VOGONS


First post, by Licentious Howler

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My father had an old Pentium III and several spare parts in his basement for quite a time, just collecting cigarette-tainted dust, and it occurred to me--why not make something of it?

Well, it was a learning process for sure, and I had to wipe the hard drive once, but it's done and good.

Images of the case (pretty huge, avg. 1MB):
http://i.imgur.com/gFWbXKh.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/f2xfHdx.jpg

Specs:
-Pentium III - 600 EBMhz (can't find the exact clock speed, but that's what it says on BIOS boot.)
-ATI Rage 128 Pro AGP 4x
-Sound Blaster Live! (it's a Dell pack-in because of the Driver CD.)
-128 MB RAM (max may be 256... not sure.)
-A Seagate(?) HDD, 30GB
-2 CD/DVD Rewritable drives - (Lightscribe and LG)
-3 1/2 Floppy drive (probably generic Dell, can't find info)
-2 USB 1.0, printer, and a joystick/MIDI port on the sound card
-the PSU is definitely stock.

Image of the inputs:
http://i.imgur.com/GgMepdu.jpg

And the innairds:
http://i.imgur.com/lIonNyY.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/2JmwCrs.jpg (shot of the SB Live)

There are also 2 PCI ethernet and phone line adapters, but I have no reason to use them, just kept them in there to keep the case closed up as the original metallic tabs are long gone.

First thing's first: it's pretty ugly, with the smoke-stains and random black DVD-tray, but I foraged for parts that worked and wouldn't cost me anything to get, so that's what I get at the price of "free". I did clean things the best I could, especially the dust-caked fans, which all run fine now. As for the build process...

One very curious element to the PC is a lack of a proper monitor; it used to be paired with a Sony Trinitron, but the picture is too dim to be useful for games anymore, and I didn't really want to sift through hundreds of cruddy office-tier CRTs in thrift stores--not when I saw a much better opportunity presented by this ATI card; It's always been a little underpowered for late 90's PC games like Serious Sam, but it has video out in the form of S-Video. I decided it would make a lot of sense to use it for my trusty Sony Wega HDCRT TV then!

Of course it means I can't truly tweak the resolution, as the card must scale all output to 640x480i, but it does the job pretty sharp and well, as the driver allows me quite a bit of flexibility in its output. Amazingly, almost all text is easily legible even on the desktop save a game here or there. Unfortunately, still pictures can have a bizarre "displacement" artifact of sorts, but in motion with normal games, it's no issue. The benefit of rich and beefy CRT speakers is nice as well, though it's a waste for the EAX portion of the sound card until I come up with a multiple-speaker solution. The absolute best part of this however, is that even running games 800x600 (or a Widescreen variant) looks pretty sublime because of the softening nature of the CRT--it's basically nice Anti-Aliasing at no cost of performance!

Images of the TV setup (though as always, images don't do it justice):
http://i.imgur.com/uh3yalc.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Zb1sLiM.jpg

The presence of a USB port allows me the use of an optical mouse (I winced a bit, thinking "no track balls=blasphemy", but then I figured a "TV PC" is already pretty 'sacrilegious'), which allows me to navigate on pretty much any surface, fixing the issue of a lack of a desk, and the keyboard on my lap.

The big caveat to this however; I don't know what to do with the mess of wires and tower in the middle of the floor, save to lug the tower back out of the way when I'm done with it! Maybe I can get obnoxiously long extensions for the keyboard and mouse? Maybe experiment with a controller setup? Not really an issue for now.

A Pentium III kicks the crap out of every DOS game I've tried, save the infamous Carmageddon -hires, and even then it's a comfortable 20-30 FPS or so, and for the Windows 98 games, I can usually keep the high settings with a fairly low res, and it looks much better than I thought it would - probably not as nice as a proper high-res AA monitor setup, but pretty close. I can't really say this would be my preferred setup for a really intensive FPS though, and there are a lot of pre-2000 games where I would just prefer on a legitimate rig anyway, but if I'm playing something with an external controller/joystick like Descent, this would probably be the bitchinest way to go about it!

In this process I also learned a great deal about how PCs used to function and even more nitty-gritty make-up of Windows, and drivers, drivers, drivers - my how I had taken for granted the basic functionality of everything in modern PCs. Thankfully my father was very deliberate about storing all of his CDs and floppies, which is the only reason I even got the thing working in the first place. Heck, I've still got more to learn because drivers are the reason I can't get Hitman and the 3dfx version of Carmageddon to run (via wrappers)!

Uh, that's about all I had to say and this is going on way too long anyway, hope you like what you see!

Last edited by Licentious Howler on 2014-01-22, 03:30. Edited 4 times in total.

Reply 1 of 9, by leileilol

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That's a nice TV.

Since it's a TV PC I would throw in a 3dfx Voodoo3 3000 in there.... that has Svideo out and has sharper TV output than the Rage128 and the compatibility is much larger (at the expense of 32-bit color and high textures - both which aren't THAT discernable on a 480i display). However on some EGA/VGA games it won't handle the 70hz signal well leading to a scrambled picture, and it might not still run the 3dfx version of Carmageddon.

Should mention the Rage128 is one of those cards that jerk in Commander Keen 4.

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long live PCem

Reply 2 of 9, by maximus

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An interesting build! I do like those old Dell cases - they look very serious and well-built.

This system is full of potential upgrades. That's a Slot 1 P3 600, so you should be good all the way up to a P3 1 Ghz, BIOS support notwithstanding. I would upgrade the graphics card as well - the Rage 128 is not known as a good retro gamer. As was mentioned, a Voodoo3 3500 would be good, but the AGP slot should support much faster cards in the GeForce2 to GeForce4 range.

If you haven't done so already, maxing out the RAM wouldn't hurt either.

PCGames9505

Reply 3 of 9, by Licentious Howler

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leileilol wrote:

Since it's a TV PC I would throw in a 3dfx Voodoo3 3000 in there.... that has Svideo out and has sharper TV output than the Rage128 and the compatibility is much larger (at the expense of 32-bit color and high textures - both which aren't THAT discernable on a 480i display). However on some EGA/VGA games it won't handle the 70hz signal well leading to a scrambled picture, and it might not still run the 3dfx version of Carmageddon.

Wow! I mean, I knew you had a wealth of knowledge observing some of your other posts, but I'm still impressed...! This is great info if I decide to throw down some money. I've never liked this card much, but it was lying around, so in it went. I honestly didn't think the ATI card could do a wrapper-emulated 3dfx (very well anyway), but I'm at my wits' end because I can't get it working with Carmageddon on any modern system. Tomb Raider and Hitman are fine on the other PCs, but Carmageddon's reputation for being finicky precedes it. Doesn't matter too much because -hires works (despite the manual stating it shouldn't???), which is fine for a TV.

leileilol wrote:

Commander Keen 4.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gb4eZ7Z5yk8

maximus wrote:

If you haven't done so already, maxing out the RAM wouldn't hurt either.

Dang it I knew I was forgetting something! There's 128 MB of RAM in there, I recall my father implying there was headroom for 256 numerous times. I edited the post anyway.

maximus wrote:

An interesting build! I do like those old Dell cases - they look very serious and well-built.

It almost holds up with nicotine and mismatched colour. Almost.

maximus wrote:

This system is full of potential upgrades...

Funny thing; the card that was in here last was a Geforce 2, but the fan was brittled by years of smoke until it fell off! The GPU without it, was fried a bit, and now it leaves dark artifacts all over the screen along with a 'wavy' signal. I am so glad I never picked up the habit!

I didn't even consider a CPU upgrade... it's nice to think that there's headroom with the machine, but I'm not really entirely sure if I want to drop too much money on it yet - it all depends how much I warm up to using it, and for what purposes. Being a "TV PC" could certainly give it a 'niche' mileage, and I can already see myself playing loads of flight-sim style games that way, and if I can figure out a good controller solution, maybe more.

Reply 4 of 9, by snorg

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[quote="
Funny thing; the card that was in here last was a Geforce 2, but the fan was brittled by years of smoke until it fell off! The GPU without it, was fried a bit, and now it leaves dark artifacts all over the screen along with a 'wavy' signal. I am so glad I never picked up the habit!

I didn't even consider a CPU upgrade... it's nice to think that there's headroom with the machine, but I'm not really entirely sure if I want to drop too much money on it yet - it all depends how much I warm up to using it, and for what purposes. Being a "TV PC" could certainly give it a 'niche' mileage, and I can already see myself playing loads of flight-sim style games that way, and if I can figure out a good controller solution, maybe more.[/quote]

Simple Green should get rid of the nicotine/tar stains. I used to use it when we'd have a particularly nasty smoker's pc come in. Will cut right through it. Wear gloves, though, because it is disgusting and you'll get the tar all over your hands.

Reply 5 of 9, by leileilol

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Licentious Howler wrote:

I honestly didn't think the ATI card could do a wrapper-emulated 3dfx (very well anyway)

The more modern wrappers, starting from Zeckenseck's would demand a pixel shader-supporting card anyway.

At least there's that slew of immature UltraHLE-era (1999) wrappers that would work on the R128, XGL-200 being the best of them - but since they're all designed for a popular Windows Glide-only N64 emulator that's not really a choice for DOS glide wrappering.... or later glide games that make extensive use of multitexturing (no Unreal)

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long live PCem

Reply 6 of 9, by maximus

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leileilol wrote:

The more modern wrappers, starting from Zeckenseck's would demand a pixel shader-supporting card anyway.

That's why dgVoodoo V1.50 Beta 2 is my wrapper of choice. It's advanced enough to do a reasonably good job, but old enough to work perfectly on DX7 class hardware. Probably still won't work on a Rage 128, though (don't own, can't test).

PCGames9505

Reply 7 of 9, by Stiletto

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leileilol wrote:
Licentious Howler wrote:

I honestly didn't think the ATI card could do a wrapper-emulated 3dfx (very well anyway)

The more modern wrappers, starting from Zeckenseck's would demand a pixel shader-supporting card anyway.

At least there's that slew of immature UltraHLE-era (1999) wrappers that would work on the R128, XGL-200 being the best of them - but since they're all designed for a popular Windows Glide-only N64 emulator that's not really a choice for DOS glide wrappering.... or later glide games that make extensive use of multitexturing (no Unreal)

I should really get back to that wrapper project, hmm...

"I see a little silhouette-o of a man, Scaramouche, Scaramouche, will you
do the Fandango!" - Queen

Stiletto

Reply 8 of 9, by zstandig

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I've worked with that model (or atleast models with that case) a lot, I'll tell you what I know about it.

The CPU, depending if the FSB is 100MHz or 133MHz the max you can get is a slotket Tualatin Pentium 3 S or a Tualatin based Celeron. Personally I'd just stick to slot one stuff because I've had bad luck with slotkets. Make sure to clean the CPU with compressed air. The black plastic sheath is easy to pop on and off.

You should be able to get 512 Megs of RAM. Two 256 MB sticks.

The hard drive is fine, you can increase read/write speed by using a controller card (or if you just want SATA), if you want to. But those can get tricky.

If it's anything like the dell's I've had the floppy drive is probably a Sony. If you take it out don't loose the clips.

You can get a USB 2.0 card if you want faster transfer speed. I have a USB 2.0, Ethernet combo card to save space.

If you ever need a new PSU, be aware that Dell's from that era use some kind of proprietary PSU, so you can't just put in any PSU, no it needs to either be a vintage dell or you need some kind of adapter cable that converts everything where it needs to go.

The metalic tabs in the back are generic, so if you want to ditch the modem you can just grab a metal tab from another computer.

If you really want to, you can get a newer AGP card that has DVI, then you can get a DVI to HDMI cable so you can hook it into anything modern.

I don't remember how to do it, but you can actually remove the "foot" of the chassis so you can lay it flat on its side so you can stack it.

Reply 9 of 9, by Licentious Howler

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zstandig wrote:

<The entire post>

Sorry for a belated reply, but this is good info to work with for sure--you know your stuff! Didn't even consider USB card, and the RAM upgrade is helpful too. Heck, pretty much everything you said here is, thanks!