal 😀

Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

And also this application: SoundFont Bank Manager

AFAIK the "SoundFont Bank Manager" is similar to the SBLive's "SoundFont" portion/applet of it's "Audio Headquarters", and I think it basically serves the same purpose. Not sure how you change/edit the EAX (Environmental Audio) settings/presets though.

If you wish to actually edit soundfonts, you'll still need the Vienna SoundFont Studio though.

(Edit) P.S. I remember now why I specifically searched for an SBLive! (verses the X-Fi)... for the gameport connector (that the X-Fi doesn't have) so's I could connect all of my gameport devices, as well as using my gameport MIDI cable to connect my old Casio CZ-1 MIDI keyboard 😀

Ah! Band in a box! Thanks for rekindling my memory. Totally forgotten about it.

Re: Band in a box. I had a look on the net, and it's still going strong. I watched some videos of it on their website, and it looks impressive.

http://www.pgmusic.com/bbdemovideos.htm

retro games 100 wrote:

Re: Band in a box. I had a look on the net, and it's still going strong.

Two things: It's amazing how strong the program is still going after all of these years, and it's amazing how far that it has developed throughout the years 😀

Not many (smaller) software companies last as long.

P.S. BIAB for DOS works great in DOSBox, minus the MIDI IN though.

Almost forgot, a few more packs of MIDIs that sound quite good:

Anything sequenced by Jeremy Dimmick... he's sequenced a lot of Classical stuff, all of them "true to score". BTW, he also has a soundfont of his own; "Sinfonia", and "Sinfonietta" (the smaller version of "Sinfonia").

http://www.users.waitrose.com/~floatingworld/music.htm
http://www.users.waitrose.com/~floatingworld/sinfonia.htm

Also, if you can find the MIDIs from Transport Tycoon Deluxe, as well as the intro theme tune from the original Transport Tycoon (it's different, a jazzier sounding tune than the TTDLX version). The TTDLX music by John Broomhall is great 😀

Almost forgot, way back from my TTDLX days; when I wanted to let other TTDLX fans "hear what I heard" <grin> (ZIPped MP3s) -> http://www.cmoo.com/snor/weeds/ttmusic.htm 😀

rfnagel: Chris Hülsbeck more, than just rock. He fucking rocks, and if it wasnt for him and other C64 pioneers, we would not have had so many AWESOME soundtracks for that computer, and Chris Hülsbeck needs some serious respect for making the original Giana Sisters soundtrack, and hell I prefer listening to that soundtrack over Mario Brothers, cause if you like me, has heard one version of The Great Giana Sisters theme, you have seen there are more than 20 extra cover versions of that theme (I have around 70+ different covers of theme in my collection) , and with Mario. There are so many themes to choose from, but with GS, there are not many melodies to choose from in comparison, and until I see proof of it, then I would say that there are more cover / tributes of the main theme from Giana Sisters than there are from Super Mario Brothers Theme. But oh well sorry for going off topic, and hey rfnagel, you can from now get your umlaut from here " ¨ " or here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_umlaut, and that goes out to every one who wants to write Über the correct way, but when it comes to pronounce it, then you are on your own 😉

WolverineDK wrote:

and hey rfnagel, you can from now get your umlaut from here " ¨ " or here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanic_umlaut, and that goes out to every one who wants to write Über the correct way, but when it comes to pronounce it, then you are on your own 😉

Hehe, as one from German decent, I should have known that <grin> 😀 But, I DO know how to type in the "¥" "Weeds" sign (i.e. "Rich ¥Weeds¥ Nagel") <LOL>!

Anyow, Chris Hülsbeck is definitely an awesome composer, no doubt about that 😀 I listen to the Extreme Assault CD, even still today. The guy should have been scoring blockbuster movies 😀

The Cursed Thing That Creative Made 28MB Soundfont