best windows 98 agp card

Discussion about old graphics cards, monitors and video related things.

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dexvx » 2017-10-04 @ 06:13

Also to consider... wasn't NVidia's 3d image quality subpar until the FX series?
dexvx
Oldbie
 
Posts: 725
Joined: 2017-3-07 @ 03:32
Location: USA

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby WildW » 2017-10-04 @ 07:30

dr.zeissler wrote:I currently use a GF6200-AGP passive 64Bit in my P4/1,6 Ghz (38TDP!). It is a very good card, even for 64Bit. I can run the early Radeon8500 up to 9700 radeon demos, and the matrox-reef-demo (3d-analyze). The GF4 demos do not run good, don't know why, the (older)Games I tested so far are very good in terms of visual quality and performance. I am currently thinking about testing an other card, but which DX9/win98/agp4x 1,5volt card is silent and only uses a single slot? (and is better then my gf6200)


I have a Radeon 9600 Pro that is single slot, passively cooled and should be somewhat faster than a 6200 - really quite happy with it. I would love a Geforce 6600 but the only passive ones I've ever found are PCI Express.
User avatar
WildW
Newbie
 
Posts: 82
Joined: 2017-1-24 @ 08:57

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-04 @ 08:08

There are lot's of different ATI 9xxx models available.

- What model do you use?
- Does it Support dos-vesa mode 2x or 3x like GF6200? (used for Win3x256color Driver and Deluxepaint)

interesting competition: http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php ... &card2=198
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby KT7AGuy » 2017-10-04 @ 10:22

I've seen several people talk about Ti4600 cards failing due to overheating over the years. Has anybody actually ever experienced this happening? I've got several of them in use in several different PCs. After adding RAMsinks and aftermarket coolers, they seem to run just as cool as any Ti4200 I've ever used. Of course, the only testing I ever did was the ol' "touch it and see if it burns my finger" benchmark.

These are the coolers I like to use on them:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-DC-12Volt-2 ... 1523857651

Cheap and highly effective.

The only NVIDIA cards that have ever failed on me were a GF3 Ti500 and an FX 5900 Ultra. Both developed the same problem: artifacting and video glitches due to bad RAM.
User avatar
KT7AGuy
Oldbie
 
Posts: 898
Joined: 2012-11-30 @ 19:21
Location: Chicago

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby Jade Falcon » 2017-10-04 @ 15:50

I seen a few OEM system with ti4200 that failed do to overheating, well the fans did die on them.
Jade Falcon
BANNED
 
Posts: 3217
Joined: 2016-5-08 @ 19:23
Location: Nar Shaddaa.

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-04 @ 18:05

Oh man, that's a pity!

I am nearly satisfied with the gf6200 but the image-quality in low-res dos-gaming with dvi is REALLY bad, on VGA it's REALLY good.
So I put another 6200 in it and guess what...BAD image with DVI. I put a GF3-ti200 in it, and DVI is also bad! NV are you nuts?

I put a x800 all-in-wonder in that same machine, beside that it has serveral new issues in dosgaming that the nv-cards did not
have it has a excellent DVI lowres output, seems to be reference like matrox mga-series with the better dac.

I cannot use the x800 through different reasons, but I want a sharp dvi-output in lowres. so I ordered an 9600pro.
I will report the output quality perhaps next week when it arrives.

NV you did a BAD job on DVI!
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby firage » 2017-10-04 @ 21:09

Maybe the DVI will look better if you can disable scaling; blocking the display's EDID might do something(?). Mind, without GPU scaling the display needs to actually be able to support input in the other display modes.
User avatar
firage
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1058
Joined: 2013-1-06 @ 21:43
Location: Finland

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-04 @ 21:27

in DOS?
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby firage » 2017-10-04 @ 22:35

That's right. Some or most others didn't do this, but NVIDIA's DVI output is in your display's native resolution and refresh rate in DOS.

The "fix" could be as simple as disconnecting some pins in the DVI cable.
Last edited by firage on 2017-10-04 @ 22:58, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
firage
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1058
Joined: 2013-1-06 @ 21:43
Location: Finland

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-04 @ 22:57

currently r9000pro in that same machine. DVI output is excellent, performance is remarkable slower then the gf6200.
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-04 @ 23:01

firage wrote:That's right. Some or most others didn't do this, but NVIDIA's DVI output is in your display's native resolution and refresh rate in DOS.


it's very blurry an DVI with 6200 so for me the better option is to use VGA instead, even if I had to use the additional wiring for the voodoo and not a centered image between textmode in dos and 320x200.
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby The Serpent Rider » 2017-10-05 @ 10:03

JidaiGeki wrote:other brands may exist, Galaxy maybe?

Galaxy GeForce 7900GS AGP does exist and compatible with AGP 3.3v motherboards.
User avatar
The Serpent Rider
Oldbie
 
Posts: 883
Joined: 2017-3-25 @ 19:07
Location: Stagnant Demesne

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-05 @ 10:30

is it possible that a DVI only GF6200 has a sharper lowres (320x200) picture quality or is all the same due to a bad implementation by Nvidia?
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-05 @ 11:20

https://rhymeswithtoaster.com/2013/12/2 ... tallation/

can't see that this helps for the DVI dos output in lowres gfx (320x200 and textmode 720x400).
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-05 @ 11:24

CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby FFXIhealer » 2017-10-05 @ 14:53

Didn't Phil's Computer Lab just recently post a video on this topic? His choice for the "ultimate Windows 98 AGP card" was a GeForce 4 Ti 4600. And since Phil is the retro god here... LOL
Image
Image
Image
Image
FFXIhealer
Oldbie
 
Posts: 526
Joined: 2016-6-22 @ 17:42
Location: Lake Charles, Louisiana (U.S.A.)

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby shamino » 2017-10-05 @ 15:06

KT7AGuy wrote:I've seen several people talk about Ti4600 cards failing due to overheating over the years. Has anybody actually ever experienced this happening?

If the cooling stays intact, then I don't know if any of the cards in this family run particularly hot. It's hard to tell since they don't have sensors. I think the biggest problem these cards have is mechanical failure of the cooling. I don't think they generally overheat when everything is working correctly.
I've had 3 Ti4200 cards, 1 of which was DOA and the other 2 had cooling failures.

I don't know what happened to the DOA card, but it's fan was still good. It will run up until you install AGP drivers, and then it black screens. If you can manage to prevent AGP drivers from being installed, the card will run like a PCI card just fine. It's even stable in 3D stress testing as long as you manage to keep it from going into AGP mode. Performance is greatly crippled that way though.
Probably the weirdest failure I've seen on a graphics card.

Card #2 had the fan start to go bad. It was replaced before damage was done, but it would have surely led to a dead GPU if not noticed.

Card #3 was NOS. It was used in a relative's PC for 1-2yrs. One of the cheap plastic fork shaped heatsink pegs came loose and the card was found dead.

I also have the Quadro version of a Ti4600. That card still has plastic heatsink pegs but they're a better type that are conical, so I think they're a lot less likely to ever pop out. No idea if the fan is higher quality or not.
User avatar
shamino
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1373
Joined: 2013-1-24 @ 13:45

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby dr.zeissler » 2017-10-05 @ 17:44

FFXIhealer wrote:Didn't Phil's Computer Lab just recently post a video on this topic? His choice for the "ultimate Windows 98 AGP card" was a GeForce 4 Ti 4600. And since Phil is the retro god here... LOL


but he did not mention the dvi-scaler under dos.
CPU: PII 133-333 MOBO: SNI-D981 RAM: 512- FDD: Dualfloppy 3,5"HD/5,25"HD - 3,5"HD - 5,25"DD ISA-Catweasel HDD: 2x40GB - DVD
ISA(3): Audician32-S2Dreamblaster - GusACE PCI(3): Monster3D- Intel NW AGP(1): 3dfx V3-3000
dr.zeissler
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1419
Joined: 2011-9-28 @ 15:33

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby KT7AGuy » 2017-10-05 @ 20:15

shamino wrote:
KT7AGuy wrote:I've seen several people talk about Ti4600 cards failing due to overheating over the years. Has anybody actually ever experienced this happening?

If the cooling stays intact, then I don't know if any of the cards in this family run particularly hot. It's hard to tell since they don't have sensors. I think the biggest problem these cards have is mechanical failure of the cooling. I don't think they generally overheat when everything is working correctly.


I've been paranoid about fan failures ever since graphics cards started using active cooling. It's what led me to start installing fan failure alarms on all of them. If you look around on eBay, you can still find some available. The ones I use look like this:

http://aerocooler.com/evercool-ec-as-c- ... rm-sensor/

https://www.startech.com/support/FANALARM

Of course, these aren't the only options available for detecting fan failures. Other solutions exist as well. Just search around.

I've always considered alarms like these mandatory for video cards or motherboards that don't have an onboard sensor for detecting a failure. When did onboard failure alarms start becoming standard on cards? I think the earliest I have with onboard audible failure detection is my 6800 GT. I could swear that my FX 5950 Ultra card will alert during POST, but has no audible alarm. I could be wrong about that.
User avatar
KT7AGuy
Oldbie
 
Posts: 898
Joined: 2012-11-30 @ 19:21
Location: Chicago

Re: best windows 98 agp card

Postby rodimus80 » 2018-3-07 @ 08:59

KT7AGuy wrote:I've seen several people talk about Ti4600 cards failing due to overheating over the years. Has anybody actually ever experienced this happening? I've got several of them in use in several different PCs. After adding RAMsinks and aftermarket coolers, they seem to run just as cool as any Ti4200 I've ever used. Of course, the only testing I ever did was the ol' "touch it and see if it burns my finger" benchmark.

These are the coolers I like to use on them:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-DC-12Volt-2 ... 1523857651

Cheap and highly effective.

The only NVIDIA cards that have ever failed on me were a GF3 Ti500 and an FX 5900 Ultra. Both developed the same problem: artifacting and video glitches due to bad RAM.


What RAMsinks did you use for your Ti 4600?
User avatar
rodimus80
Member
 
Posts: 190
Joined: 2013-12-31 @ 19:34

PreviousNext

Return to Video

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Error 0x7CF, swaaye and 0 guests