VOGONS


Socket-775 Clock Signals

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First post, by PARUS

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Hello to all!
I have unusual problem and I'd think maybe somebody knows something about it.
Motherboard: DFI G7S620-N, it's about socket-775, AGP8X, ISA. The official BIOS was released once. It hasn't any updates. This mb officially supports only NetBurst CPUs like Pentium 4 and Pentium D. But on our forum (Russia) one man did a great job - BIOS modification for Core 2 Duo and Pentium E CPUs. I can say that all CPUs got right detection including correct name, cache size etc and they are absolutely stable in Windows during many hours. But he could not solve one problem - all Conroe/Wolfdale CPUs work at only 100 MHz bus clock (FSB400). BSEL mod is not working on this mb. At the same time when I plug Pentium 4 or Pentium D the system detects FSB correctly, and I even can make BSEL mod to 133 (FSB533) or back to 200 (FSB800) MHz (BSEL0, BSEL1, BSEL2 contacts). But with Core CPU the bus frequency can't be higher than 100 MHz.
An author of this BIOS modification did his own test on other similar mb with this BIOS and Core CPUs. What do you think? Yes, nominal bus frequencies are available by BSEL mods. But on DFI aren't.
And: we did try to change bus clock during Windows sessions through programs-clockers without BIOS. When NetBurst CPU is plugged it doesn't cause problems, all is working 200->166->133->100->200. But when Core CPU is plugged any try to change bus frequency to other than 100 makes freezes.
I read Intel datasheets for Pentium 4 and for Core 2 Duo, they include signal tables. A signal tables for NetBurst and Core are much different. But I know and understand nothing in this.

Can somebody tell something about it? It is necessary to consult a person who knows hardware very well. Maybe someone knows such a man?
Thank you very much.

Last edited by PARUS on 2014-11-26, 18:06. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 1 of 47, by mockingbird

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Can you post the BIOS (The hacked one)?

I will add updated microcodes for you to see if that fixes the problem.

Coincidentally, I have an Asus P5PE-VM here, which is similar to your board in the respect that it's an 865G Socket775 board that also handles up to 65nm Core2 chips. Unfortunately, there's no AGP 3.3V support, only 0.8V and 1.5V. Otherwise, it would make a pretty good retro board.

Reply 2 of 47, by PARUS

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Oh, I'll very happy if you'll try to help. Thanks! You can try this BIOS on your ASUS board and say what you think if you don't mind.
By the way, my mb doesn't handle any Core (65nm too) in default and officially. Only NetBurst. But with this BIOS all Core chips are working, and 45nm too.
Yes, it has AGP3.0 bus, only 0.8V and 1.5V. But I use AGP only in Windows XP and with fast cards. In Windows 98 and DOS-mode I use PCI-card, it's a Voodoo MAC with DVI out. In DOS I also use ISA-sound. This mb is great decision as a multi-OS board.
How can I send you my modified BIOS?

Reply 3 of 47, by PARUS

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I just sent it in private message. The changes in this BIOS are:
- edited for supporting all CPUs 65nm Conroe / 45nm Wolfdale;
- ACPI moved from IRQ9 to IRQ10 (for use SoftMPU in DOS by IRQ2/9, otherwise with original BIOS there is a conflict);
- edited ISA startup diagnose, detecting ISA PnP devices (for use AV310, otherwise with original BIOS this sound card won't work in DOS).

OK. Please see it. I'm waiting. Thank you very much again.

Reply 4 of 47, by mockingbird

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Please run the utility in the file I have attached and post the output. I want to see a list of the current microcodes so I can know which ones need updating or which ones need to be added outright.

Filename
intelmicrocodelist_v04a.zip
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40.34 KiB
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179 downloads
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Fair use/fair dealing exception

Reply 6 of 47, by PARUS

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Does it matter which mb is running? As I understood this program checks BIOS file, not the hardware. I repeated this on other "new" computer with Win7 and got the same results. Did I do all correct?

Reply 7 of 47, by Zenn

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According to www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Core_2/Intel-Cor ... 7500).html, the CPUID for your E7500 is 1067A and I don't see that listed in the microcodes that you posted. You might want to try adding that microcode into your modded bios and see if it helps.

A quick glance at the list of microcodes show them to be dated mostly 2005 and earlier. Since Core 2 was released 2006 onwards, that might be causing the issue.

Reply 9 of 47, by mockingbird

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Hello,

The other poster was absolutely right.

I have replaced the previous microcode with that for Core2 chips. Please note: microcode for Pentium 4 chips has been removed temporarily, so please test this with your E7500, and if it fixes the problem, I can add back all the other microcode. I just did it this way because it is much faster, whereas I would have to combine all the microcode myself if I wanted to keep the old one.

cpucode_out.png
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cpucode_out.png
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Fair use/fair dealing exception

So this BIOS is for Core2 chips only (as you can see) in the mean time.

Filename
G7S620-N_Core2.zip
File size
287.28 KiB
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123 downloads
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Fair use/fair dealing exception

Please post CPU-Z result after flashing.

Reply 10 of 47, by NJRoadfan

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ASRock sold a few boards that supported 65nm Core2Duo with the 865, perhaps its worth a look at how they do it.
http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/ConRoe865PE/
http://www.asrock.com/mb/Intel/775i65G%20R3.0/

Keep in mind that you are overclocking DDR RAM if attempting 1066FSB CPUs.

Reply 11 of 47, by PARUS

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I flashed this one. The problem is not solved. FSB frequency is 100 MHz. Waiting for next instructions.
NJRoadfan, I know about these ASRock boards. They haven't ISA bus 😀 and I do not need it. DFI has ISA bus! If it were not so I would have never work with DFI and have never solve its program problems.
About FSB1066: I'm not going to use this frequency for i865 and DDR400. It's not good for this chipset and this memory. I use BSEL mod - BSEL1=H - for tuning FSB to 200 MHz (800).
Thanks to all for your participation! Sorry for my English.

Reply 14 of 47, by mockingbird

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It will work, but without the proper microcodes, you'll be missing features.

For example, it's possible to hack Xeon CPUs into LGA775 sockets, but if you don't add the Xeon Microcode, SSE4 and VT don't become enabled.

Sorry, I have no other ideas except to tell you to post at BIOS-MODS.com or maybe MDL forum.

I need to hook up with your Russian friend though, I have a P5B-VM SE, and maybe he can modify it for me to add AHCI.

Reply 15 of 47, by PARUS

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Thank you anyway! I'm going to continue experiments with Pentium 4 exactly. I think, probably, if I could try to isolate contacts related to frequency settings that would give me condition when mb can't set frequency higher than 100. Thus I can find out which contact makes this situation. Maybe yes, maybe no... worth to try?

Reply 17 of 47, by PARUS

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OK. It's not my first. Don't worry, I even don't touch the socket. I use very simple and reliable method: to glue adhesive tape pieces on processor contact pads. They are kept at their places and isolate very well.

Reply 18 of 47, by PARUS

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Hello again! I tried to isolate each of contacts on Pentium 4 and Pentium D that are relative to Common Clock. The bus is always 200 MHz or processor doesn't start.

Through program that uses low-level commands I tried to change FSB with Core 2 Duo higher than 100. Program is setPLL. Maximum 108 MHz is reached, not more. Now I think about power for internal CPU clock generator. The contact on socket that gives PLL power is VCCIOPLL for Pentium 4/D (for C2D it is VCCPLL). The "old" socket-775 has not VCCPLL contact, it has only VCCIOPLL and I take power for PLL from it. Maybe this is too low voltage/amperage for C2D pll-generator, isn't it? Tell please who knows what nominal V and A must present on VCCIOPLL/VCCPLL contact for NetBurst and Core2 architecture? Can I try take power for VCCPLL not from similar VCCIOPLL contact but from any VCC or VTT? Is it safe for CPU and MB?

Reply 19 of 47, by PARUS

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Add info: I have found that NetBurst VCCIOPLL line has 100mA max and Core2 VCCPLL line has 130mA max. At the same time the NetBurst VCCA line has 120mA max and for Core2 VCCA is not used. Question: can I use VCCA line for power VCCPLL on Core2 processor? Maybe 120mA is enough for 200 MHz starting...
But I don't know what voltage present on VCCA. Is it different than VCCIOPLL? I don't know it too.