VOGONS


First post, by dave343

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I want to build a retro rig but wanted to get some opinions on the parts to go with. My goal is near compatibility for games from 1990-2000 but I have a feeling I may have to divide this into two systems... or maybe not. The games I want to fire up range from the old sierra titles (early 90's up to FMV games and possibly... half life 1 & swat 3.

Everything from Maniac Mansion, Police Quest 1 VGA and up, Quest for Glory series, Kings Quest (not 7 &8), Black Dahlia, Tex Murphy, Gabriel Knight 1&2). I'm not really interested in the original late 80s Sierra games like KQ1... just early 90's to 2000.

So with that in mind I've been debating if I should just go with a nice Pentium 1 build around 75mhz to 120, or go straight with a Pentium 2 300/400 system that will allow me to run Half life 1 and Swat 3 as well. I guess my primary concern is what's TOO high for games like PQ 1 (vga remake) and gabriel knight. Or could I get away with a 200mmx for everything mentioned?

Compatibility is my main concern as I'd prefer to stick with Dos 6.22, maybe Windows 98 for the later games and USB support, but I always feel like if you get too advance, what's the point of building a retro system.
I've been reading quite of bit of posts regarding different hardware on here with people recommending the S3 Trio64 for video. When I was building system's in the 90's I always heard ATI and Matrox were the cards to have, for 2D image quality anyways... I guess the 2nd part is do I go with a 2D card and a Voodoo 1/2 or a Voodoo 3 because the V3 would take card of everything but again will it be giving me problems in Dos 6.22.

Also I've never been up to speed on the SB card's in the 90's (even in the 90s), if someone could recommend a great ISA Sound blaster card to get. I never had a AWE 32 so I don't know much about the AWE series, just the 16 but I know there are various different SB 16 cards, some cheap some awesome. I had the SB 16 Value in the day but I was also using Win 98, I'd like to aim for Dos compatibility above all first.

Thanks in advance for reading and your suggestions. Btw, I already have a few CPU's in my possession; Pentium 75, 166, 200MMX, and P2 400.

Reply 1 of 10, by PeterLI

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#1: Watch all videos on this channel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IKSyqRwwfY.
#2: Get a heavy Pentium III for late retro games.
#3: Use SB Live! for late retro games (with surround sound).
#4: Use a Roland MT-32/CM-32L for early games MIDI. And a SB Pro 2 for samples.
#5: Use a Roland Sound Canvas for middle games MIDI. And a SB 16 for samples.

GL & HF! 😀

To keep things (relatively) cheap: do not build yourself: buy an OEM desktop / mini tower instead.

Reply 2 of 10, by dave343

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building a P3 system defeats the whole retro gaming PC 😀 and I HAVE to build it myself, that's where part of the fun is 😎

I know the parts the I want, just not exactly what to get yet... but I definitely want a SB 16/32 of some nature in there.

Reply 3 of 10, by armankordi

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PeterLI wrote:
#1: Watch all videos on this channel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IKSyqRwwfY. #2: Get a heavy Pentium III for late retro gam […]
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#1: Watch all videos on this channel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_IKSyqRwwfY.
#2: Get a heavy Pentium III for late retro games.
#3: Use SB Live! for late retro games (with surround sound).
#4: Use a Roland MT-32/CM-32L for early games MIDI. And a SB Pro 2 for samples.
#5: Use a Roland Sound Canvas for middle games MIDI. And a SB 16 for samples.

GL & HF! 😀

To keep things (relatively) cheap: do not build yourself: buy an OEM desktop / mini tower instead.

Screw intel! In the mid to late 90's AMD was all the rage. An AMD Athlon classic @900MHz meets the Intel pentium 3 1ghz. Go for an AMD Athlon 1.33GHz CPU.

IBM PS/2 8573-121 386-20 DOS6.2/W3.1
IBM PS/2 8570-E61 386-16 W95
IBM PS/2 8580-071 386-16 (486DX-33 reply) OS/2 warp
486DX/2 - 66/32mb ram/256k cache/504mb hdd/cdrom/awe32/DOS6.2/WFW3.11
K6/2 - 350/128mb ram/512k cache/4.3gb hdd/cdr/sblive/w98

Reply 4 of 10, by NitroX infinity

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Athlon didn't come onto the scene until June 1999.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_AMD_Ath … microprocessors

Pentium 3 showed up in February of 1999. So mid to late '90's was all about Pentium, Pentium MMX, Pentium 2 and the entire AMD K6 range.

NitroX infinity's 3D Accelerators Arena | Yamaha RPA YGV611 & RPA2 YGV612 Info

Reply 5 of 10, by badmojo

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This is the eternal question and there're countless answers depending on who you ask. I'd have to agree with PeterLI though, a Pentium III with at least 1 ISA slot is an excellent choice for vintage gaming and covers almost everything. If I was forced to keep only one retro PC then my PIII 1Ghz, Windows 98 machine would be it. The ability to play late SVGA games at full detail and a high frame rate is reason enough, but it does so much more - ATX, USB, Glide + Direct X, etc.

And for those few games which have speed issues then you can build a 386 or 486 and use that machine to satisfy your vintage hardware urges.

Just my 2 cents!

Life? Don't talk to me about life.

Reply 6 of 10, by senrew

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I currently have 3 machines (4 if you count DOSBox on my modern machine) just to cover this year range for gaming. There is no 100% foolproof single machine to play games from that decade. The hardware changed so fast in such a short amount of time that a machine that's perfect for the early part of the decade is woefully inadequate for the later part of it. This entire forum is a testament to the eternal quest to that goal, however eternally unattainable it is.

The best you can do if you want to keep it to a single machine is to get a fast Pentium III and compromise on components between sound and video to cover a good range. Dual sound cards, ISA/PCI and switching hardware profiles within Windows or booting into DOS with the PCI card disabled will take care of sound. Graphics is split between fast or compatible when it comes to DOS S/VGA. For Windows, a fast D3D + Glide will get you far.

The best solution is to decide what games you want to play (which you already have) and research what components you need to support those games specifically, and then pick parts for them.

Halcyon: PC Chips M525, P100, 64MB, Millenium 1, Voodoo1, AWE64, DVD, Win95B

Reply 7 of 10, by dave343

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Thanks for the replies.

Can someone define the speed sensitive games? I always though those were only games made specifically for the 8088 like KQ1 etc... The early games I would want to use would be everything 1990+ Sierra.

If I did go with a fast Pentium 3 or Athlon Slot A built how would the dos compatibility be? Could I stick with only a ISA Sound Blaster card for everything? Win 98 games included?
And for video... I wouldn't mind finding a Geforce 256 32mb which I bought when it original came out, but would using that give me issues with the early dos games?

I know going with ATX makes everything so much more simpler, can use any case, have usb... but like I mentioned I just want to ensure those early Sierra Dos games and Dos don't give me a headache on a P3/Athlon system. Hardware issues included... USB/newer chipsets in dos.

Reply 9 of 10, by obobskivich

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I'd agree with senrew - a whole lot changed between 1990 and 2000. Building to the specific library you want to play is probably best given the circumstances. If you could divide and conquer with a Pentium machine (it sounds like you already have most of that together) to handle DOS, support ISA cards, etc and then a second, newer machine for the Direct3D/OpenGL games from the later half of the decade (and probably games into the early 2000s as well; depending on the build and the titles), you'd probably be better off overall.

Reply 10 of 10, by dave343

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Semi update...

I picked up an Asus TX97-E on ebay for pretty cheap in as new condition, which also included a 233MMX with a brand new heatsink/fan, and 128MB EDO (2x64mb). Not the CPU I wanted but free with the board. The seller had in the notes for extra $30 he would toss in a "brand new AT case with PSU...". Your eye's did not deceive you 😀 "brand new AT case"... I can't even source one on ebay or at least a decent used one, and the seller lived very close by so pickup was an option. The seller confirmed it was a brand new in the box 😎 Baby AT case with 250w PSU.

When I picked up the stuff he actually not only had installed the board for me, he tossed in a free CD drive, Floppy, ATI All in Wonder (Rage Pro 8mb pci) in the box with all accessories, a ESS sound card (...uggh), and a 430mb samsung hd 🤣... 430mb. Seller did all the cabling, hooked up the PS2/Com's etc. He has a 2nd brand new AT case so I may take that off him as well. It's the usual beige case but it's, good build quality and one of the newer ones, newer being 1998/1999.

I'm not planning on keeping most of the components because I already had an idea of what I wanted, if you have any suggestions let me know. As you can see i'm trying to keep everything in era.

AMD K5 75/100
24-32mb EDO
4-8x CD
1-2GB HD (probably a Bigfoot or Fireball)
Sound Blaster 16 (CT-2940) ISA
Either a S3 Trio 64 2mb or an ATI Rage II+ 2mb
Voodoo 1 4mb

Btw, if anyone is interested in the ATI All in Wonder (8mb Rage Pro PCI) let me know, it comes with the box and all the accessories, also the 128mb EDO ram (2x64mb) and the 233MMX. They're your's for the price of any of the parts I'm looking for above 😎 (plus shipping for the card)