DjLc wrote:

CT3600= CT-2502 SDQ = CQM (Creative Quadrature Modulaton aka opl3 emulation). […]
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CT3600= CT-2502 SDQ = CQM (Creative Quadrature Modulaton aka opl3 emulation).

OPL2 = YM3812
OPL3 =YMF262/YMF289x/YMF71x/CT1747
OPL4 = YMF278
CQM = CT2502/CT1978

Goldfinch card was used to be an upgrade for SB16.

@ElBrunzy

If you want to know the difference between your cards, tell us wich chips are on it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7y5z4BBq3w
CT1747 <-- is this an example of CQM?

this video seems appropriate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQxOjAXwuzw
but too bad my mixer on windows 7 wont easily let me pan between the two... #fail 😉

chrisNova777 wrote:

CT1747 <-- is this an example of CQM?

No, CT1747 has an integrated opl3 core made by Yamaha and some revision got the OPL logo on it.

It really depends on what SB32 and AWE32 models are in question.

The only way you can distinguish SB32 from AWE32 is absence of Wavetable header and onboard RAM.

Other stuff depends on the model of SB32 PnP.

CT3930 - Vibra16 chip - CT2501
CT3600 - CT2502
CT3620 - Classic AWE32 chips - CT1741/CT1745
CT3670 - AWE64 chips - CT8903/CT1745T

chrisNova777: My question was not that at all, my original poster question was ... well ... I dont know ... was a waveblaster worth the same of a gus ace ?

The Waveblaster I and Waveblaster II were Creative Labs attempts to make GM add on boards to head off companies like Roland from taking over what they saw as "their" market. Both cards responded to standard GM commands but the first card had rather poor samples and received poor reviews. The second card tried to improve on the first by using a better quality sample set, but neither card sold very well.

You cant compare either card to any model of the GUS family. The sample sets are not the same and the sound is totally different. GM is GM and GUS is GUS. Kinda like comparing apples to oranges. You can compare any standard GM module/sound card/daughter board to another, but not against non GM native counterparts.

The GUS has the ability to load a GM sample set as well as something like a command interpreter or wrapper (I really don't know what its correctly called), and it can emulate a GM device. Its sounds pretty bad though, and should be avoided. The GUS can also be made to emulate FM synth, but it sounds like complete shit and its a truly desperate person to attempt this heinous crime against humanity.

The EMU8k chips are true MIDI engines, whereas the GUS chipsets were not. They simply don't function on the same level at all. The reason wave headers were standard on most SB16's, and many AWE32's (as well as the majority of clone cards of the time) was to offer a cheap set of options to users to try make their cards sell better. Users wanted sound card with wave headers to have the options of using real GM add ons without the cost of an external midi interface and midi module.

If I recall correctly, the SB32 was only a half-duplex card so could not utilize kernel-streaming. It's been a while so I could be mistaken.

kernel streaming ? what is that ? kernel 2.4 or 2.6 ? I heard that after that they remove support to oss and older soundcard like gus and awe32

logistics : if I remember correctly the sb32 and aew32 where full duplex card 😉 but I might be wrong

Djlc : the model number is ct2760 and ct3670, my guess is that you need no help to place those model number.

Sorry for making a short story long, my question really was that there must be some boundary about what a soundblaster model have to be to meet the "AWE32" appellation, or the "SB PRO" or "SB 16" or whatever, creative labs must have raised some standards. I wonder now what really are those standard difference, what difference a sbpnp32 to a sbawe32, is it the presence of some chipset that allow to respond to a specification ? Was the presence of an "Advanced Wave Effect" on the chip, but I was wrong ... why did I think that ...

RacoonRider wrote:

It really depends on what SB32 and AWE32 models are in question. […]
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It really depends on what SB32 and AWE32 models are in question.

The only way you can distinguish SB32 from AWE32 is absence of Wavetable header and onboard RAM.

Other stuff depends on the model of SB32 PnP.

CT3930 - Vibra16 chip - CT2501
CT3600 - CT2502
CT3620 - Classic AWE32 chips - CT1741/CT1745
CT3670 - AWE64 chips - CT8903/CT1745T

There was also an AWE32 Value Edition that also didn't have a Wave Blaster connector - refer the attached FAQ, dated 26/10/1995 (Section A, points 21 & 22).

What is interesting from this FAQ is that, apart from the Vibra16 chipset on some SB32 models, you were actually better off with a SB32, due to the fact it had the memory upgrade simm sockets, compared to the AWE32 Value Edition that only had the 512 KB RAM on board but, no memory upgrade simm sockets.
Also, earlier SB32 models were not Plug 'n Play (for e.g. CT3930, which I have, is not a Plug 'n Play sound card as it doesn't require CTCM or CTCU in DOS mode). Regardless, they work fine under Windows.

I think that when they got to the AWE64, the only difference I can think of was the fact that the AWE64 came bundled with the WavEffects & WaveGuide synthesis, whereas the SB32 (that utilised the AWE64 chipset) didn't have that software. Other than that, I can't think of any difference between an AWE64 based card and a SB32 card (that utilised the same chipset as the AWE64). The reason I say this is that the AWE64 also did not have a Wave Blaster connector and an ASP (DSP) socket.

What is also interesting to note is that the CT3670, despite utilising the AWE64 chipset, probably predated to when the AWE64 was released, since this model still had the simm memory upgrade sockets. Creative did away with those with the release of the AWE64 in November 1996. I don't think that any SB32 models were produced after 1996, since these were kind of superseded with the AWE64 Value cards, with the AWE64 Gold becoming the new top of the range card.

You are certainly right, Jesolo.

The CT3670 is kind of a dark horse of the AWE family. Not long ago I came across my third one - I was not even looking for them - and this is the only Sound Blaster card I have 2 duplicates of. I can look for datestamps if you're interested, but they should be before 1996, since the card effectively ruins the point of having an AWE64 Value. As I mentionned in another thread, I would pick CT3670 over any AWE 64 anytime, SIMM slots are more important to me than bundled software and golden plated fetish 😀 The real downside of CT3670 and AWE64 cards is CQM though...

Ok, I start to understant that there is no real difference (unless marketing) from the sbpnp32 and sbawe32. I've grown with the belief that the AWE had some kind of fx chip similar to the sblive, but now I learn that it is wrong.

where can i look to find the specific info re: the fm synthesizer in the VIBRA16 vs AWE32 vs AWE64 ?
i mean technical specifications.. like from the boxes of the SB32PNP(AWE32) or SBPRELUDE (VIBRA16)

it doesnt use a yamaha chip? or it does? its emulated? or real?...
someone needs to make a post about this somewhere to put all these questions to rest for good!

wait i just found this page: http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.ca/2015/02/di … -recording.html
is this the info i was looking for?

yes but what IS the FM on the AWE32?
what is the FM on the SB16 (CT2960) ?
its Creative Emulation of OPL3? not real OPL3?
is it identical to REAL OPL3?
what the hell is it???

CQM It is an OPL3-like implementation that doesn't sound like Yamaha's OPL3. Some tracks sound fine with it, while others don't fare nearly as well.
If your Creative card doesn't have a Yamaha chip or the CT-1747 chip (which contains a true OPL3 core), then it uses CQM, and not OPL3.

alexanrs wrote:

CQM It is an OPL3-like implementation that doesn't sound like Yamaha's OPL3. Some tracks sound fine with it, while others don't fare nearly as well.
If your Creative card doesn't have a Yamaha chip or the CT-1747 chip (which contains a true OPL3 core), then it uses CQM, and not OPL3.

in the post above by "great heirophant" on his blog he said that the awe32 has ymf262 inside another chip?
ok i see what you are saying.. so i actually have to see the letters + numbers CT-1747 somewhere on the card otherwise its emulated

my cards are sb32/CT3600 + sb16/CT2960

the sb32 has a chip that says CT1978-BAP

Here's another link that will help you:
http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.ca/2012/07/so … ibulations.html

The CT1978 chip on your CT3600 integrates a CQM synthesis OPL clone, as does the CT2505 chip on the CT2960. On the plus side, the CT2960 is likely not susceptible to the hanging note bug.

gdjacobs wrote:

Here's another link that will help you:
http://nerdlypleasures.blogspot.ca/2012/07/so … ibulations.html

The CT1978 chip on your CT3600 integrates a CQM synthesis OPL clone, as does the CT2505 chip on the CT2960. On the plus side, the CT2960 is likely not susceptible to the hanging note bug.

im not looking to play wing commander so thats not really a concern of mine......
i want YAMAHA FM.. 🙁

Best to see how it sounds to you.