VOGONS


First post, by N3T

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By mistake I posted at Eddie. After been notified I moved to this new área, sorry for the inconvenience.

Previus post: Need some advices for a new retropc build

A long story short, I'm planning to build a retropc mainly for this list of games:

Game Sistem Year Minium Specs
Blood DOS 1997 Pentium/16MB
Carmageddon DOS 1997 Pentium/8MB/CD
Carmageddon2 Win95 1998 Pentium/16MB
Clive Barker's Undying Win95 2001 Pentium II/64MB (not necessary)
Daytona USA Deluxe Win95 1997 Pentium/16MB
Elder Scrolls Red Guard Win95/DOS 1998 Pentium/32MB/CD
GTA DOS 1997 DX4/16MB/
Gunmetal Win95 1998 ??
Interstate 76 Gold Win95 1997 Pentium/16MB
Lands of Lore 2 DOS 1997 Pentium/16MB/CD
Lands of Lore 3 Win95 1999 Pentium/32MB/CD
Populous: The Beginning Win95 1997 Pentium/16MB
Quake DOS 1996 186/8MB
Quake II WIN95 1997 Pentium/16MB
Shadow Warrior DOS 1997 Pentium/16MB
Shogo Win95 1998 Pentium/32MB/CD
SimCopter Win95 1996 Pentium/16MB
SIN Win95 1998 Pentium/32MB/CD
Star Wars Rogue Squadron 3D Win95 1998 Pentium/32MB/CD
Streets of Sim City Win95 1997 Pentium/32MB/CD
Terminal Velociy Win95 1995 486/4MB
Top Gun: Hornet's Nest Win95 1998 Pentium/32MB/CD
Twisted Metal 2 Win95 1997 Pentium/16MB
Unreal WIN95 1998 Pentium/16MB
US Navy Fighters Win95 1994 486/4MB

(There's another list, but of older games, from begining of 1990, mainly sierra types and apogee classics, but isn't important because I can underclock the CPU to run those)

There's a lot of posts and info around here, but maybe too much information and i was asking for ppl who had experience with a retrobuild.
Until then, the main idea is build an AMD k6-III with a Gigabyte GA-5AX (bios clocking control) following Mau1wurf1977 tutorial.

Now there are my thoughts:

Which graphics cards??? My idea until now is an AGP S3 or TNT AGP with a couple of Voodoo 2 (SLI)
What's your opinión? Best glide support for this games are a no-go, so please, help me to decide.

Reply 1 of 14, by Cannula

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Once I sort out the garage I'll be building a similar system for similar games to you.
I have planned on using my Evil King 3 (Voodoo 3 166MHz) and one of my Orchid Righteous 3D (Voodoo) to cover most of the games you listed and more. A Voodoo may be unnecessary but I'll use it anyway.
A V3 will play almost all old Glide games and is really fast for 2D in DOS.
I'm unsure if any of those listed play up with cards later than V2s or Vs, hopefully someone else will know.
Good luck on the build.

Reply 2 of 14, by N3T

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Cannula wrote:
Once I sort out the garage I'll be building a similar system for similar games to you. I have planned on using my Evil King 3 (V […]
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Once I sort out the garage I'll be building a similar system for similar games to you.
I have planned on using my Evil King 3 (Voodoo 3 166MHz) and one of my Orchid Righteous 3D (Voodoo) to cover most of the games you listed and more. A Voodoo may be unnecessary but I'll use it anyway.
A V3 will play almost all old Glide games and is really fast for 2D in DOS.
I'm unsure if any of those listed play up with cards later than V2s or Vs, hopefully someone else will know.
Good luck on the build.

So, you say I must use a Voodoo3 as main card (AGP slot) and a Voodoo1 on PCI to ensure compatibility? Or only a Voodoo3 on PCI is enough (so i can equip a directX killer on the AGP slot).

Reply 3 of 14, by vetz

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Voodoo1/2 is only required for a couple of Glide games and those games you listed in your thread is not one of them. Check this post if you can live with just the Voodoo3 or not. The Voodoo 3 gives more flexibility with regards to resolutions in Glide and Direct3D, good compability with 2D stuff and better output quality than a Voodoo 1.

3D Accelerated Games List (Proprietary APIs - No 3DFX/Direct3D)
3D Acceleration Comparison Episodes

Reply 4 of 14, by carlostex

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I'd say you better go for the Pentium II with a 440BX. Most of the stuff you are aiming is Windows 95. Get a 440BX slot 1 board and a Pentium II Deschutes. That should work great for you.

Reply 5 of 14, by Mau1wurf1977

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I agree this is all late stuff and will benefit from a Pentium III.

Now for the old adventure games, Wing Commander 1 and that time period a Super Socket 7 is better.

My website with reviews, demos, drivers, tutorials and more...
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Reply 6 of 14, by N3T

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Mau1wurf1977 wrote:

I agree this is all late stuff and will benefit from a Pentium III.

Now for the old adventure games, Wing Commander 1 and that time period a Super Socket 7 is better.

I don't understand, are you saying for the older ones (graphics adventures mainly) use a P-III or P-II and later, super-7? Is that right?

Reply 7 of 14, by nforce4max

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Socket 7 is good enough but your options will become limited if you go that way when some games can use a bit more raw power. For older games a socket 7 rig becomes good as gold when you need something much slow by turning off the caches. The Pentium 2 and 3 option is just raw power while being cheaper to build than a socket 7 rig.

On a far away planet reading your posts in the year 10,191.

Reply 8 of 14, by N3T

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nforce4max wrote:

Socket 7 is good enough but your options will become limited if you go that way when some games can use a bit more raw power. For older games a socket 7 rig becomes good as gold when you need something much slow by turning off the caches. The Pentium 2 and 3 option is just raw power while being cheaper to build than a socket 7 rig.

Ok then, thanks! 😊

Now for the music part, I'm planning to get a Mt-32 gear (it's very expensive 😢 but a must), so i need a MPU401, from this options:
MPU401AT card
Midiman 2x2
LAPC-1

The midiman is a good option or I must aim for the other two options? (Yeah, I know the method with patches and not intelligent MPU's).

Reply 9 of 14, by vetz

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No need for the intelligent MIDI devices anymore with SoftMPU. It can be downloaded here on Vogons.

3D Accelerated Games List (Proprietary APIs - No 3DFX/Direct3D)
3D Acceleration Comparison Episodes

Reply 10 of 14, by N3T

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vetz wrote:

No need for the intelligent MIDI devices anymore with SoftMPU. It can be downloaded here on Vogons.

Yeah I know, but softMPU still have issues with a few games ¿no?, if it wasn't an option, which MPU card can I use? I can get a midiman 2x2 but costs me 100€ (no signs of MPU401 or LAPC-I).

Reply 11 of 14, by carlostex

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N3T wrote:

Yeah I know, but softMPU still have issues with a few games no ?

Which ones? I thought everything was pretty much working, even picky games that specifically need IRQ 9 for MPU-401. You can even get rid of the buffer overflow issues with the DELAYSYSEX command.

Reply 12 of 14, by N3T

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Recap:

Until now, I've got so far:

A Super7 motherboard: Gigabyte GA-5AX , underclockable through BIOS (following Mau1wurf1977 tutorials)
AMD K6-III+ 450ACZ (low power edition, oveclockable if needed).
3Dfx Vooodoo Diamond Monser (Voodoo 1) PCI for older games
Compaq 3dfx 147908-001 (3500 without tuner) AGP 16Mb
Sound (until I can find an AWE32 😢 ):
YMF718-S Yamaha Audician 32 plus (SBPRO emulation + MPU401 SoftMPU compatible)
Roland MT-32 (75€, it's a good Price, no?)

Still looking for a LAPC-I card or SCC-1 card, and of course one AWE32 CT3900.

What do you think? Any recommendations?

Reply 13 of 14, by sliderider

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N3T wrote:
Recap: […]
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Recap:

Until now, I've got so far:

A Super7 motherboard: Gigabyte GA-5AX , underclockable through BIOS (following Mau1wurf1977 tutorials)
AMD K6-III+ 450ACZ (low power edition, oveclockable if needed).
3Dfx Vooodoo Diamond Monser (Voodoo 1) PCI for older games
Compaq 3dfx 147908-001 (3500 without tuner) AGP 16Mb
Sound (until I can find an AWE32 😢 ):
YMF718-S Yamaha Audician 32 plus (SBPRO emulation + MPU401 SoftMPU compatible)
Roland MT-32 (75€, it's a good Price, no?)

Still looking for a LAPC-I card or SCC-1 card, and of course one AWE32 CT3900.

What do you think? Any recommendations?

My only recommendation is if you're looking anything Roland is to be prepared to spend some money. Roland stuff is too rare and collectible to be found cheap. Don't even bother bidding in an auction for that stuff unless you are financially able to see it through to the end because low bids get kicked to the curb pretty quickly.

Reply 14 of 14, by bjt

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LAPC-I and SCC-1 are both crazy expensive. LAPC-I also requires a PSU that supplies -5V. You've already got the MT-32 and I'd just get a SC-55 or SC-88 for GM (planning to get one myself actually).

Most (all?) AWE32s have a buggy MIDI interface, although other posters say the AWE32 CT2760 works OK. I'd get a AWE64 instead as MIDI is guaranteed to work. Or just stick with the Yamaha which in itself is a great choice.

sliderider wrote:

Roland stuff is too rare and collectible to be found cheap

MT-32 and SC-55 still seem relatively common and not too expensive on eBay UK. Saw 3 MT-32s go up in the last 24 hours actually.
The internal cards and CM units are quite rare though.