I should add that I have some other PCI sound cards such as the SB PCI 512 and the SB Ensoniq PCI.

boxpressed wrote:

What are the disadvantages of using a PnP ISA card such as the AWE64 Gold as your only Win98SE sound card? I use this card when I boot to DOS.

You don't get EAX. That's about the only disadvantage I can think of.

There are some good advantages to using an AWE64:
- They work flawlessly with Win98SE.
- You don't need to install drivers with Win98SE; they're built into the OS.
- No stutter or impact on framerates
- Much greater compatibility with DOS games.

I run several AWE64 cards. I think they're great!

boxpressed wrote:

I could not get two different SB Live! cards to work with Win98SE even after using the install CDs from Vogonsdrivers for my model numbers. I read about the other problems people have had with the Live! drivers. I'm done with Live! on this Win98SE build.

What sort of problem were you having? If you describe the problem, perhaps the community here can help you fix it.

boxpressed wrote:

I'll eventually seek out a Vortex 2 (have one in another build), but I might just use the AWE64 for games like Quake 2, Jedi Knight, and Unreal. I know that I won't get positional audio like EAX, but that's okay. Will it drop framerates? What else do I lose? Thanks for your advice.

Phil is rather fond of the Vortex 2 cards, so I'm sure he'll drop by shortly with some good advice for you regarding them.

I would love to try a Vortex 2 card someday, but I don't want to pay the premium for one. Also, they supposedly suffer from some driver issues like the SBLive cards.

I like both, the AWE64 and the Vortex 2. Both are great for Windows 98 SE. The AWE64 is obviously stronger in DOS, the Vortex 2 has A3D going for it with.

I don't remember how I went with the Audio PCI (Ensoniq card, but purchased by Creative and re-badged in a few Creative cards). I believe I got stuttering sound in RTCW, but I don't recall 100%. But for some reason I never went back to it.

I think it comes down to whether you also want to play games in "real DOS".
If that is the case, then stick with the AWE64, which is still an ISA sound card.

My experience is that PCI based sound cards do not work well in a "real DOS" environment but, does work well in a Windows 98 environment, provided you have the correct and latest drivers installed.

Back in the day (being around 2000/2001), my Sound Blaster Live! 1024 worked quite well on my Celeron 566 with Windows 98SE installed.

EAX itself isn't responsible for positional audio, but many games don't use DirectSound3D unless you also activate EAX.

KT7AGuy wrote:

What sort of problem were you having? If you describe the problem, perhaps the community here can help you fix it.

I'm having trouble finding a driver/install CD for a specific Live! model, CT4830. According to this list

http://support.creative.com/kb/ShowArticle.aspx?sid=10846

It is a Sound Blaster Live! Value/Player Compaq /Intel/IBM/NEc. I think this is a really odd model of the Live!

I used the install CD from Vogonsdrivers (Sound Blaster Live! Install (VXD 4.12.01.0905 + WDM) CD) that listed the CT4830 in the description.

Windows doesn't recognize the card afterward, so I still get "PCI Multimedia Audio Device" and "PCI Input Controller" question marks in Device Manager. I think I tried to install other CDs over it and started getting error messages about AudioHQ. I finally had to do a fresh install of Windows.

Thanks for your offer. I'm going to try one more time with the drivers off Creative's site and then quit if they don't work.

boxpressed wrote:

I'm having trouble finding a driver/install CD for a specific Live! model, CT4830.

Well then, you're in luck! I own two CT4830 cards as well as the original driver disc for them.

When I get a chance, I'll make an ISO and upload to the library. When I do, I'll send you a message to let you know it's available.

So nice of you. Thank you very much!

I love the creative isa cards and use them in every 98se system i build. I use the sb16, awe32 and awe64 and they all just simply work. Never gave me troubles.
I only use a Live! in my Tualatin system (and newer systems an audigy) since there is no isa slot...

There will be better cards but for me they are just fine and easy to find/buy.

When I was fiddling around with the two Live! models I have, I was able to get Windows to recognize one. I'm not sure I was using the proper driver, which is why I gave up. The sound seemed okay but just "off," if you know what I mean. I had to restore the classic Windows start sound (rather than EAX thunder), but the first couple of seconds of the sound was cut off. And all of the sounds in Quake 2 were all out of proportion, some too loud, some too soft. I tried to install the PCI 512 (similar to Live!) and got the same results.

The AWE64 sounds GREAT with Win98SE. I have to think that Microsoft used it as a reference board when designing Windows 98 because the built-in drivers are perfect.

I'd love to hear what others think who have an AWE64 and a PCI card in the same build. I imagine that some games will favor one over the other.

Sb live and vortex gets you hardware acceleration which can help boost fps on win9x games.

About the sb live cards. I had an issue where i could not install drivers on a oem card until i added its vendor id to the .inf file. After that it worked.

I currently have an audigy 2 installed with win me and do have issues with dos games like duke 3d and carmageddon 1

I also ran into driver issue with the Live! cards. It seems they are very picky regarding what driver you need to use.

Another thing I like about the ISA cards is how simple / small the drivers are. I always go with the 9x driver update from the Creative website.

RogueTrip2012, could you outline how editing the INF file works? I can see many people finding this useful.

I used to run a dual-card SBLive PCI + SB16 ISA in my K6-2-based Win98SE build. The idea was to benefit from the ISA card in DOS games, and the Live in Windows games, especially since I had a 4.1 speaker system at the time and wanted the surround sound capabilities of the Live.

The way I had it set up was that the Live was the default card for Windows, and its Front Out was routed to the Line In of the SB16, whose own Line Out was feeding the front 2 speakers. The Rear Out was routed directly to the rear speakers. This way I got all 4 speakers active in Windows, and in DOS I still had the native stereo from the SB16.

Granted, I probably lost some signal quality routing the audio of the SBLive through the SB16, but it never bothered me much. It's not like those were particularly good speakers either.

In recent years, with this old setup getting less use, and the 4.1 system replaced with standard stereo speakers, I realized I have no use for the SBLive to warrant this complex setup. So I just disabled it in the device manager, and use the ISA card (which has since been replaced with an AWE64) as the primary and only sound device in DOS and Windows.

Yes, I used to be the same way. I still have a Logitech 2.1 speaker set with a giant subwoofer that I need to donate. Now I just want small speakers that get the job done. I was using a tiny Jawbone Jambox bluetooth speaker until I remembered that there was a soundbar option for an old monitor that I recently put back into use.

I bought this monitor back in 2004 and retired it a few years ago in favor of a Samsung LCD TV. The Samsung was great, but I never liked the 16:9 aspect. So the Dell 2001FP will be my main monitor for my "main" and retro computers. The speaker power plugs into the base of the monitor, so there's one fewer wire on the desk. 1600x1200 IPS screen. Looks great even with VGA input (and HDMI via DVI dongle).

Ah, yeah, the DELL soundbars. But aren't these speakers tiny? How do they sound really, compared to a standard set of $20 stereo speakers?

I have a DELL 2007FP myself, the somewhat rare silver bezel S-IPS variant. It didn't fit my primary desktop at the time, but now fits perfectly with the old P4 desktop in a silver TT Lanmoto case. I like DELL IPS monitors. 😀

Back on topic, I am kinda surprised about the issues you experience, since I don't recall having any problems getting the Live to work in Win98SE. But mine is a standard retail variant, I think. Perhaps the OEM ones are more picky about drivers?

Strangely, in contrast to your experience, my Windows 98SE did not want to pick up the AWE64 on the fly, and insisted that I point it to the Win9x driver directory under the Soundblaster directory.

The speakers are okay, and I've really stopped caring too much about audio fidelity. (I'm using a laptop for my main computer, and I've been using its built-in speakers for years.) With a family, I can't really crank the sound anyway. I'm more concerned about desktop space and a lack of wire clutter.

Yes, I think the 2001FP has the "inferior" IPS screen that Dell used. If this monitor ever dies, I'll probably try to pick up the 2007FP.

I think these OEM Live! models are a tricky bunch. I'm just fine with the AWE64 until I get around to finding another Vortex 2.

OK, I got the drivers uploaded here:

Sound Blaster Live! Install CT4830 CT4832 CT4760

My Live! was on OEM variant.
I later downloaded the updated drivers from Creative's website and it worked fine.
My AWE64 value I also downloaded the latest drivers from Creative's website and also had no problems.

Guess sometimes one just has bad luck. Could be a conflict or some weird BIOS setting causing the driver installation to fail?

You can also try this disc too:

Sound Blaster Live! Install Retail Disc

I haven't tried this one yet, personally.