WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Jo22 » 2019-6-09 @ 23:40

Gahhhrrrlic wrote:No ethernet. I took it out. Thing is, there's nothing to optimize because this is a fresh windows install and I am working with only the autoexec/config
that windows produces after dos is installed so it's got essentially nothing in it. This is why I can't figure out why there's a memory problem.
If it has something to do with the fragmentation of the lower 1MB (if I got that right), then I find that odd considering a fresh install but I'm willing to give that a try except
that Fix1MB doesn't seem to do anything at all. I'm probably not invoking it properly but with no instructions around I don't know the right way to use it.

Ah, ok. I hoped it could improve some things depending on the configuration.. MemMaker perhaps making changes the EMM386 line in config.sys.
Including memory of the monochrome area etc., doing modifications to sytem.ini/win.ini and so on. Otherwise, I don't know what is going wrong on this machine.
Maybe changing Himem.sys helps. You could try using that from Win98SE. Just copy it to C: and change the path in config.sys so it loads the new driver.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-10 @ 04:25

What about this Fix1MB thing? If the amount of memory is not the problem, maybe it's as the author of the program said... that the memory needs to be fragmented to force the OS to use XMS above 1MB. I would love to try this out but I can't get the damn thing to work. Have you used this before?
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby bjwil1991 » 2019-6-10 @ 04:44

Windows for Workgroups 3.11 did the same thing on my Packard Bell Pack-Mate 28 Plus with 32MB RAM installed as well.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-10 @ 17:28

bjwil1991 wrote:Windows for Workgroups 3.11 did the same thing on my Packard Bell Pack-Mate 28 Plus with 32MB RAM installed as well.


Did you figure out how to fix it?
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby bjwil1991 » 2019-6-10 @ 20:51

There is a way to edit the command prompt PIF file to increase the amount of RAM to, for example, 8,192KB or 8MB. I removed Windows for Workgroups 3.11 as DOS games never worked with it very well or would lock up the system and I installed Windows 95C along with DOS 6.22 so I can still play DOS games in both DOS 6.22 and Windows 95C.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-10 @ 22:53

bjwil1991 wrote:There is a way to edit the command prompt PIF file to increase the amount of RAM to, for example, 8,192KB or 8MB. I removed Windows for Workgroups 3.11 as DOS games never worked with it very well or would lock up the system and I installed Windows 95C along with DOS 6.22 so I can still play DOS games in both DOS 6.22 and Windows 95C.


I take that to mean that Windows is not initially set up to use all available ram? In my case I'm running 3.1 for the nostalgia of the apps I used to have on it and i have another 95 machine so sadly I'll need to work this issue out somehow.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby yawetaG » 2019-6-11 @ 05:25

Gahhhrrrlic wrote:Sorry to necro a topic but I'm having the exact same issue. The only difference is that I have had this problem for so long that I'm deep into troubleshooting territory and have the most basic setup right now with nothing else installed. Essentially from a wiped hard drive the sequence I followed was:

Install DOS 6.22
Install sound drivers and test
Install WFW 3.11
Install sound drivers for windows
Add UDVD and MSCDEX and alter Config and Autoexec to enable CD-ROM support


Machine specs? Origin of software?

With drive letter now showing in Windows as well as DOS, I tried to install Groliers Multimedia Encyclopedia and got the following error:

"There is not enough memory to start the specified application. Quit one or more applications, and then try again."


OS, or program error? Sometimes, rotten installers also give out-of-memory errors...
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-12 @ 06:14

yawetaG wrote:
Gahhhrrrlic wrote:Sorry to necro a topic but I'm having the exact same issue. The only difference is that I have had this problem for so long that I'm deep into troubleshooting territory and have the most basic setup right now with nothing else installed. Essentially from a wiped hard drive the sequence I followed was:

Install DOS 6.22
Install sound drivers and test
Install WFW 3.11
Install sound drivers for windows
Add UDVD and MSCDEX and alter Config and Autoexec to enable CD-ROM support


Machine specs? Origin of software?

With drive letter now showing in Windows as well as DOS, I tried to install Groliers Multimedia Encyclopedia and got the following error:

"There is not enough memory to start the specified application. Quit one or more applications, and then try again."


OS, or program error? Sometimes, rotten installers also give out-of-memory errors...


It's definitely an OS error.

MB1333C-40CH
AMD 40MHz DX (operating at 33MHz)
387
8MB RAM
VGA Wonder 1024
ESS 1868F sound card
DOS 6.22
WFW 3.11
Trying to install Groliers Multimedia Encyclopedia 95 from CD-ROM
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-12 @ 19:00

Since I can't figure out how to correctly use Fix1MB or 1MBFort and since all the windows updates I've attempted have made no difference, what about just closing processes until maybe the error goes away?

...except I don't know how to do that either. How do I start closing stuff? Actually I'm not running 1 single thing since this is a fresh install but I'm sure there are probably some system processes in the background. If nobody has any other suggestions I guess I just need to know how to terminate those?
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Caluser2000 » 2019-6-12 @ 21:19

Tried installing from any other CD? Might even be the cdrom driver. Try a different one, something a bit closer to the period win/wfw 3.11 was common.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-13 @ 00:18

Caluser2000 wrote:Tried installing from any other CD? Might even be the cdrom driver. Try a different one, something a bit closer to the period win/wfw 3.11 was common.


I have gone so far as to copy the entire CD to the hard drive and try running it from there and I got the exact same error. Also, I only have this CD because back in the 90s the same machine had this software running on it just fine. I don't think it was WFW.. maybe just regular 3.1 at that time but I don't see why it should just stop working now. This has to be the way I have windows set up and maybe Groliers making a shitty exe file... however it did work before.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Jo22 » 2019-6-13 @ 01:29

Hm. Installation of the program itself started out fine here. Until it tried to install QuickTime 2.x.
The pictures you see were taken with PCem (PC AT) and vanilla Windows 3.10.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Jo22 » 2019-6-13 @ 01:34

After a bit of experimention, I finally got it to work with an old version of QuickTime 1.1 for Windows.
I also changed PCem to emulation of a generic 386SX. Windows 3.10 ran in Enhanced Mode, of course.
From what I can tell, the program merely uses QuickTime for playback of movie files.
DOS and Windows were pretty much left to default settings.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Caluser2000 » 2019-6-13 @ 10:21

The kernal386 error is an obvious clue I guess. Quicktime expects to run on a 386 0r higher by the looks.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Jo22 » 2019-6-13 @ 15:15

I think the same. However, it is hard to say what really is going on.

Unless, of course, I manage find my crystal ball again and be able to gaze at the hardware and software configuration.. ;)
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-13 @ 19:56

Jo22 wrote:I think the same. However, it is hard to say what really is going on.

Unless, of course, I manage find my crystal ball again and be able to gaze at the hardware and software configuration.. ;)


Your results are consistent with the fact that when it worked on my machine, it was probably running 3.1. However now that I'm running WFW, maybe that's what the problem is. Any way you can test with that OS to see if you get the same error? A year or 2 ago I remember completing the installation successfully using WFW but then it wouldn't run properly so I think something is screwy with WFW.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby yawetaG » 2019-6-13 @ 21:06

Gahhhrrrlic wrote:
Jo22 wrote:I think the same. However, it is hard to say what really is going on.

Unless, of course, I manage find my crystal ball again and be able to gaze at the hardware and software configuration.. ;)


Your results are consistent with the fact that when it worked on my machine, it was probably running 3.1. However now that I'm running WFW, maybe that's what the problem is. Any way you can test with that OS to see if you get the same error? A year or 2 ago I remember completing the installation successfully using WFW but then it wouldn't run properly so I think something is screwy with WFW.


Well, you could check whether you can disable some of the additional features WfW has over Win 3.1 and whether that resolves your problem.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-13 @ 23:17

yawetaG wrote:
Gahhhrrrlic wrote:
Jo22 wrote:I think the same. However, it is hard to say what really is going on.

Unless, of course, I manage find my crystal ball again and be able to gaze at the hardware and software configuration.. ;)


Your results are consistent with the fact that when it worked on my machine, it was probably running 3.1. However now that I'm running WFW, maybe that's what the problem is. Any way you can test with that OS to see if you get the same error? A year or 2 ago I remember completing the installation successfully using WFW but then it wouldn't run properly so I think something is screwy with WFW.


Well, you could check whether you can disable some of the additional features WfW has over Win 3.1 and whether that resolves your problem.



I would love to but I'm still trying to find the answers to basic questions like how to terminate tasks and how to use Fix1MB. I have no clue how to do what you're asking so I'll add it to the list for now lol.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby yawetaG » 2019-6-14 @ 05:17

Gahhhrrrlic wrote:
yawetaG wrote:
Gahhhrrrlic wrote:
Your results are consistent with the fact that when it worked on my machine, it was probably running 3.1. However now that I'm running WFW, maybe that's what the problem is. Any way you can test with that OS to see if you get the same error? A year or 2 ago I remember completing the installation successfully using WFW but then it wouldn't run properly so I think something is screwy with WFW.


Well, you could check whether you can disable some of the additional features WfW has over Win 3.1 and whether that resolves your problem.


I would love to but I'm still trying to find the answers to basic questions like how to terminate tasks


Via the Task List (Ctrl-Esc), but versions of Windows prior to 95/NT were not exactly the epitome of stability and usually a crashed program takes down the whole OS. Windows 95-98 are slightly better, but not much. In that case you use Ctrl-Alt-Delete (to reboot).

and how to use Fix1MB. I have no clue how to do what you're asking so I'll add it to the list for now lol.


Isn't the manual available somewhere online?

Anyway, most of those features should be adequately explained in Windows 3.x Help for the System configuration.
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Re: WFW 3.11 using all available ram?

Postby Gahhhrrrlic » 2019-6-14 @ 06:37

I'll try Ctrl-Esc to close as many processes as I can to see if freeing up memory as the error suggests, actually helps.

I'm sure there's a windows manual online but I didn't think that would tell you how to disable features that were unique to WFW.


Maybe I'll just have to try 3.1 instead. Only problem there is, I thought you couldn't network with 3.1. Can you get LAN and TCP/IP with 3.1? If so, i might just give up and go back to that.
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