best windows 98 agp card

Discussion about old graphics cards, monitors and video related things.

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby KT7AGuy » 2018-3-08 @ 01:58

rodimus80 wrote:What RAMsinks did you use for your Ti 4600?


Whatever I happen to have handy. Many models of GF4 Ti4600 came with no RAMSinks at all, so I consider anything an improvement. For awhile, I had a bunch of these RAMsinks from the EverCool EC-VC-RF kits:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product. ... 6835119079

Whatever is cheap and fits is pretty good. I'm not picky. These eBay cheapies look pretty good:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/8Pcs-Aluminium ... 2623226904

I always remove sticky adhesive and use thermal epoxy to affix them. Arctic Alumina was my preferred brand, but it has been discontinued. I guess I'll have to find something else now.

There are sellers on eBay and Amazon that still have Arctic Alumina in stock. There's also a shop called LED Supply that has it for $10, free shipping:

https://www.ledsupply.com/accessories/a ... l-adhesive

Anybody ever order anything from these guys? Are they legit? I'd like to get one more kit before they become unobtainable. Thermal Adhesive does have a limited shelf life. You can refrigerate this stuff to make it last longer, but it eventually becomes unusable.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby shamino » 2018-3-08 @ 04:49

KT7AGuy wrote:I always remove sticky adhesive and use thermal epoxy to affix them. Arctic Alumina was my preferred brand, but it has been discontinued. I guess I'll have to find something else now.

I guess that explains why I didn't find it in stock at a decent price when I looked recently. Don't remember anymore where I was searching - probably Amazon and NewEgg. I didn't dig very deep.

There are sellers on eBay and Amazon that still have Arctic Alumina in stock. There's also a shop called LED Supply that has it for $10, free shipping:

https://www.ledsupply.com/accessories/a ... l-adhesive

Anybody ever order anything from these guys? Are they legit? I'd like to get one more kit before they become unobtainable. Thermal Adhesive does have a limited shelf life. You can refrigerate this stuff to make it last longer, but it eventually becomes unusable.

No idea about that seller, but yeah I should probably get some more of it as well. I bought it something like 10 years ago but only used it a couple of times. The tubes have plenty left but I'm pretty sure at least one of the 2 parts has all turned into concrete.
Last time I used it was to attach a socket-7 heatsink to the 875P chipset of an MSI Pentium 4 motherboard. I thought I wanted to use that board, then realized I hated it. Now I want the heatsink back. :)

I have some upcoming projects I might need more adhesive for. I've thought about trying JB Weld but the internet says it won't work well. I've never seen an objective test of that though.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-08 @ 13:44

kanecvr wrote:This is a broad question. There's no such thing as "best windows 98 agp card". If you want to know what the fastest AGP video card with win98 drivers is, that would be the X850XT - but there's more to it than that.

For every machine, there's an appropriate video card. If the video card is too new, it will cause compatibility problem at a driver level (in some cases even at a hardware level) - for example using a GF 6800 in a pentium 3. You loose about 3/4 of the card's performance because the CPU and AGP interface are too slow to cope. Here's a few good examples of balanced builds:

- Skt 939 Athlon 64 (3800+ or faster) single core or a fast LGA775 P4 like the 660 or 670 + Radeon X850XT or GF 6800 ultra - this is the fastest you can go with win98.
- Skt 478 P4 (3GHz+) or Athlon XP 3200+ with a GF FX 5900XT or Radeon 9800
- Skt 478 P4 (2.4GHz+) or an Athon XP (2400+) with a Gefroce 4 Titanium 4600 or a Radeon 9700 PRO
- PIII 1.4GHz or Athlon (non-XP, 1333Mhz) + Geforce 4 Ti4200
- PIII 1GHz or Duron/Athlon + Radeon 8500 / Gerforce 3 Ti500

It all depends on what you want to play.


sorry to bump an old post, but im looking for the best graphics cards for my system, my specs
asus p3v4x via apollo pro 133a latest bios
intel pIII 1ghz slot 1 133fsb
2x256mb crucial 133mhz memory
sound blaster audigy 2 zs wdm driver
sound blaster awe64 value

i have tested a bunch of cards on this build, a gf4 ti4400, fx 5500, fx 5700ve 256mb, tnt2, radeon 9600 all in wonder, voodoo3 3000 agp, all of the later more powerful cards perform like crap, i can tell the cards are being held back by the cpu, the voodoo3 3000 performs pretty well, so does the tnt2, but im looking for the best card to pair with this build, would a gf2 or gf3 be a better option?
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2018-3-08 @ 18:50

with this machine, I would go for a GF3-ti200 passiv. Fast enough, pixelshaders, silent, great compatibility.
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby squiggly » 2018-3-08 @ 19:14

sliderider wrote:
bestemor wrote:
Malik wrote:For me, the first choice will be the 6800 Ultra if possible, and will settle for a plain 6800 if not. But NOT those newer 6800 GT, GS or XT ones.

Second choice will be Radeon 9800XT.

Third will be a Geforce 4 Ti 4800. <---- Because I had very good experience in terms of compatibility with this baby.


What's wrong with the GT or GS models ? :confused:


6800 Ultra cards are cheap and more powerful so why settle for budget models?


Yeah but try and find a cheap AGP version.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-08 @ 19:15

dr.zeissler wrote:with this machine, I would go for a GF3-ti200 passiv. Fast enough, pixelshaders, silent, great compatibility.


i will order one up this weekend, do you have a similar spec machine that you can run a few games on to see how mine stacks up against it? im trying to rule out bottle necks the best i can
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby candle_86 » 2018-3-08 @ 19:48

You can get away with faster, my P3 800 uses an FX 5900 Ultra
Ryzen 5 1600 - Gigabyte B350 Gaming - 16gb DDR4 3200 - 240GB M.2 - Windows 10 Pro
Core i3 3470 - Dell B75 Mobo - 4gb DDR3 1333 - 500gb HDD - Windows XP
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-08 @ 20:24

candle_86 wrote:You can get away with faster, my P3 800 uses an FX 5900 Ultra



yeah but i have tried to use a geforce4 ti 4400 and it cant max need for speed 3 or 4 out @1024x768, the fps dip to the low 30's
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby shamino » 2018-3-08 @ 23:48

lilkuz2005 wrote:sorry to bump an old post, but im looking for the best graphics cards for my system, my specs
asus p3v4x via apollo pro 133a latest bios
intel pIII 1ghz slot 1 133fsb
2x256mb crucial 133mhz memory
sound blaster audigy 2 zs wdm driver
sound blaster awe64 value

i have tested a bunch of cards on this build, a gf4 ti4400, fx 5500, fx 5700ve 256mb, tnt2, radeon 9600 all in wonder, voodoo3 3000 agp, all of the later more powerful cards perform like crap, i can tell the cards are being held back by the cpu, the voodoo3 3000 performs pretty well, so does the tnt2, but im looking for the best card to pair with this build, would a gf2 or gf3 be a better option?


lilkuz2005 wrote:
dr.zeissler wrote:with this machine, I would go for a GF3-ti200 passiv. Fast enough, pixelshaders, silent, great compatibility.


i will order one up this weekend, do you have a similar spec machine that you can run a few games on to see how mine stacks up against it? im trying to rule out bottle necks the best i can


It seems that I've generally seen people regard Geforce4 Ti cards as improved Geforce3s. Does the Geforce3 actually have an advantage in a CPU limited situation?
Is the advantage just that it supports older drivers?
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-10 @ 17:39

All I can tell you is i have tested numerous drivers for the ti4400, tested a few via 4in1 drivers, manually installed the GART drivers, and the card still has major dips in fps with most games, I'm looking for a 440bx motherboard to rule out the via chipset as a performance issue
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby bytesaber » 2018-3-10 @ 18:31

Is anyone familiar with vedors and model numbers for the 8x Geforce4 TI4800 ? The only picture I have seen is an Albatron with the cooler removed.

I have not seen very many old reviews or images of high end 4x or 8x Geforce4 cards.

I did stumble upon an image on ebay for a broken Asus V8460, a 4x version of the TI4600.

Maybe the earth is depleted of these. I would be interested to know identities anyone would be willing to share for any 4x or 8x Geforce4 TI4xxx cards.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby squiggly » 2018-3-10 @ 19:33

lilkuz2005 wrote:All I can tell you is i have tested numerous drivers for the ti4400, tested a few via 4in1 drivers, manually installed the GART drivers, and the card still has major dips in fps with most games, I'm looking for a 440bx motherboard to rule out the via chipset as a performance issue


Wow sounds like Phil read your comment and made a vid about it: https://youtu.be/HRhm4aGNI3o
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby KT7AGuy » 2018-3-10 @ 23:51

bytesaber wrote:Is anyone familiar with vedors and model numbers for the 8x Geforce4 TI4800 ? The only picture I have seen is an Albatron with the cooler removed.

I have not seen very many old reviews or images of high end 4x or 8x Geforce4 cards.

I did stumble upon an image on ebay for a broken Asus V8460, a 4x version of the TI4600.

Maybe the earth is depleted of these. I would be interested to know identities anyone would be willing to share for any 4x or 8x Geforce4 TI4xxx cards.


I've got a Ti4600 8X (aka Ti4800) in one of my PCs. I didn't realize when I bought it that it was an 8X model. It was a pleasant surprise and I was curious, so I benchmarked it against some of my regular Ti4600 4X models. I was surprised to find that the 8X model performed ever so slightly worse in benchmarks. If you like, I'll snap some photos of it later and send them to you.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby bytesaber » 2018-3-11 @ 00:38

KT7AGuy wrote: If you like, I'll snap some photos...


I would not stop you if you chose to :happy: Don't go to too much trouble though. Just been curious about Geforce4 history recently. Seems like another fun chapter I missed. Would be interested in the vendor and model number too.

KT7AGuy wrote: I was surprised to find that the 8X model performed ever so slightly worse...


I have heard that the 4x and 8x variants don't really differ from reading multiple testimonies. But I currently have a suspicion that the 8x cards might be a bit healthier. They seem to all have larger coolers on them, top and bottom. Just an observation though from browsing ebay and images. Could be a bogus claim.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby nforce4max » 2018-3-11 @ 03:49

lilkuz2005 wrote:All I can tell you is i have tested numerous drivers for the ti4400, tested a few via 4in1 drivers, manually installed the GART drivers, and the card still has major dips in fps with most games, I'm looking for a 440bx motherboard to rule out the via chipset as a performance issue


I've always considered those VIA chipsets from the era to be slower than what Intel produced at the time, the memory controller certainly felt like it was the bottleneck.
On a far away planet reading your posts in the year 10,191.
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-11 @ 07:36

Wow sounds like Phil read your comment and made a vid about it: https://youtu.be/HRhm4aGNI3o[/quote]

Yeah Phil is very helpful, I'm really glad that he takes his time messing with old hardware, he also takes time and responds to fans comments, pretty good guy if you ask me
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby KT7AGuy » 2018-3-12 @ 05:12

shamino wrote:
KT7AGuy wrote:There are sellers on eBay and Amazon that still have Arctic Alumina in stock. There's also a shop called LED Supply that has it for $10, free shipping:

https://www.ledsupply.com/accessories/a ... l-adhesive


No idea about that seller, but yeah I should probably get some more of it as well.


For anybody who is curious, I went ahead and placed an order with LED Supply. They're legit. The item was delivered fast and free, although the Arctic Alumina adhesive is a bulk pack. That's not a problem to me.

Also:

bytesaber wrote:
KT7AGuy wrote: If you like, I'll snap some photos...


I would not stop you if you chose to :happy: Don't go to too much trouble though.


Here is the exact same EVGA GeForce 4 Ti4600-8X (aka Ti4800) that I own:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product. ... 6814130137

I didn't bother snapping any pics of mine because it no longer looks like it originally did. As I mentioned previously, I used thermal epoxy to affix RAMsinks to all the modules and I also replaced the OEM HSF.

I also have a Gainward model that is apparently somewhat unique. The only images I can find of the model I have are here:

http://www.shaunchng.com/2002/09/19/tut ... troduction
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-12 @ 11:47

i took a few pics of my geforce4 ti 4400 when i was replacing the stock cooler with a little better aftermarket cooler
https://i.imgur.com/l6U8IDy.jpg
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby lilkuz2005 » 2018-3-27 @ 15:48

i just got a gainward geforce3 this week from ebay $27.50 a plus shipping, a bit higher then i wanted to pay but it looks brand new, well im getting the same dips in fps in pretty much the same places in all the games i have been testing, im leaning towards a motherboard issue, seeing as old posts dating back to 2000-2003 report issue with via chipsets on intel motherboards, they seem to be fine on amd systems but struggle with intel, anyway i have a new asus p3b-f v1.04 ordered, should be here sometime this week, it has the i440bx chipset that was all the rage back in the day, i really hope this fixes my issues, i have struggled with this asus P3V4X v1.02 for about a year now, tested like 8 graphics cards and they all seem to show the same performance issues, looking at Phils amazing 1400+ benchmark video really makes me think i should be looking for a geforce2 gts, that may be the best graphics card for win9x, not the quickest in later games but very strong in older ones, maybe this new board with a better chipset will play nice with either my new geforce3 or my geforce4 ti 4400, i sure hope so
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Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby KT7AGuy » 2018-3-27 @ 22:38

lilkuz2005 wrote:looking at Phils amazing 1400+ benchmark video really makes me think i should be looking for a geforce2 gts, that may be the best graphics card for win9x, not the quickest in later games but very strong in older ones


I have come to realize that "best graphics card for Win9x" is very subjective and should be selected to best complete the required task. Generally speaking, for systems 1ghz or slower, I think a Voodoo 3 is best for the job. Matrox G400 Max with a Voodoo 2 is also a nice choice. Faster than 1ghz should get a GeForce 2, 3, or 4.

Truly, an argument can be made that any game that needs more than 1ghz is better enjoyed under WinXP, but I'm still fond of my 1.4ghz and faster Win98SE systems. There are a several games that simply run better under Win9x and higher framerates are quite nice.

I've seen Phil's video regarding performance issues with GF3, GF4, and FX cards. He seems to focus primarily on older titles in his videos. Expendable is one of his favorites for benchmarking, for example. However, I don't build Win9x systems to focus on older titles. I want my systems to be able to run almost any DOS or Win9x title, so I tend to choose 1ghz or faster processors along with GeForce 4 cards. While Phil is correct that my GF4 card won't run those older titles at their absolute best possible performance, it will run those old games and newer titles as well and all at acceptable performance levels.
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