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First post, by obobskivich

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Alright, this isn't a high-priority issue, but I'm kind of curious about it so if anyone has a simple fix or explanation I'll take it, but if it never gets "solved" it won't harm the machine that I can tell:

I recently got the Creative DVD-Encore 12x package for my Win98 box, which included a 12x Creative DVD-ROM drive. The drive itself works fine, and the whole setup plays DVD Video just fine in Windows 98 (basically it does what the box says it does). However, according to the user's manual, it's also supposed to be able to read DVD data discs. Whenever I put such a disc in, it acts like there's no disc in the drive, and Windows itself only sees it as a 40x CD-ROM (correct speed per the specs in the manual) in Device Manager. It works perfectly well for reading CDs of all types that I've tried (admittedly I haven't tried anything exotic like CDi or Super Video CD, but data CDs are correctly read). I don't have any reason to believe anything is defective.

Now, if that's just a limitation/quirk of this setup, I'm fine with that. But if there's some silly thing I forgot to do to make DVD-ROM work, I'd like to know. 😊 I know I've had DVD-ROM working with other drives over the years under 9x, but I honestly do not remember if it requires some sort of specialized driver/feature to be installed (similar to how USB flash drives require a mass storage driver or their own individual drivers). I do have the Creative drivers for the 12x drive installed, and like I said it plays DVD Video like its supposed to, it'd just be nice to be able to play ROM discs too. I doubt there's any games from this era that rely on that (none that I have and can think of do, so I'm OK with CD only), but I have some backups and whatnot on DVD that it'd be nice to be able to directly use (and worst case I can just keep doing what I've been doing: transfer them to USB flash drive on another machine with a DVD drive and plug that into the Win98 box and get it that way).

Reply 1 of 14, by mockingbird

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Get a decent drive. That drive is too old to be expected to read newer discs. DVDROMs were pretty prolific during Win98SE's lifetime.

I used a Toshiba SD-M1212 without any problems back then.

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Reply 2 of 14, by obobskivich

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mockingbird wrote:

Get a decent drive. That drive is too old to be expected to read newer discs. DVDROMs were pretty prolific during Win98SE's lifetime.

I used a Toshiba SD-M1212 without any problems back then.

It was new circa 2000/2001, and has no problems with any other media, including reading nearly brand new pressed DVD-Video discs; it seems to be a software thing more than a hardware thing as far as not reading data discs. And yes, I had a variety of DVD drives from around 1997 onwards, and know that it can work in 98SE, but I'm not recalling if there's any "gotcha" to enabling it, or if this may just be a quirk of Creative's drivers under 9x (outside of 9x it shows up as a CD/DVD drive - like in Puppy Linux or AIDA or what-have-you). Either way it isn't a big deal for a 98SE machine; I can't honestly name a single game that exclusively requires DVD for installation media, and also cannot work in Windows XP.

Reply 4 of 14, by King_Corduroy

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obobskivich wrote:
mockingbird wrote:

Get a decent drive. That drive is too old to be expected to read newer discs. DVDROMs were pretty prolific during Win98SE's lifetime.

I used a Toshiba SD-M1212 without any problems back then.

It was new circa 2000/2001, and has no problems with any other media, including reading nearly brand new pressed DVD-Video discs; it seems to be a software thing more than a hardware thing as far as not reading data discs. And yes, I had a variety of DVD drives from around 1997 onwards, and know that it can work in 98SE, but I'm not recalling if there's any "gotcha" to enabling it, or if this may just be a quirk of Creative's drivers under 9x (outside of 9x it shows up as a CD/DVD drive - like in Puppy Linux or AIDA or what-have-you). Either way it isn't a big deal for a 98SE machine; I can't honestly name a single game that exclusively requires DVD for installation media, and also cannot work in Windows XP.

Yeah I was going to say, I remember stealing the DVD drive off my families newer XP computer so that I could install and play my Command and Conquer : The First Decade collection on my old P3 machine (which was windows 98) back in the 2000's and it worked fine. It's just all about the age of the drive.

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Reply 5 of 14, by duncan

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Hi obobskivich,

...the first thing I´d try is an update of the firmware. Tried that already?

greetings, duncan

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Reply 6 of 14, by Unknown_K

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Original DVD drives probably have a hard time reading DVD-R or DVD+R media.

Collector of old computers, hardware, and software

Reply 9 of 14, by obobskivich

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devius wrote:

And does it read DVD-ROMs there?

Puppy boots from a DVD, so yes. 😊

Re: firmware, I've found nothing for this drive from Creative. It does have all of its proper 9x drivers installed though (without them installed the Dxr3 doesn't properly recognize it and it won't play DVD-Video).

Reply 10 of 14, by NJRoadfan

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The lack of decent UDF support in Windows 98SE is likely the problem. DVD Video discs have what are called "bridged ISO9660+UDF1.02" file systems to allow them to be read on older systems. Data discs usually don't run the bridged format and tend to use newer versions of the UDF file system (usually 2.0 or higher, 98SE can only read 1.02). Roxio has a UDF driver package for Windows 98 and 2000. http://www.roxio.com/enu/support/udf/software_updates.html

Reply 12 of 14, by obobskivich

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NJRoadfan wrote:

The lack of decent UDF support in Windows 98SE is likely the problem. DVD Video discs have what are called "bridged ISO9660+UDF1.02" file systems to allow them to be read on older systems. Data discs usually don't run the bridged format and tend to use newer versions of the UDF file system (usually 2.0 or higher, 98SE can only read 1.02). Roxio has a UDF driver package for Windows 98 and 2000. http://www.roxio.com/enu/support/udf/software_updates.html

I'll give that a try; thanks. 😀

Reply 13 of 14, by NJRoadfan

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Also, a 12X DVD-ROM drive should have no problem reading single layer DVD-R/DVD+R media. The 8X Panasonic drive that came with the circa 1999 Creative DXR3 kit had no problem with it (that drive could even read caddy-less DVD-RAM discs). Double layer recordable media is a different story, I have drives from 2003 that don't work with them.

Reply 14 of 14, by duncan

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Hi,
re🇷🇪 firmware: IIrc, Creative never "constructed" own drives, but labelled "foreign" stuff. With something like DrHard or comparable you might find out the original make and update firmware to the newest of that. Just a suggestion...
greetings duncan

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