I am not an expert here, but it seems that there is a false assumption here that it's anyhow related to CF card itself, while it's rather a matter of interface that is used to connect it to the rest of the system.

If you use typical USB CF card reader, or even the reader integrated on some expansion card, it will always be recognised as removable media.

The only way to get it recognised as fixed disk is connecting CF card via some SATA to CF / SATA to IDE adapter.

I might be wrong, though.

RatCatcher wrote:

Don't know if this was discussed before. But what is a good 40GB CF card that is cheap and is Fixed Disk without Windows or Linux detecting it as removable media? Non fixed are next to impossible to get in Fixed Disk I read somewhere.

Sorry, I don't know of a specific card and I don't know if was discussed, either. Which OS do you want to run on them ?
The removable media bit (rmb) is only used by flavors of Windows NT and some kind of Linux, I think.
Other OSes like DOS, OS/2 or Windows 9x shouldn't care about it.
Yes, I think there was an utility made by Sandisk to change the media bit, but I don't know if it still works with recent CF cards.
I heard you have now to tell the manufacturer whether you want them fixed or not when you make an order.
But I think thats only for major customers who order them in higher quantities.
Maybe some of those industrial types are set to fixed.
They're meant for embedded stuff, can handle a higher temperature range and often contain SLC memory instead of MLC.
At least that's how it used to be. Maybe that's different now.
If you can't get one, try a DOM (Disc-on-Memory module) instead. DOMs are always set to fixed-disk, if I'm not mistaken.
If they're too small in storage, you can try to get hold on a PATA SSD, they should be available in that size.
They're meant as HDD replacements, so they're likely set to fixed. KingSpec offered some of them in 16/32GB size, I think..
Another idea would be an special SD card adapter which emulates a fixed fixed-disk (SD cards don't have IDE support built-in).
Oh, and another important thing: DMA or UDMA support. Make sure the card supports it and the adapter has all necessary data lines. And beware of short circuits on the adapter.

tikoellner wrote:

I am not an expert here, but it seems that there is a false assumption here that it's anyhow related to CF card itself, while it […]
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I am not an expert here, but it seems that there is a false assumption here that it's anyhow related to CF card itself, while it's rather a matter of interface that is used to connect it to the rest of the system.

If you use typical USB CF card reader, or even the reader integrated on some expansion card, it will always be recognised as removable media.

The only way to get it recognised as fixed disk is connecting CF card via some SATA to CF / SATA to IDE adapter.

I might be wrong, though.

You're right. Both is true. It really depends how you look at it. A CF card has three modes, memory mode, I/O mode and True IDE Mode.
If you're using it in IDE mode on a mechanical adapter, the media bit is relevant.
USB adapters are often using the other modes, so its up to them whether the card appears as fixed or non-fixed.

CompactFlash Card Pinout

Howto Flip Removable Media Bit (RMB)

Windows WILL NOT install on removable media the MBR needs to be in a fixed disk drive. I gave up awhile ago with Kingston ultimate 266x 32GB cards. Tried scandisk ATCHWFG. That didn't work. Got an Addonics IDE CF adapter pro which has a bridge chip to force a CF as bootable and still impossible. By the way Addonics has excellent adapters. Kingston is pure junk. So I gave up so and used regular hard drives. I'm now thinking about 32GB Transend UDMA6 or 7? Would like to go for 266x. I don't know which ones flip to fixed when connected as IDE. At all cost stay away from Kingston unless you want to waste hours for nothing.

What windows are you trying to install? Here is my conclusions :
Windows 9x is totally hoodwinked and work allright. I would recommend you disable the swap file if you can put enough ram.
Windows 2000 in the install say that it dont support install on removable media. But if you install it on a hdd and then clone to a CF, it will only see the first partition of each removable cards.
Windows XP I didnt bother to partition it as it only hold a 32gb CF, the pagefile will always reset upon each reboot, what I did on a tc1100 is install 2gb and disable pagefile on XP.
Vista and up? Better to go with SSD.

Some SSD have ide interface and are not specially pricey or uncommon for 64 or 128gb capacity. Also, if you have any success, dont forget that CF need to be aligned just like SSD. Good Luck!

CFs won't boot connected to IDE if they're not set as a fixed drive.
Many cards refuse to cooperate with the infamous Sandisk utility. I had better luck with them using Lexar Bootit (run it as admin) to flip the bit. In almost all cases it did the trick.

btw guys, there's always the option of getting a DOM instead of fighting CF cards.

Is it because I'm using no-name CF cards from eBay that I never had to worry about this "fixed disk" stuff?

PhilsComputerLab wrote:

Is it because I'm using no-name CF cards from eBay that I never had to worry about this "fixed disk" stuff?

Maybe, or the adapter could be masking the bit.

gdjacobs wrote:

PhilsComputerLab wrote:

Is it because I'm using no-name CF cards from eBay that I never had to worry about this "fixed disk" stuff?

Maybe, or the adapter could be masking the bit.

No idea, my adapters are also the cheapest from eBay, various models.

But I never installed anything beyond Windows 98 SE.

Phil, which CF adaptors and CF cards did you buy?
I've been contemplating trying out the CF card route, and have both an old 32 MB and 512 MB CF card, bit not sure which adaptor to get.

I saw ones on eBay where the IDE connector is the female connector (meaning you have to plug it directly onto the IDE card or motherboard) and then there were some that had a male connector (where you can just attach an IDE cable to).

When you connect a CF card to an IDE channel, can you set it up as a master and then run a secondary device (like a CD-ROM drive) as a slave on the same channel?

The CF adapter I use is the one that goes into the slot bracket. It lets you remove and insert the CF card from the back of the PC.

I also have the StarTech CF drive bay adapter. That one cost a lot more, but it's the only kind that I know of.

The adapter does have a master / slave jumper but I can't remember if it worked with an optical drive. I think it did, but those little details are so easily forgotten 😊

Yeah right, I remember now that I often have to swap adapter from computers to another. Seem that one adapter dont work in a computer but do on another, you swap them and then both computer work... Kind of luxury to have 4 cf on 3 computers, otherwise I'm afraid it's kind of a matter of luck as specs on those 2bucks adapter are kind of scarce.

Bootit flipped it! Thanks. If it works on a Kingston ultimate it should work on alot of CF or SD cards. I also have a sata multi card reader. I'll have to install it and see how a micro SD card preforms.

I don't think I've ever run into a CF card under DOS/9x/2K that insisted it was a removable media. I did find however that in some applications that regardless of the card brand the performance was unbearably slow compared to even a regular hard drive.

RatCatcher wrote:

Bootit flipped it! Thanks. If it works on a Kingston ultimate it should work on alot of CF or SD cards. I also have a sata multi card reader. I'll have to install it and see how a micro SD card preforms.

Yep, I wasn't lying 😀 Good news, more and more success stories are getting added to my personal experience. It looks like it's the best tool currently for the job.

Very interesting ... Do you have more info about how you did it ? Bootit seem to be a boot manager, does there is a separate tool ? Does it install a layer to deceive the os ? I would be interested to try and flip my CF cards but I dont want to install a boot manager or break anything that is already working.

[edit]
Or are you talking about the bootit v1.07 the Lexar based freeware utility to flip the Removable Media Bit setting of a USB drive?
[/edit]

I think there is some confusion here. It used to be that old CF cards did not always have an MBR, they just had a boot sector. some did, some didnt. Best thing to do is just add an mbr. (fdisk in linux will do it just fine). same with usb sticks.

you can try the good old "HP USB Disk Storage Format Tool"

You mean running fdisk /mbr in DOS?

I had to do this with all of factory new SD and CF cards. Also one hard drive.

PhilsComputerLab wrote:

You mean running fdisk /mbr in DOS?

I had to do this with all of factory new SD and CF cards. Also one hard drive.

yeah but you cant do 'fdisk /mbr" against a CF card, that was the whole point you had to use a utility to actually create it on CF cards, USB sticks etc.

in linux you can do the equivalent tho, fdisk /dev/sda and put a mbr or gpt on it.

ElBrunzy wrote:

[edit]
Or are you talking about the bootit v1.07 the Lexar based freeware utility to flip the Removable Media Bit setting of a USB drive?
[/edit]

konc wrote:

...I had better luck with them using Lexar Bootit...

Yes!