VOGONS


First post, by s0ren

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Setup
HP T5720
CPU: AMD Geode NX1500 1GHz
RAM: DDR PC2700 512MB 333MHz
HDD: 32GB Transcend Industrial grade CF card
OS: Windows 98SE

Cards tested (all passively cooled)
HP nVidia Quadro NVS 280 275MHz
64 MB DDR 350MHz 128bit
DMS-59 for either DVI or VGA out

XFX nVidia GeForce MX4000 250MHz
64 MB DDR 350MHz 64bit
VGA and SVHS out

C.P Technologies ATI Radeon 9200SE 200MHz
128 MB DDR 266MHz 64bit
DVI, VGA and SVHS out

C.P Technologies ATI Radeon 9200 240MHz
256 MB DDR ?MHz 128bit
DVI, VGA and SVHS out

3D Mark 99 scores
NVS280: 6016
MX4000: 4991
9200SE: 4795
9200: 5103
The CPU scores were largely identical with each card.

NVS280 (uses the same core as a GeForce FX 5200)
Pros: Delivers great performance. Allows for smooth full HD game play in games like Unreal Tournament (DX mode only) and Shogo (albeit shogo needs patching before it will work).
Cons: Does not work with some VESA games that require line frame buffer (i.e. build engine games). Ken Silvermans "NOLFB"-patch fixes this issue for Duke Nukem 3D, but not for Death rally. Does not work with FIFA 98, FIFA99, FIFA2000, and Ignition - it either shows a black screen or crashes. GTA1 graphics are flickering and flashing to a point where its unpleasant to play. Tested with the newest and oldest compatible drivers but it made no difference. The card also becomes quite hot. VGA signal quality is a bit noisy to my surprise.

MX4000 (core derived from GeForce 2 / GeForce 4 MX440)
Pros: Cheap
Cons: Sort of slow. Absolutely useless in UT99 at higher resolutions than 720p. Has the same game incompatibility issues as the NVS280, except with VESA line frame buffer (runs build games perfectly).

9200SE (core derived from Radeon 8500)
Pros: Works with all the games I have thrown at it. Cool even after prolonged use.
Cons: Its about as slow as the MX4000, but a little better at higher resolutions, although it still feels a bit like a slide show so it hardly matters. Has a minor issue with EGA games where it has some latency if the game changes the palette (i.e. from magenta/cyan to red/green).

9200 (similar to 9200SE)
Pros: Works with all the games I have thrown at it. Cool even after prolonged use.
Cons: Despite the fact that the 3D mark score is similar to the 9200SE, its a lot better at high resolutions. UT99 is playable in full-HD + full details with 30-50FPS Has a minor issue with EGA games where it has some latency if the game changes the palette (i.e. from magenta/cyan to red/green).

Verdict
The 9200SE and NVS280 were the best cards. The MX4000 was not really good at anything compared to the two others. The choice here seems to be between 1080p performance and compatibility. Or perhaps finding a Radeon 9200 (non-SE) or 9250 with 128 bit memory bus.

***EDIT***
The Radeon 9200 with 128bit memory bus was hands-down the best overall. Good performance and superb compatibility.

Last edited by s0ren on 2016-10-30, 23:28. Edited 4 times in total.

Reply 2 of 9, by Trank

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It seems your NVS280 gets better score the better the CPU you put it. I got a score of 3667 with a 800mhz P3. Compared to a 7000ish to a Geforce4 Ti 4400. I found the 3d performance bad in some games with a slower P3. But the image quality was so good. Also great for DOS surprisingly.

Last edited by Trank on 2016-10-01, 23:38. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 4 of 9, by s0ren

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synrgy87 wrote:

Cards I'd recommend checking out, Radeon 9000, 9500. 9550, 9700pro 9800 pro 9600pro 9600xt 9800xt, kyro II 4500.

Most of those are not PCI? But yeah, i would like to get my hands on some 9250 128bit PCI cards. My issue is that i tested these cards for 5 computers im building that i would like to keep somewhat identical, and its hard to find 5 of the same card.

Trank wrote:

It seems your NVS280 gets better score the better the CPU you put it. I got a score of 3667 with a 800mhz P3. Compared to a 7000ish to a Geforce4 Ti 4400. I found the 3d performance bad in some games with a slower P3. But the image quality was so good. Also great for DOS surprisingly.

That could explain why the 3D Mark CPU score was a tiny tiny bit lower with the NVS card. Since it doesnt support VESA line frame buffer, im not sure how DOS friendly i would rate it =/ Or do you mean the odd DOS screen resolutions and such?

Reply 6 of 9, by synrgy87

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s0ren wrote:
synrgy87 wrote:

Cards I'd recommend checking out, Radeon 9000, 9500. 9550, 9700pro 9800 pro 9600pro 9600xt 9800xt, kyro II 4500.

Most of those are not PCI? But yeah, i would like to get my hands on some 9250 128bit PCI cards. My issue is that i tested these cards for 5 computers im building that i would like to keep somewhat identical, and its hard to find 5 of the same card.

Haha oh yeah I was very tired last night didn't read the PCI bit, anyway the Radeon 9000 come in PCI form, huge card though. not sure if the there were any Kyro II PCI cards but I know there were Kyro 1 based PCI cards. but they wouldn't be on par with what's already in this thread.

I remember trying a nvidia FX5200 back in the day and it wasn't great at all, the R9000 was a lot better.

There were also ATI Radeon X series cards in PCI form like the X700

Reply 7 of 9, by s0ren

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Original post edited

I just tried a 9200 (not SE) with 128 bit bus, 256MB (not that i think thats necessary) and higher core clock. It is without a doubt my favourite fanless PCI Windows 98 graphics card now! 😜

Reply 8 of 9, by clueless1

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Cool, thanks for posting! I recently did something similar, though with a P4 2.53Ghz and AGP cards, but most of the cards I tested are of the same era as yours. I even tested two of the same model (FX5200 and MX4000). Here are my scores:

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The more I learn, the more I realize how much I don't know.
OPL3 FM vs. Roland MT-32 vs. General MIDI DOS Game Comparison
Let's benchmark our systems with cache disabled
DOS PCI Graphics Card Benchmarks

Reply 9 of 9, by Ozzuneoj

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To the OP, thanks for testing these! I've wondered about some of these same cards myself. I have a 64MB Radeon 9100 PCI with 128bit memory, and it is a really decent card. It is actually identical to an 8500LE (except those were only AGP), which makes it significantly faster than the 9200 and 9200SE. Twice the Vertex Shaders and TMUs, and plenty of memory bandwidth. I'm sure its limited by the PCI bus for later games, but otherwise I'd wager that it's a formidable PCI card for systems with AGP limitations. The only PCI card I have that would trade blows with it would be a Geforce 6200 PCI 256MB (not LE, so 128bit as well I think).

Would it be possible to test the 9200, NVS280 and MX4000 with some titles from the DOS gaming benchmark suite?
http://www.philscomputerlab.com/dos-benchmark-pack.html

It'd be really nice to know how the newer cards compare to each other in that regard as well.

Now for some blitting from the back buffer.