What retro activity did you get up to today?

Discussion about old PC hardware.

Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby liqmat » 2019-1-16 @ 22:28

detritus olentus wrote:GX1s of the world's unite! Making my own little 99/00 computer lab.


oeuvre wrote:
detritus olentus wrote:GX1s of the world's unite! Making my own little 99/00 computer lab.


Image

What're you planning on doing with them?

I'm actually shocked oeuvre let you slide on this one. Maybe he favors Dell aficionados.

They have now been given the Delletor treatment.

Delletor.jpg
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby dionb » 2019-1-17 @ 00:38

liqmat wrote:Can you show us the underbelly of where you soldered? Doesn't look too bad from the top.

Image

Not as bad a dog's breakfast as I'd feared. Most of the scuffing you see is from the desoldering (first with a hand pump, then cleaned up with a wick).
TheMobRules wrote:
dionb wrote:This is the first time I've worked on a system with a DS1387. Anyone who has handled them before know what expected behaviour is if you try to boot with the DS1387 removed or defective?


I don't know specifically about the DS1387, but none of my boards that use a DS12887 post without the RTC. If the RTC is there but the battery is dead, I get the "CMOS battery low" but the board is at least able to POST.

Out of interest I tried it with a DS1287. It really didn't like that, not even starting POST. That tells me that whatever is critical is getting through the pins. I think I will try to resurrect the DS1387 - first just give it some new legs (I have a spare socket I can use for that), if that lets the board actually boot again, I'll try modding it.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby Thermalwrong » 2019-1-17 @ 00:59

Today I have been having a go at getting my "untested" FIC 486 VIP IO2 working... It doesn't!

First of all, there's no resistor pack for the CPU - thanks to this thread - I worked out that mine are 8 pin, 4 pair, 0 Ohms resistor packs, verified with the muitimeter using the resistor pack for the keyboard controller settings. Then I remembered I'd bought a kit of breadboard jumpers, which fit nicely there instead, since I can't find 0 ohm resistor packs for sale.

Turning it on was a disappointment, the PSU, CPU and memory are all known good on other computers, but the ISA diagnostic card just shows "--,--", indicating there's no life.

This is where I'm very glad that I bought a TL866 programmer - reading the NM27C010Q BIOS chip, everything from 0x0000 to 0x7999 is blank, with some references to an NCR53710?
I tried to program it and that failed on the verify stage... is it broken?

Then realised it's a UV EPROM, not an EEPROM, so right now I'm waiting to see if my UV torch is enough to clear it :D

Then see if it boots at all, fun!
I'll add some pictures tomorrow, maybe make a thread about this pesky motherboard. My quest for a 486 board with PS/2 mouse and VLB continues - my Asus PVI 486 SP3's VLB port doesn't seem to work and although it registers the L2 cache on boot, it's not using it :(


edit: bleh, my little UV torch didn't do anything, time to sort out a proper UV light instead, I assume it requires the dangerous to humans frequency rather than the sort you use to make white things glow?
Last edited by Thermalwrong on 2019-1-17 @ 09:29, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby canthearu » 2019-1-17 @ 08:34

Could you drop in an compatible EEPROM, at least temporarily, onto the 486 motherboard?

Would be easier for testing.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby appiah4 » 2019-1-17 @ 08:55

Thermalwrong wrote:Today I have been having a go at getting my "untested" FIC 486 VIP IO2 working... It doesn't!

First of all, there's no resistor pack for the CPU - thanks to this thread - I worked out that mine are 8 pin, 4 pair, 0 Ohms resistor packs, verified with the muitimeter using the resistor pack for the keyboard controller settings. Then I realised I'd bought a kit of breakboard jumpers, which fit nicely there instead, since I can't find 0 ohm resistor packs for sale.

Turning it on was a disappointment, the PSU, CPU and memory are all known good on other computers, but the ISA diagnostic card just shows "--,--", indicating there's no life.

This is where I'm very glad that I bought a TL866 programmer - reading the NM27C010Q BIOS chip, everything from 0x0000 to 0x7999 is blank, with some references to an NCR53710?
I tried to program it and that failed on the verify stage... is it broken?

Then realised it's a UV EPROM, not an EEPROM, so right now I'm waiting to see if my UV torch is enough to clear it :D

Then see if it boots at all, fun!
I'll add some pictures tomorrow, maybe make a thread about this pesky motherboard. My quest for a 486 board with PS/2 mouse and VLB continues - my Asus PVI 486 SP3's VLB port doesn't seem to work and although it registers the L2 cache on boot, it's not using it :(


edit: bleh, my little UV torch didn't do anything, time to sort out a proper UV light instead, I assume it requires the dangerous to humans frequency rather than the sort you use to make white things glow?


I need the EXACT same resistor pack for an ECS 486UL-1 board as well, and could not find one. How exactly did you resolve the problem? I am thinking of bridging the socket from below the board with a copper wire, then covering it with hot glue for insulation.. That will lock me to a single CPU though, I am not too keen on it..
A500:Rev6|+512K|ACA500+|C1084S
i386:Am386SX25|4M|GD5402|ES688|MuntPi3
i486:U5S33|8M|GD5428|YMF719|DB-S2
i586:P133|32M|T64+/MX2|V1|CT3980/32M
i686:K6-2/400|128M|V2/SLI|CT4520/32M
S370:P3-1200|384M|GF4-4200|MX300
S754:A3700+|2G|X1950PRO|SB0350
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby Thermalwrong » 2019-1-17 @ 09:21

canthearu wrote:Could you drop in an compatible EEPROM, at least temporarily, onto the 486 motherboard?

Would be easier for testing.


Ahh excellent point, it looks like the BIOS ROM on my Asus PVI 486SP3 is a 1 mbit EEPROM so I'll try the swap today.

appiah4 wrote:I need the EXACT same resistor pack for an ECS 486UL-1 board as well, and could not find one. How exactly did you resolve the problem? I am thinking of bridging the socket from below the board with a copper wire, then covering it with hot glue for insulation.. That will lock me to a single CPU though, I am not too keen on it..


I'll post the pictures when I'm back home later today and can get them off of my camera :)
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby appiah4 » 2019-1-17 @ 12:53

Thermalwrong wrote:I'll post the pictures when I'm back home later today and can get them off of my camera :)


I saw the solution in your other thread. I'm considering buying one of these, clipping of a 1x8 row, permanently bridging the relevant connections (1-2, 3-4, 5-6, 7-8), covering the top with insulating tape then inserting it into the socket..

Image
A500:Rev6|+512K|ACA500+|C1084S
i386:Am386SX25|4M|GD5402|ES688|MuntPi3
i486:U5S33|8M|GD5428|YMF719|DB-S2
i586:P133|32M|T64+/MX2|V1|CT3980/32M
i686:K6-2/400|128M|V2/SLI|CT4520/32M
S370:P3-1200|384M|GF4-4200|MX300
S754:A3700+|2G|X1950PRO|SB0350
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby Thermalwrong » 2019-1-17 @ 13:05

Try getting some U-shaped breadboard jumper wires like these, the little ones in my kit have some insulation on them:

breadboardwires.jpg

Here they are all fitted on, the little green jumpers, they work just the same as the original resistor pack part that was included for the keyboard:

fic-vip-resistorpack.jpeg


Sadly, even swapping the BIOS chip over with the one from the Asus board, it's still dead - the damaged solder mask that I spotted by the PCI slots seems like a hallmark of lightning damage to me, so this may not be possible to fix? I don't know where to start for a board that gives nothing on the diagnostic card...
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby GigAHerZ » 2019-1-17 @ 13:26

Thermalwrong, aru you sure the resistorpack works like that for your board?

Usually resistorpacks have one common leg in the first/last position and all the other legs are separate resistors? With that logic, all pins you want to connect, should connect from appropriate pin to the common pin.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby Thermalwrong » 2019-1-17 @ 14:18

GigAHerZ wrote:Thermalwrong, aru you sure the resistorpack works like that for your board?

Usually resistorpacks have one common leg in the first/last position and all the other legs are separate resistors? With that logic, all pins you want to connect, should connect from appropriate pin to the common pin.


Yep, I verified with the multimeter, each pair of pins links up with 0 ohms resistance. The thread I linked to said the same thing and swapping the resistor pack from the KBC didn't make any positive/negative difference so I'm pretty sure that's how it works.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby Xicor » 2019-1-17 @ 17:25

liqmat wrote:So this may be my new desktop case. Inquiring with the Chinese manufacturer about the case specifics currently. I know, it's a rack, but my goodness it's a beauty. That flip down door!!! If I put four rubber feet at the bottom it's a damn desktop! No one can tell me different. LOL This will house my dual Pentium Pro build BTW.

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/ ... 6d69AHwbuj

I am hoping the final product does actually say "Industrial Computer" on it. Classic in my book.

The attachment Industrial-chassis.jpg is no longer available
The attachment Industrial-chassis_open.jpg is no longer available


I also find attractive those "flappy door" cases. In fact, a couple of months ago managed to find my favourite HTPC case. It's a OrienAE S14V, and it has a satisfying "flappy door". Although not yet vintage, here it is :


origenAE.jpg


htpc_shot5.jpg



Ps: stock photos, my case is the black version.... like roiling stones I want "Paint it Black" :lol:
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby liqmat » 2019-1-17 @ 17:43

Those cases definitely look like they were designed for mingling with someone's A/V entertainment system setup.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby brostenen » 2019-1-18 @ 00:53

Tested a harddrive that I recieved in the mail. I was really hoping that it was working. Yet due to extremely bad packing, the drive is DOA. It was packed in the usual envelope, by the usual stupid seller. Connecting any of my working SCSI drives, the controller had no issue finding any of the drives. After 2 hours of reading the manual and batteling with SCSI settings I gave up and requested a refund.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby doaks80 » 2019-1-18 @ 10:20

Finished testing all my real AWE32 cards (i.e. not SB32 pretenders). Including:
One CT2760.
Two CT3900s.
One CT3980.

The range of sound options is pretty impressive, especially with a DB50X attached to the CT3980:
Adlib/genuine OPL.
GM support on 330 to the daughterboard and presumably gameport (didnt test that).
Turn on aweutil, and GM on 330 via SoundFonts in the expansion ram and the EMU8k (only some real mode games work but some work well).
Native AWE support for protected mode games.
SB16 digital audio support.
And all of the above can be routed through the emu8k and have chorus/reverb applied (maybe not the daughterboard but that should be easy to prove/disprove).

The native AWE mode apparently only uses a tiny 512kb sample ROM but it actually sounds quite good in comparison.

Still not sure any of it sounded quite as good as say the Terratec Maestro though...
k6-3+ 400 / s3 virge DX+voodoo1 / awe32(32mb)
via c3 866 / s3 savage4+voodoo2 sli / audigy1+awe64(8mb)
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby dionb » 2019-1-18 @ 14:33

dionb wrote:Out of interest I tried it with a DS1287. It really didn't like that, not even starting POST. That tells me that whatever is critical is getting through the pins. I think I will try to resurrect the DS1387 - first just give it some new legs (I have a spare socket I can use for that), if that lets the board actually boot again, I'll try modding it.

Success!

Image

Using the spare socket (basically soldering the stunted remains of the legs to the second socket) I've gotten the motherboard talking to the DS1387 again, booting succesfully. Of course, the battery is still dead, but I now know it's worthwhile to take the effort to mod the DS1387 with a new battery :)
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby chrismeyer6 » 2019-1-18 @ 15:14

Excellent work Dionb with that repair. With it confirmed working again you can use an external battery with it. Hell with the second socket you can probably just wire the new battery to the pins on the second socket reducing the risk of damage from opening the RTC
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby brostenen » 2019-1-18 @ 20:59

Testing the IndivisionECS V2 scandoubler a bit further. It is not completely as I want it yet. In workbench, none of my monitor's can not really display it correctly. I have tried an 17 inch Samsung, one 19 inch IBM and finally an 21 inch IBM. Yet on a normal flatscreen tv, the image is displayed correctly and will be displayed edge to edge. However I have found that fiddeling with overscan, I can change the image to something that I like. With some help, I have found a workbench border blanker tool, and I will see how this play's out. Loading games from floppy disks are correctly displayed, so the issue is related to workbench. I need to play some more with settings and see if I can at least center the workbench screen somehow.

The good part is that this scandoubler gives an awesomme signal. The image is chrisp and clear and all colours are wonderfull. I am really happy with this device....

IndiECS-Test-01.jpg

IndiECS-Test-02.jpg
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001100 010010 011110 100001 101101 110011

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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby SpectriaForce » 2019-1-18 @ 21:36

I've been searching for socket 7 motherboards on ebay yesterday, does anyone have buying experience with this Polish seller http://www.ebaystores.de/apress-eu ? They seem to have a lot of new old stock hardware. I've asked a question about included accessories of a new motherboard yesterday, but haven't received a reply. I start to doubt that the motherboards are new in box with accessories. I have even seen some boards with bent pins and leaking batteries advertised as brand new. Can anyone confirm that these boards are refurbished or loose replacements? It's also quite weird that they ask hundreds of euro's for some motherboards while others are quite acceptably priced if they are really new and complete (and it has nothing to do with the quality or upgradeability of the boards).
Tremendous clearance sale now at:
RETROGAMEPC.COM
CLASSICCOMPUTERSHOP.COM
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby dionb » 2019-1-18 @ 22:21

SpectriaForce wrote:I've been searching for socket 7 motherboards on ebay yesterday, does anyone have buying experience with this Polish seller http://www.ebaystores.de/apress-eu ? They seem to have a lot of new old stock hardware. I've asked a question about included accessories of a new motherboard yesterday, but haven't received a reply. I start to doubt that the motherboards are new in box with accessories.

I would very much doubt that too. Note the caveat:
Neuer, unbenutzter und unbeschädigter Artikel in nicht geöffneter Originalverpackung (soweit eine Verpackung vorhanden ist).

Nowhere in the description does it mention packaging nor any pics...
I have even seen some boards with bent pins and leaking batteries advertised as brand new. Can anyone confirm that these boards are refurbished or loose replacements? It's also quite weird that they ask hundreds of euro's for some motherboards while others are quite acceptably priced if they are really new and complete (and it has nothing to do with the quality or upgradeability of the boards).

The pricing looks algorithmic, or otherwise possibly just reverse-auction: start insanely high, drop price every so often and keep doing so until someone bites.
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Re: What retro activity did you get up to today?

Postby GigAHerZ » 2019-1-18 @ 22:52

Got some tantalum capacitors and was able to repair a dead Asus EEE PC 1015PEM.

Nice little machine, now saved. :)
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