Tandy was 99,9% compatible. No EGA, only CGA. And PC-speaker sound were available.

If it doesn't support TGA and tandy sound, why bother with it anyway?

Anonymous Coward wrote:

If it doesn't support TGA and tandy sound, why bother with it anyway?

If I understand Cyberdyne correctly then Tandy owners would be stuck with purple/cyan if they wanted to play such a game -- unlike a PC with an EGA card, Apple II or Commodore 64 owner.

imo the whole point of having a Tandy 1000 is to have the Tandy graphics + sound.

software ht to explicitly support tandy sound, tandy tga etc. games that only used pc speaker would just use it, no tandy sound used at all.

Just as an example, unlike its sequel, Might and Magic: Book One only supports EGA and CGA graphics. So if I understand Cyberdyne correctly then Tandy owners would be stuck with purple/cyan if they wanted to play this game

well yeah, lot of things WONT support it, but if you wanted to run software that is not Tandy compatible, dont buy a Tandy 1000...

most games would detect no ega, and just use cga if they supported it.

Is there a resource out there that has a list of Tandy enhanced games?

BloodyCactus wrote:

well yeah, lot of things WONT support it, but if you wanted to run software that is not Tandy compatible, dont buy a Tandy 1000...

The questions were to understand what 'not Tandy compatible" really meant and how a Tandy would function with such games. It was -- "as a Tandy owner in that time period were you going to always at least get the same graphics/sound as a PC owner while getting better graphics/sound when the game supported it?"

As I understand everyone the answer is:

Sound: Yes. You're either going to get better 3-voice sound (and maybe sound effects too?) when the game supported Tandy or you're going to get the same PC Speaker sound that everyone else would have if the game did not.

Graphics: No. If the game supported EGA but not explicitly Tandy then you would be stuck with 4 colors.

fsmith2003 wrote:

Is there a resource out there that has a list of Tandy enhanced games?

It seems like a lot of games supported at least Tandy graphics. I'd be more interested in a list of games that supported only CGA/EGA but not Tandy.

tandy is a subset of cga, so everything that supported cga supported tandy, just not necessarily the tandy extensions.

I found this old guide.... interesting. http://www.oldskool.org/guides/tvdog/1kfaq.html#II.B.1

II.B. Video
II.B.1. Can I install VGA on my system?
On the original 1000, 1000A, and 1000HD, no. On those systems, the BIOS will not scan for a video ROM or disable the onboard video. Matthew Electronics once manufactured a special EGA card for the original 1000, A, and HD, but it is no longer available. That said, it is generally possible to get a standard EGA card to work to some degree if you make a program for AUTOEXEC.BAT to enable it; see file (ftp://ftp.oldskool.org/pub/tvdog/tandy1000/do … ents/egat1k.txt)

One other problem you are likely to have is that an EGA card will want to use IRQ 2 for vertical retrace, which conflicts with t […]
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One other problem you are likely to have is that an EGA card will want to use IRQ 2 for vertical retrace, which conflicts with the hard drive; you need to have a hard drive controller that does not use an IRQ (or do without a hard drive). Upgrading the video on the original 1000, A, or HD is definitely a "hacker upgrade."

The EX and HX can have VGA but will need a special card because of their nonstandard expansion slots. The SX and TX need to have DIP switch 1 turned off. The SL's, TL's and RL's won't require any hardware changes; just plug in the card.

The RLX's and RSX's came standard with VGA. Both can accept upgrade video cards as well.

All 1000's that don't come standard with VGA will require that a special program be placed in AUTOEXEC.BAT to make sure the new video is recognized

So there was a special EGA card you could buy for the original Tandy 1000s which would've made it capable of 16-color on IBM-PC games that did not have TGA support. The later models like SX, TX and on having VGA support.

infiniteclouds wrote:

I found this old guide.... interesting. http://www.oldskool.org/guides/tvdog/1kfaq.html#II.B.1 […]
Show full quote

I found this old guide.... interesting. http://www.oldskool.org/guides/tvdog/1kfaq.html#II.B.1

II.B. Video
II.B.1. Can I install VGA on my system?
On the original 1000, 1000A, and 1000HD, no. On those systems, the BIOS will not scan for a video ROM or disable the onboard video. Matthew Electronics once manufactured a special EGA card for the original 1000, A, and HD, but it is no longer available. That said, it is generally possible to get a standard EGA card to work to some degree if you make a program for AUTOEXEC.BAT to enable it; see file (ftp://ftp.oldskool.org/pub/tvdog/tandy1000/do … ents/egat1k.txt)

One other problem you are likely to have is that an EGA card will want to use IRQ 2 for vertical retrace, which conflicts with t […]
Show full quote

One other problem you are likely to have is that an EGA card will want to use IRQ 2 for vertical retrace, which conflicts with the hard drive; you need to have a hard drive controller that does not use an IRQ (or do without a hard drive). Upgrading the video on the original 1000, A, or HD is definitely a "hacker upgrade."

The EX and HX can have VGA but will need a special card because of their nonstandard expansion slots. The SX and TX need to have DIP switch 1 turned off. The SL's, TL's and RL's won't require any hardware changes; just plug in the card.

The RLX's and RSX's came standard with VGA. Both can accept upgrade video cards as well.

All 1000's that don't come standard with VGA will require that a special program be placed in AUTOEXEC.BAT to make sure the new video is recognized

So there was a special EGA card you could buy for the original Tandy 1000s which would've made it capable of 16-color on IBM-PC games that did not have TGA support. The later models like SX, TX and on having VGA support.

Now that's very interesting, I never heard of such a beast.

To answer your original question: was the Tandy the absolute best system for gaming? Probably not, but it was the most affordable IBM compatible system for gaming at around $1200 for the 1000sx with color monitor compared to say $3000-$4000 for an equivalent IBM XT based system. PC Jr was an inferior system for a number of reasons but cost I think about the same as the Tandy. If you wanted the absolute cheapest gaming system that was also a computer you were probably looking at the C64 which I think at the time was around $200?

When the games supported the Tandy mode, it was great. When they didn't, you got that crap 4 color CGA (yes I know some people like it, I'm not one of them 🤣). 3 voice sound, while not as good as Soundblaster or Adlib, was much better than beeps and boops of PC speaker. So yeah I would say for the 80-90% of the time that the game was compatible with the TGA graphics mode, you were set. When it wasn't, well at least you had better sound 🤣.

**note to PC Jr. fans: I'm not saying it was horrible, however the sidecar expansion, the chicklet infrared keyboard and the initial low memory it was definitely not as good as the 1000 or 1000sx. The Tandy was arguably what the PC Jr. should have been in the first place. A properly expanded PC Jr. is not a bad system though and the cartridge slots are definitely an interesting option not common on other PC compatibles.

snorg wrote:

When the games supported the Tandy mode, it was great. When they didn't, you got that crap 4 color CGA (yes I know some people like it, I'm not one of them 🤣). 3 voice sound, while not as good as Soundblaster or Adlib, was much better than beeps and boops of PC speaker. So yeah I would say for the 80-90% of the time that the game was compatible with the TGA graphics mode, you were set. When it wasn't, well at least you had better sound 🤣.
.

To me this seems like the best machine for XT/AT era gaming PC you could have but I really don't know much about that era -- or what made IBM PCs better.

A Tandy 1000SL or TL is best XT-era gaming device IMO. Much more common on Ebay, and ability to use standard XT keyboards vs. proprietary 1000 keyboard outweighs basically all the other considerations...

infiniteclouds wrote:

Sound: Yes. You're either going to get better 3-voice sound (and maybe sound effects too?) when the game supported Tandy or you're going to get the same PC Speaker sound that everyone else would have if the game did not.

Was it even possible to drive both the Tandy 3-voice synthesizer and the PC speaker at the same time? If so, wouldn't that mean that Tandy systems effectively supported 4-voice sound? And were there any games with Tandy sound support that used the PC speaker as a 4th voice? Or did Tandy computers simply use one of the 3 voices on the synthesizer to emulate the PC speaker?

Yes Tandy sound and PC speaker could run at the same time

Also Tandy sound did have a 4th noise channel.

I always wished the Dac would have been used more and that other sound cards would have had emulators for the 3 voice plus dac made.

Also frustrating my 1000rlx plays beeper sounds most of the time because the games usually only use 3 voice with Tandy graphics.

My copy of duck tales is that way

rmay635703 wrote:

Yes Tandy sound and PC speaker could run at the same time […]
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Yes Tandy sound and PC speaker could run at the same time

Also Tandy sound did have a 4th noise channel.

I always wished the Dac would have been used more and that other sound cards would have had emulators for the 3 voice plus dac made.

Also frustrating my 1000rlx plays beeper sounds most of the time because the games usually only use 3 voice with Tandy graphics.

My copy of duck tales is that way

Yeah, the 8-Bit Guy published an interesting video about the Tandy 1000 a few weeks ago. In it, he also discussed the audio capabilities, including not just the 3 voices, but also that 4th noise channel you also mentioned, plus the single channel PC speaker compatibility, that coexisted alongside those other voices, and the DAC that was introduced in later models.

Do any of you know of any (pre-DAC) games that utilized the audio capabilities of the PCJr and Tandy 1000 machines to their fullest ability, including the 3 voices, the 4th noise-only channel (for percussions and/or sound effects) and the PC speaker channel as a fourth musical voice? That must have allowed for some surprisingly rich music for the time. Perhaps the demo scene brought forth some nice stuf that made optimal use of this?

One of the racing games I had used the noise channel in the winning ending sequence with the racers shaking up bottles of wine.

rmay635703 wrote:

One of the racing games I had used the noise channel in the winning ending sequence with the racers shaking up bottles of wine.

Was that game "The Cycles: International Grand Prix Racing", by any chance? That game already did a pretty good job simulating multiple voices with a regular IBM compatible internal speaker, considering its limitations. I guess it must have made good use of the Tandy 1000 and PCjr sound capabilities as well.

Oh wait, the older racing game Grand Prix Circuit, also published by Accolade, had a champagne podium ending scene as well. Perhaps it was that game?

Oddly enough it was the cycles, still have the game in the basement