VOGONS


Umbherc.sys requirements ?

Topic actions

Reply 20 of 30, by idspispopd

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie
Jo22 wrote:
BitWrangler wrote:

I can't see how you either disabled all RAM above 640k or only installed 640k in the 586 so there was no conflict with existing memory.

That's a good point. All I did was to not enable shadow memory.. The remaining memory was treated as extended memory which begins beyond 1MiB.

Memory between 640k and 1MB is usually not enabled by default, except for ROM shadowing. This is especially true for A000-BFFF which is reserved for video cards.

Since that question came up, just in case this is not common knowledge: A000-AFFF: EGA/VGA graphics modes. B000-B7FF: MDA/Hercules half mode (MDA only has 4kB so in that case only B000-B0FF). B800-BFFF: CGA (graphics and text modes - a true CGA card has 16 kB so actually B800-BBFF), EGA/VGA text modes, second Hercules page in full mode.

BTW, i doubt that a character ROM will make any difference. The character is not accessible by the CPU (not mapped on the ISA bus), it is only used by the video controller.

Perhaps you could try accessing the Hercules memory yourself? (Write, read again and compare.) debug.com should to the trick, but the CLI interface takes a moment to get used to.
I remember I had a memory monitor as a tiny TSR program (typed-in from a computer magazine). For some reason it wasn't compatible with the XT we used (machine hung when TSR got activated), but it worked on lates machines (286+). I can't find a trace on the web, though, and I don't know if I still have it somewhere.

Reply 21 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++
idspispopd wrote:
Perhaps you could try accessing the Hercules memory yourself? (Write, read again and compare.) debug.com should to the trick, b […]
Show full quote

Perhaps you could try accessing the Hercules memory yourself? (Write, read again and compare.) debug.com
should to the trick, but the CLI interface takes a moment to get used to.
I remember I had a memory monitor as a tiny TSR program (typed-in from a computer magazine).
For some reason it wasn't compatible with the XT we used (machine hung when TSR got activated), but it worked on lates machines (286+). I can't find a trace on the web, though, and I don't know if I still have it somewhere.

Thanks for the suggestion! 😀
I'm not vey familiar with debug, though, so I decided to actually use the HGC with an MDA monitor..

I'll do some testing this night and report back soon..

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 22 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Okay, so let's start! 😄

I've set-up my M35 along with a namless on-board CGA,
Winbond W68855AF Hercules compatible card and a Tandon TC0420.

Attachments

  • herc_cga_combo.jpg
    Filename
    herc_cga_combo.jpg
    File size
    46.06 KiB
    Views
    736 views
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 23 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

When I entered MODE MONO, the DOS console switched from CGA card to Hercules
(a frozen image was still shown on CGA):

herc_cga_cli.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_cli.jpg
File size
10.42 KiB
Views
733 views
File comment
MS-DOS Command Line Interpreter (CLI) on Hercules monitor.
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception
herc_cga_nc.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_nc.jpg
File size
75.84 KiB
Views
733 views
File comment
Norton Commander v1.0x
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

Afterwards, I ran my copy of Sketch which has built-in Hercules support.
To no surprise, it will mess-up CGA memory space, though.

I guess this is related to the fact that Sketch uses a lot of layers..
The text as seen in the picture is caused by a burn-in damage (not my fault):

herc_cga_skd1.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_skd1.jpg
File size
34.26 KiB
Views
733 views
File comment
Sketch on HGC (Full-Mode ?)
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception
herc_cga_skd2.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_skd2.jpg
File size
58.15 KiB
Views
733 views
File comment
Sketch on HGC (Full-Mode ?)
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 24 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Next test, MSD. Microsoft Diagnostics detects the Hercules as a primary video device.

Attachments

  • herc_cga_msd.jpg
    Filename
    herc_cga_msd.jpg
    File size
    70.45 KiB
    Views
    733 views
    File comment
    Microsoft Diagnostics
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 25 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Checkit. When I ran CheckIt! first time, it detected no Hercules card, just an MDA.
It detected 4KiB of RAM.

Attachments

  • herc_cga_chkit1a.jpg
    Filename
    herc_cga_chkit1a.jpg
    File size
    78.98 KiB
    Views
    733 views
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception
  • herc_cga_chkit1b.jpg
    Filename
    herc_cga_chkit1b.jpg
    File size
    80.4 KiB
    Views
    733 views
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 26 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Luckily, I remembered that in order for using Hercules cards, a TSR, MSHERC, was required..
So I executed it accordingly to the documentation.

herc_cga_chkit2a.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit2a.jpg
File size
107.85 KiB
Views
733 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

When I ran CheckIt! second time, it detected the Hercules card.
It detected 64KiB of RAM.

herc_cga_chkit2b.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit2b.jpg
File size
83.14 KiB
Views
733 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception
herc_cga_chkit2c.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit2c.jpg
File size
84.42 KiB
Views
733 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

And gave an error message..

herc_cga_chkit2d.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit2d.jpg
File size
68.47 KiB
Views
733 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 27 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

.. which I shortly after found the reason for.

Apparently, MSHERC runs in full-mode by default.
Running it with the more or less undocumented /HALF parameter fixed it for me:

herc_cga_chkit3b.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit3b.jpg
File size
25.69 KiB
Views
728 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception
herc_cga_chkit3c.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit3c.jpg
File size
42 KiB
Views
728 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

So when I ran CheckIt! a third time, it detected the Hercules card as intended.
It detected 32KiB of RAM.

herc_cga_chkit3a.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit3a.jpg
File size
84.29 KiB
Views
728 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

The memory map looks like this:

herc_cga_chkit3d.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit3d.jpg
File size
83.48 KiB
Views
728 views
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 28 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Here are two more pictures of the memory map.

First, the memory map as shown in Hercules mode..

herc_cga_chkit4a.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit4a.jpg
File size
222.68 KiB
Views
727 views
File comment
CheckIt!, MODE MONO
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

..and second, in CGA mode:

herc_cga_chkit4b.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_chkit4b.jpg
File size
198.32 KiB
Views
727 views
File comment
CheckIt!, MODE CO80
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 29 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Okay, so I also tried umb.sys again.
No luck. 🙁

herc_cga_umbsys1a.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_umbsys1a.jpg
File size
40.93 KiB
Views
725 views
File comment
Norton Commander displays config.sys
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception
herc_cga_umbsys1b.jpg
Filename
herc_cga_umbsys1b.jpg
File size
53.81 KiB
Views
725 views
File comment
umb.sys driver
File license
Fair use/fair dealing exception

Edit: I noticed a mistake of mine and fixed it (one "0" too much).
Unfortunately, it had no effect.

Edit: The same issue persists with all three cards I used last time.

Edit: I did a recording of the boot-up sequence and noticed an error message "Command line error !".
Probably caused by UMB.SYS: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yNg1paKXAIw
Does anybody know how to exactly use UMB.SYS ? 😕

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 30 of 30, by Jo22

User metadata
Rank l33t++
Rank
l33t++

Things are getting weird.. Seriously. 😒

I gave IBM PC-DOS 6.1 a try, since it was mentioned along with umbherc.sys
at http://www.robvanderwoude.com/dosmem.php .

For some strange reson, the Winbond card was not detected as a Hercules card.
In a second test with MS-DOS 6.2 it was the same case, though, so it likely isn't related to PC-DOS.

Still, PC-DOS 6.1 didn't "fix" anything either when it comes to its own companion driver, umbherc.sys.

The other two cards, Epson Q205A and TD8088A were detected as beeing Hercules compatible, at least.
After waiting for 30 minutes anything to happen, I gave up.

My config.sys looks like this:

DEVICE=UMBHERC.SYS
DOS=UMB

No autoexec.bat.

Attachments

  • herc_cga_pcdos_umbherc_td8088a.jpg
    Filename
    herc_cga_pcdos_umbherc_td8088a.jpg
    File size
    45.11 KiB
    Views
    698 views
    File comment
    TD8088A, umbherc.sys on PC-DOS 6.1
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception
  • herc_cga_pcdos_umbherc.jpg
    Filename
    herc_cga_pcdos_umbherc.jpg
    File size
    20.61 KiB
    Views
    698 views
    File comment
    Winbond W86855AF, umbherc.sys on PC-DOS 6.1
    File license
    Fair use/fair dealing exception

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//