FeedingDragon wrote:

OK, then it does work. When I set it to 100, it reported 801.xx as the total speed, just with a FSB of 66.6. Testing was done with both your BAT file and with me typing the commands out long form. Though, the programs inability to accurately reed the data makes me question its ability to accurately set the data 🙁 Though, as long as it isn't going to set "higher" amounts, that isn't much of an issue, more than likely I would use it to lower the FSB for games that needed it, then reboot my computer after, instead of using it to restore full speed.

I am a little surprised about your attitude towards it. There are hardly any i440BX motherboards that have a tool for FSB switching from the DOS prompt, so IMO this is great. I use it often and don't even check the feedback, because it always sets what I selected anyways, be it 50, 66, 100 or 133MHz. If you doubt the values use one of the hundreds of other tools that calculate CPU speed.

As for the AWE subject, I have nothing really to add.
I have my Dream 4MB GS daughterboards which sound flawless anyways. For Soundfont based midi in DOS, I would hook up a cheap netbook to the midi port, to serve as a Synthesizer.

gerwin wrote:

I am a little surprised about your attitude towards it. There are hardly any i440BX motherboards that have a tool for FSB switching from the DOS prompt, so IMO this is great. I use it often and don't even check the feedback, because it always sets what I selected anyways, be it 50, 66, 100 or 133MHz. If you doubt the values use one of the hundreds of other tools that calculate CPU speed.

As for the AWE subject, I have nothing really to add.
I have my Dream 4MB GS daughterboards which sound flawless anyways. For Soundfont based midi in DOS, I would hook up a cheap netbook to the midi port, to serve as a Synthesizer.

I never said the program wasn't very nice 😀 I consider it rather awesome, actually (sorry if I never actually stated that.) It would have been so nice to have that when I was trying to get my Voodoo2 SLI cards working right (that's actually fixed now.) Unplugging the system and then reaching into the rather tight quarters between tests to set the FSB was a bit of a PITA. Though, in the end, it turned out to be totally unnecessary anyways, this tool would have been nice to have at that time. My only real concern is if it is going to set the FSB higher than 100Mhz. I don't over clock, so I don't put extra steps in place to counter the effects of over clocking (extra heat sinks for example.) Above, I was mainly commenting on the programming that can accurately set a value, but cannot accurately read it. I'm still wondering why that is in this case. For more details:

After a fresh boot: "sbm /p 10" reports - 801.84Mhz CPU, 50.0Mhz FSB, 25.00Mhz PCI
After "sbm /sp 10 50": it reports - 396.69Mhz CPU, 50.0Mhz FSB, 25.00Mhz PCI
after "sbm /sp 10 100": it reports - 795.10Mhz CPU, 100.2Mhz FSB, 33.30Mhz PCI

Since it is correctly reading the values it sets itself, why is the initial value wrong? If it is changing the value it reads (but the value is wrong originally,) what is it actually changing? Since the original CPU speed is correct, I'm guessing it is actually reading the CPU speed from somewhere (and not calculating it.) So, the CPU is getting slowed down. From the numbers, standard FSB is actually 100.23Mhz (*8 that equals 801.84.) When smb sets it to 100.2 it seems to only be setting 99.3875 (795.10 / 8,) and 49.58625 for 50.0 (396.69 / 8.) Since the multiplier is fixed on my CPU, I'm only really worried if it goes to much over 800Mhz. My only concern is the PCI speed over the long run.

As for the AWE64 - The more I read, the more I become convinced that it won't actually help me any (would still like confirmation one way or the other.) I'll keep doing research, but unless something definitive comes up (or is found,) I'm probably going to get a Thrustmaster ACM (or Gravis Eliminator,) to solve my joystick problems. As far as soundfonts go, I'll still be looking for a way to use the board's RAM for soundfonts in DOS, but I mainly want it for soundfonts in Windows (3.1 & 98.) It works just fine there (and I imagine an AWE64 would work just as well.) Most times, I will probably just be using the SCB-55 or the MT-32 for MIDI output anyways.

Though, I actually have a game (don't remember which one, but it's around here somewhere,) that will use the AWE32/64 RAM to load samples & such. IIRC, it loaded samples based on the available RAM on the board. I remember it because, back when I first got the game, it complained that it couldn't work with a DRAM size as small as what I had at the time. Never got to find out what the game sounded like with an AWE card. When I find it, I'm sure I'll be able to find out now 😀

Ah, glad you do actually like it.

What the SMB program does, is that it communicates with the ICS9148xx-26 PLL chip through the System Management Bus. (You can find a pdf datasheet for this ICS chip on the net.) The PLL chip can be configured either by jumpers or by SM-bus. At bootup it is configured by jumpers first, so I guess that is why the SM-Bus configuration is not shown correctly. That is until you do an actual SM-bus write to the PLL. Maybe that puts it in software mode. just guessing...

To calculate the CPU speed on Pentium I/II/III, it is common practice to read increase of the timestampcounter of the CPU, over a period of time. This is done with the RDTSC instruction. You will get an approximation depending on the circumstances. Many programs convert this internally to a rounded MHz value such as 800, 566 or 233, while others show the raw measurement.

Why is PCI speed a concern?

gerwin wrote:

Why is PCI speed a concern?

Well, I've read of people overclocking the PCI bus to get better performance from cards (such as the Voodoo 2,) but I prefer not to overclock anything. I've been trying to double check DIP switch settings (the PDF manual I found on Gigabyte for the GA-6BXC leaves a lot to be desired.) I currently have it set for 100Mhz FSB, 8x Multiplier (though the CPU multiplier is fixed.) If I ever get the Slotket adapter I've been looking at with the 1.4Ghz processor, I would change that to a 14x multiplier and leave the FSB at 100Mhz.

Well, I now have a Thrustmaster ACM on it's way. The price was too good to resist, $12.99 with shipping for a one complete in the box. Not "factory sealed," like the $40 one I was originally looking at. But that isn't a major concern to me. If it doesn't fix my Wing Commander Armada problem, then I'm going to have to assume that is actually caused by something else. At this point, unless I can find another game to test that is "Known" to have polling issues, and it has a problem with my AWE32's port, I'm probably going to pull the ACM and sell it (eventually.)

I still sort of like the idea of multi-generation Voodoo cards 😀 Though I might not go that route, the idea just appeals to me. The only other route (where that's concerned,) that would be more appealing to me is if I could somehow install 3 different brands of 3D accelerators into the system without having to attack switch boxes or swap cables around. But don't see how that's possible. Right now it has 3Dfx & Nvidia (Voodoo 2 & TNT2.)

Though, until I get the AGP power issue on this MB corrected, I won't be using the 3D aspects of the TNT2 - It has the same power problems as the Voodoo 3 has when in heavy use. I'm not sure about soldering a wire onto the board. I would really prefer to look into some sort of protective circuitry first, instead of just attaching power directly like that. I've also been looking into replacing the board completely with one that has already fixed the problem, but would rather avoid that if I can. I have a substantial pile of MBs here now that I don't have a use for. I don't really want to add more to that pile. Still looking into it.

gerwin wrote:

FeedingDragon wrote:

1) I have a Gigabyte GA-6BXC MB, but it is only rev 1.9 (it does have the same voltage regulator as the v 2.0 - so it can still lower the CPU voltage for the 1.4G processor.) However, it does "not" have the Voodoo 3 dip switch setting for AGP. So, if I were to install a V3 3500 (one actually popped up that has me interested,) would my MB have problems with it? Some sites I've read say "no" but most say "yes". Was hoping someone had some direct experience with it to advise me.

GA-6BXC is my favorite mainboard 😀 I have two revision 2.0 examples. Most of the time they have a Voodoo 3 installed. Voodoo jumpers closed of course.

I remember the Voodoo jumpers are there to connect the PSU 3,3 Volt rail to the AGP connector. Without these jumpers the AGP connector gets 3,3 Volt from a small VRM, which is told to be struggle with a Voodoo 3. There is a wire mod for older GA-6BXC boards. I suppose this is it: http://www.plasma-online.de/english/upgrade/t … gabyte_tnt.html

Do you know if it's needed with the MSI 8808 TNT2 graphics card? Just confirmed from MSI that it runs at 3.0A. A lot lower than the 4-5A of the Voodoo 3 cards, but still over the 2.5A that I've read the regulator supplies. I really do not want to be soldering a wire onto the board if I don't have too.

I was told through PM that the linked image that illustrates the wire-mod for rev 1.9 mainboards does not show a proper GA-6BXC layout...

The image below shows the connections that the voodoo jumpers can make or break. The jumpers connect the orange 3,3V PSU supply to the backside pad of the VRM near the AGP port. I verified it with a multimeter, it is zero Ohm when jumpered.

So to do this mod on a rev 1.9: Solder a wire from that particular PSU header pin to the bolt of that particular VRM, either on the frontside or the backside of the mainboard. The back of the VRM is connected to its center leg.

Thanks 😀 My hands aren't steady enough for soldering work, so I've developed what I hope is a solution. First I take an extension connector (Pic 1.) Then I clip one of the orange (3.3V) wires (don't see a need to use all 3 really, unless told otherwise,) and splice in another wire. At the end of that wire I connect a Y cap (Pic 2.) Not sure if that's what it's actually called, but I've got some of those around here somewhere. Connect power with the extension. Loosen nut on the 3.3V point you located for me (thanks again,) slide Y cap under nut, tighten nut. Should work?? Seems like it will and since everything only requires crimping instead of soldering, my trembling hands (#@$* Parkinson's) should be able to handle it 😀

PIC 1

PIC 2

One final question, non specific to current experimentations. The build is almost complete 😀 CPU is maxed out. Considering maxing out the RAM (for Windows 98 - 512MB instead of current 386MB.) Maybe put in a DVD I/o a CD-ROM. Maybe replace TNT2 with Voodoo 3 3500. Maybe get a different PSU. Those are all things I've prepared for, and are in the nature of maxing out what the OS & MB can handle. Not worried about that.

That leaves me with an extra ISA/PCI slot. I've been thinking, and don't really have any idea what to put there. The whole purpose of this build was to build a machine that was the most an ISA native DOS/Win9x machine could be. The only requirements I really have are: Everything must have Windows 3.1 drivers (found those for Voodoo 3 - which surprised me greatly.) Must have full intelligent MPU-401 capability. Must have ISA audio with SoundFont support. Must have 3DFX capabilities. It currently has all that. But since I don't need the Thrustmaster ACM card, and I cannot get a Voodoo 1 to play nice with my Voodoo 2 SLI cards, I'm left with an empty slot (shared ISA/PCI,) and don't know what to put there. 14 years ago, I would have put a Modem there, but don't have a phone line to connect to it. Suggestions? Ideas?

Well, got one of the parts in and made the splice. Now just waiting on the fork connectors (or maybe the proper term is fork spade connectors.) I had to order 50, and they were the smallest I could find. But the cost wasn't too bad. 50 cost me $1.17, while a single connector was $6. Things like that have never made sense to me. I've tested the connection with my Volt-Ohm meter, and all looks good. The crimped connections are nice and tight. So, almost there, making my MB Voodoo 3 or TNT2 safe.

One good thing about this method, if I have to replace the MB in the future, I can transfer the mod to the new MB if it needs it 😀

Well, MOD finished. The MB should be Voodoo 3 & TNT2 safe now. Which is good since I have a TNT2 in it at the moment and have been considering putting a Voodoo 3 in it. I've also maxed everything else out as well. When I get it back together and everything tested out I'll probably proudly post the specs on it somewhere (system specs probably.) Still trying to figure out if I'm going to put anything in the final slot (shared ISA/PCI so I have plenty of options.)

Now that the MOD is in place, and everything is working. I pulled the TNT2 and installed a Voodoo 3 3500 TV card. Only now I get a bad video beep code (1 long 2 short.) Before I try to buy another V3, is it a bad card or is it possible this board can't handle the 3500 TV? The problem is, the only 3500's I could find were all TV versions 🙁 I could go for the 3000 I guess, but the whole point was to get the best that had Windows 3.1 drivers. The MB is a Gigabyte GA-6BXC revision 1.9 board (440BX Chipset,) with 100Mhz FSB, 66Mhz 3.3V AGP 2x.

On a GA-6BXC revision 2.0 board the Voodoo 3 2000 and 3000 work without problems. I don't have a 3500 to try.

The Voodoo 3 has trouble sitting completely. When the screw is tightened down, the back part of the card pops out a bit. Push it back in and it works great. Trying to figure out if there is a way to keep it from happening. If I jar the machine too much it pops out again 🙁 However, as long as it's fully inserted it works fine. Can also chose the card to use by using the appropriate OVL file, and there is no conflict with the Voodoo 2 SLI cards. All's good 😀

placing a washer ring under the card fixes this problem most of the time.

meljor wrote:

placing a washer ring under the card fixes this problem most of the time.

You mean under the retention bracket, right? That makes sense 😀