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Loving my new 486!! Asus VL/I-486SV2GX4

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Reply 20 of 80, by chrisNova777

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alexanrs wrote:

Older BIOSes do not support booting from the CD-ROM. Whatever it is you want to install on a 486 most probably also offer an option to boot from a floppy.

i have both msdos 6.22 + windows 3.11 installations on cd.. i dont have either on floppy 😒

http://www.oldschooldaw.com | vintage PC/MAC MIDI/DAW | Asus mobo archive | Sound Modules | Vintage MIDI Interfaces
AM386DX40 | Asus VL/I-486SV2GX4 (486DX2-80) | GA586VX (p75) + r7000PCI | ABIT Be6 (pII-233) matroxG400 AGP

Reply 21 of 80, by alexanrs

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Browse the setup CD on another computer. I'd expect it to have a tool for creating a boot disk. Worst case scenario create a simple MS-DOS 6.22 boot disk (easy to find on the internet), add himem.sys, mscdex.exe and something like VIDE-CDD.sys or OAKCDROM.sys, configure it (autoexec.bat and config.sys), boot from that, browse the CD, find the setup executable and start it manually.

Reply 22 of 80, by Malvineous

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Have you tried Smart Boot Manager? It claims to be able to boot from a CD when you lack BIOS support.

Although...was Windows 3.x ever distributed on a bootable CD? I know DOS certainly wasn't!

If there's no utility for creating a boot disk as alexanrs suggested, you can find a floppy image of a Win98 recovery boot disk online pretty easily, and it will load CD drivers for common hardware.

Reply 23 of 80, by gerwin

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To lazy to quote the questions, but some answers.

Generally for a 486 VLB you need 30 or 72-Pin FPM RAM. Unfortunately the larger capacity Simms on sale are usually of the more modern EDO type.

You can easily put your system on 33MHz FSB, and it will work with all socket 3 CPUs and expansion cards. 33MHz FSB is the most compatible setting. Your 486DX2-80 can also run on 33MHz FSB, it will just perform and behave exactly like a 486DX2-66.

Transferring files to a new and empty 486 can be a headache, as it has no USB ports. One has to setup an easy way of transferring files, and I don't know if floppies can still be regarded as easy. Just moving the harddisk around is an option. I prefer SD-Card adapters as shown below. CF-Card adapters are similar. Getting the BIOS to recognize the SD or CF card may still require some tinkering, but once set every transfer is a breeze. For completeness: network FTP transfer is also possible.

SD-Card to IDE Female Adapter.jpg
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--> ISA Soundcard Overview // Doom MBF 2.04 // SetMul

Reply 24 of 80, by chrisNova777

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gerwin wrote:

You can easily put your system on 33MHz FSB, and it will work with all socket 3 CPUs and expansion cards. 33MHz FSB is the most compatible setting. Your 486DX2-80 can also run on 33MHz FSB, it will just perform and behave exactly like a 486DX2-66.

i JUST got finished changing JP25 to change the FSB from 40MHz to 33MHz and see that it states it is a dx2 66MHz now when u boot up!

i actually have a few CF + SD IDE Adapters here 😉 and there is a DLINK ISA Network card installed aswell... but when i boot up theres an error that its missing network.drv..
i wanted to do a wipe install anyways - its some guys hard drive from 1997 with his confidential business database on the hd etc.. so i should probably wipe it.. its a 540MB IDE drive 😉 🤣 funny

my SD card actually has a PCI bracket so u can insert the SD card externally from the back of the machine too!
the only issue is it will block 2 isa slots if u put it in just any slot position - theres only one slot that it fits in properly on my board
the height of the pci bracket attachment is to blame.. it could have more then enough room to fit

http://www.oldschooldaw.com | vintage PC/MAC MIDI/DAW | Asus mobo archive | Sound Modules | Vintage MIDI Interfaces
AM386DX40 | Asus VL/I-486SV2GX4 (486DX2-80) | GA586VX (p75) + r7000PCI | ABIT Be6 (pII-233) matroxG400 AGP

Reply 25 of 80, by chrisNova777

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i checked the manual just now and it looks like i have the least amount of cache possible.. 128k.. and that it can support 256k 512k + up to 1MB of cache
is it worth my time+ effort + money to track down 1MB or 512k of cache for this board?

http://www.oldschooldaw.com | vintage PC/MAC MIDI/DAW | Asus mobo archive | Sound Modules | Vintage MIDI Interfaces
AM386DX40 | Asus VL/I-486SV2GX4 (486DX2-80) | GA586VX (p75) + r7000PCI | ABIT Be6 (pII-233) matroxG400 AGP

Reply 26 of 80, by Skyscraper

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chrisNova777 wrote:

i checked the manual just now and it looks like i have the least amount of cache possible.. 128k.. and that it can support 256k 512k + up to 1MB of cache
is it worth my time+ effort + money to track down 1MB or 512k of cache for this board?

If you only are going to use DOS and Windows 3.11 then perhaps not, if you are going to run Windows 95 then yes at least 256KB cache would rather good to have as Windows 9x uses the memory top down and 128KB can only cache 16MB. If you are going to run the system with 64MB memory in Windows 9x then get 512KB, I think getting the full 1MB is very expensive so only do that if you know you are going to max out the memory in the future.

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Reply 27 of 80, by jesolo

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chrisNova777 wrote:

my question right now is.. is that the reason why i cant get two VLB cards working at the same time? why my VLB io Controller wont see my hard drive?
and if so, is it because im trying to get two cards running at the same time? ie: if i swapped out my graphics card for a simpler ISA only card.. would i then be able to run
the IO Controller on the VLB slot no problem, despite the 40MHz FSB?

It's possible. On my motherboard I'm running both my VLB cards without any problems but, at the standard 33 MHz FSB.
What you can try (most VLB motherboards have this option), is to set the VLB wait states to 1 (there is usually a jumper on the motherboard for this). This is sometimes important if you increase your FSB to above 33 MHz.
Also, what size is your HDD? I think that this motherboard's BIOS only supports up to 2.1 GB HDD (in terms of capacity).
You also need to check the jumper settings on the VLB I/O controller card to make sure everything is enabled/configured properly.

chrisNova777 wrote:

if i had to only run one vlb card at a time, which is more beneficial? graphics or io controller? im thinking io controller.. but does that translate to better disk read/write speed because its connected
via VLB which has a higher bandwidth then ISA?

I'm inclined to say rather go for a VLB graphics card. Unless you're running an operating system that utilises 32-bit disk & file access (DOS is not one of them), you will not benefit from the 32-bit controller much. Windows 3.11 does provide support for both 32-bit disk and file access but, I've read that this causes problems.

chrisNova777 wrote:
also i have additional question/inquiry regarding the higher cpus.. if i was to upgrade to a 5x86 AMD or Cyrix.. do these do 33M […]
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also i have additional question/inquiry regarding the higher cpus..
if i was to upgrade to a 5x86 AMD or Cyrix.. do these do 33MHz FSB?
whats the highest cpu i can get for this motherboard.. that still maintains a 33MHz FSB?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Am5x86 <-- here it says 33 MT/s for the Am5x86-P75.. is this the same as 33Mhz?

Only BIOS revision 0402.001 (beta) supports the AM5x86 CPU. It should work on older revisions but, it probably won't display the CPU properly in the boot up screen.
In it's standard form, the AM5x86 runs at a FSB of 33 MHz with a multiplier of 4x, which then runs at 133 MHz. You can overclock it to a FSB of 40 MHz which, with a multiplier of 4x, will run at 160 MHz. From reports I've seen, it's still very stable at this speed.

Reply 28 of 80, by Caluser2000

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Older bioss do not see optical drives at all. You need to install a dos driver to access the drives in dos. There's a tutorial here http://www.computerhope.com/cdromd.htm

Using a boot disk such as the PLOP boot disk which allows you to boot a bootable CDRom on older boxen. It's linux based and gives you a menu of selections, one if which is to boot the cdrom. You may need an earlier version of PLOP boot manager for this system. I'm using version 5.0.13, it works well. I've tested it with a number of bootable cds on a couple of 386 and 486 systems.

PLOP boot manager is certainly a tool one should have in their RetroComputing tool box.

Last edited by Caluser2000 on 2015-11-07, 05:20. Edited 2 times in total.

There's a glitch in the matrix.
A founding member of the 286 appreciation society.
Apparently 32-bit is dead and nobody likes P4s.
Of course, as always, I'm open to correction...😉

Reply 29 of 80, by soviet conscript

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Yes, the amd 5x86 would be a 33mhz fsb 33x4=133. A pentium overdrive would also work with 33x2.5=83mhz a Cyrix 133mhz would also work but good luck finding one of those.

Reply 30 of 80, by soviet conscript

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chrisNova777 wrote:

i checked the manual just now and it looks like i have the least amount of cache possible.. 128k.. and that it can support 256k 512k + up to 1MB of cache
is it worth my time+ effort + money to track down 1MB or 512k of cache for this board?

Not really. After 256K you end up with diminishing returns. Of course it may help but it's not really worth the effort.

Reply 31 of 80, by chrisNova777

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hey guys just an update.. after changing the jumper to 33 MHz FSB i managed to get the vlb io controller to work!!!! its seeing my hard drive just fine now..
i thought that maybe it was a problem with seating the card correctly.. but maybe the jumper to change the fsb really did the trick?

http://www.oldschooldaw.com | vintage PC/MAC MIDI/DAW | Asus mobo archive | Sound Modules | Vintage MIDI Interfaces
AM386DX40 | Asus VL/I-486SV2GX4 (486DX2-80) | GA586VX (p75) + r7000PCI | ABIT Be6 (pII-233) matroxG400 AGP

Reply 32 of 80, by jesolo

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chrisNova777 wrote:

hey guys just an update.. after changing the jumper to 33 MHz FSB i managed to get the vlb io controller to work!!!! its seeing my hard drive just fine now..
i thought that maybe it was a problem with seating the card correctly.. but maybe the jumper to change the fsb really did the trick?

Try perhaps by changing the VLB wait state jumpers (JP28 & JP29) on the motherboard when you increase the FSB to 40 MHz.
There is also a VESA clock delay jumper (JP26) that you can try (the default is pins 1&2 closed).
Maybe it will then read the I/O controller.

Reply 33 of 80, by feipoa

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If you want to max out your 486 VLB system, I suggest going for 1024K cache. It is a novelty more than a performance enhancer. With some online inniative, you should be able to source each cache module (128kx8) for around $1.x USD each, before shipping. As your motherboard has a PS/2 header, I recommend using it. PS/2 mice and 486's are highly sought after.

For the CPU, aim for an AMD Am5x86-133, sometimes called an X5, or a Am5x86-P75. As was already pointed out, many VLB systems can be made stable with a 40 MHz FSB. An Am5x86 at 160 MHz (40x4) has comparible ALU performance to a Cyrix 5x86-133. Since you will unlikely be playing FPU-demanding games, the FPU strength of the Cyrix 5x86 is of less importance. By way of example, Doom timedemo 3, on an Am5x86-160 scores 60.5 fps, whereas on an IBM 5x86c-133/2x system, it scores 58.1 fps.

If you are inclined to spend a lot of money on graphics, you could buy a Creative 3D Blaster VLB card, there about a dozen 3D accelerated games you can play whereby the FPU strength of a Cyrix 5x86-133 might benefit, depending on the game. The benefit of the [rare] Cyrix 5x86-133 is that you can run your FSB at 33 MHz, which reduces complications with expansion cards and a 40 MHz front-side bus. Alternately, if you want to play FPU-demanding games in software mode, you might consider a Pentium Overdrive 83 MHz (POD83) and run it at 100 MHz (40x2.5), however not many POD's will run at 100 MHz. A POD at 83 MHz will still have better FPU performance compared to an Am5x86-160, however the ALU is a little lacking. Even boards and BIOSes which claim to have POD support do not work properly with a POD.

Plan your life wisely, you'll be dead before you know it.

Reply 34 of 80, by firage

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feipoa wrote:

For the CPU, aim for an AMD Am5x86-133, sometimes called an X5, or a Am5x86-P75

AMD's alternative product name for the chip is Am486DX5-133, part of the Enhanced Am486® DX Microprocessor Family. One brand for the consumers and another for the industrial market, I guess. 😀

My big-red-switch 486

Reply 36 of 80, by Artex

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Great, solid board. I built a decent system around it using an AMD-X5-133ADZ (Am5x86-P75) in WB mode:

...my 133Mhz results here: Re: Build 486's And They Will Come! Suggestions please!

...and 160Mhz OC results here: Build 486's And They Will Come! Suggestions please!

..and my scanned manual here: download/file.php?id=14937

feipoa wrote:

If you are inclined to spend a lot of money on graphics, you could buy a Creative 3D Blaster VLB card.

And DO let me know if you find one.. 😜

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Reply 37 of 80, by feipoa

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RacoonRider wrote:

feipoa,
How does Cyrix 5x86-100GP compare to 5x86-133? Are they the same chip with different multipliers or is 133MHz version unique?

They are the same chip with different multipliers. There are some Cyrix 5x86-100 chips which also have a 4x multiplier, but they will not function reliably at 133 MHz. These chips were Cyrix 5x86-133 chips which failed qualification at 133 MHz, so they were sold with the intention of being used in 25 MHz bus systems.

Plan your life wisely, you'll be dead before you know it.

Reply 38 of 80, by RacoonRider

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feipoa wrote:
RacoonRider wrote:

feipoa,
How does Cyrix 5x86-100GP compare to 5x86-133? Are they the same chip with different multipliers or is 133MHz version unique?

They are the same chip with different multipliers. There are some Cyrix 5x86-100 chips which also have a 4x multiplier, but they will not function reliably at 133 MHz. These chips were Cyrix 5x86-133 chips which failed qualification at 133 MHz, so they were sold with the intention of being used in 25 MHz bus systems.

Thanks!

Reply 39 of 80, by chrisNova777

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i have re-enabled the 40mhz fsb for now because im using the non-vlb io controller..
i would be happy if someone could help me to get my ps/2 mosue to work.

http://www.oldschooldaw.com | vintage PC/MAC MIDI/DAW | Asus mobo archive | Sound Modules | Vintage MIDI Interfaces
AM386DX40 | Asus VL/I-486SV2GX4 (486DX2-80) | GA586VX (p75) + r7000PCI | ABIT Be6 (pII-233) matroxG400 AGP