Intel486dx33 wrote:

Ironically, The iPad is Apples least expensive computer and I think it’s it’s best all-around computer.
I did not say it’s most powerful just better all-in-one, diverse, and mobile.

https://youtu.be/llZys3xg6sU

Can it run crysis?
all apps are handicaped down programs, you have a free (handicapped) ms office, etc...

.legaCy wrote:

Intel486dx33 wrote:

Ironically, The iPad is Apples least expensive computer and I think it’s it’s best all-around computer.
I did not say it’s most powerful just better all-in-one, diverse, and mobile.

https://youtu.be/llZys3xg6sU

Can it run crysis?
all apps are handicaped down programs, you have a free (handicapped) ms office, etc...

Hehe... It is only good for personal-life stuff. And if someones whole life is work only, then I guess.....

keenmaster486 wrote:

Does the perfect computer exist? […]
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Does the perfect computer exist?

Technology is always changing, i.e. getting more sophisticated and faster, and new standards are always being developed and implemented.

Some of this is actual innovation, and the rest of it is just companies trying to artificially render the old hardware obsolete so that everyone has to buy new. Also, this never results in a faster UI experience, as the software gets slower at about the same rate as Moore's Law. In fact, DOS 6.22 booted up faster in 1992 than Windows 10 boots up today on a typical machine, just as an example.

I think one of my goals is to break out of this neverending and expensive cycle and only ever use one computer for the rest of my life. Hahaha. What a pipe dream, right?

Everything degrades and breaks over time, eventually.

I have this idea of a sort of minimalist computer, probably a laptop. Its feature set is clearly defined and set in stone. There is no artificial planned obsolescence involved. A focus is placed on robustness, stability, simplicity of usage, and longevity. The software is developed to satisfy the predetermined feature set, ruthlessly beta tested, and then code-frozen except for bugfixes and security updates. The user interface is simple, and built with the highest respect for the end-user in mind. The hardware is sufficient for the tasks it is meant for, with no gimmicks that don't do anything useful, strange proprietary ports, or arrogant corporate illusions about being "innovative" when it's really just different for no real reason. It has a modular design, with each component discrete and easily replaceable (that is, to take care of external changes in technology such as new Wi-Fi standards). Also, the battery lasts 24 hours, and the whole thing costs $250.

At least, if I owned a computer company, this is what I would tell the engineering team to make. Wow. Maybe I'll also find a million dollars in my closet.

I also think hardware has gotten so cheap and so fast nowadays, but we are not taking as much advantage of it as we could because of software bloat. Suppose all I want my computer to do is word processing and web browsing, just like most consumers today who aren't gamers or developers. If you make the software efficient enough, you could do that using hardware similar to what was offered 10 years ago, at much less cost due to advances in manufacturing technology that have made everything cheaper.

There's also an issue with "development for its own sake", for example Gmail changing their look every couple of years without changing functionality, just so the developers have something to do.

My view is that something like a mail client, or an operating system (on the same hardware, that is) has a theoretical state somewhere out there in which it is "mature," i.e. fully functional without bugs, security holes, works great, does what it's supposed to do and does it well, etc. Few software ever gets to this point and STAYS THERE because once it gets there, the incentive to continue development is still there. This leads to change for its own sake without real improvement. A good example of this is Microsoft Office. It's had the same functionality, the core features that everyone uses and very few people step outside of, since Office '97 or so. But MS has an incentive to keep releasing new versions of the product whether or not it needs it, just to hang the shiny apple of something new to people and make them think the old version is somehow deficient in some way. Obviously sometimes it is. But honestly now I, as a normal semi-developer user, can use Office 2000 with no issues as my daily driver office suite because I simply am not among the 3% or whatever it is of people who need the new version.

Anyway, rant over... just some things that have been going through my head lately. Any thoughts?

I can understand many of these points. Much time ago after the end of the 32bit processors and the start of the 64bit ones I already felt how useless it was to upgrade for basically having a "equal if not slower" experience when the software became slower and heavier with no reasons at all. The last time I built a modern computer with modern medium-end components running a modern pc game of that time I ended up it wasn't already enough for it running at less than 20fps with low resolution on old monitors (back in the 2006). And after that soon I felt the same thing with the OS itself after XP became obsolete.
Looking back I think that the experience with both MSDOS and Windows 95/98 if/when running stable, was faster and better if we consider how slow the hardware was compare to nowdays, where it's absurd that imho web browsers seems to become one of the most advanced/heavier pc "benchmark" ever and I imagine some games being already written for n-different console architectures before, basically ending up not being optimized for none.
I'd think that consumer tech after early 2000's maybe became to change target, switching from a specific advanced-consumer one to a mass market of people that don't always had/have a previous technology background know-how and can't compare (and understand) how much (and why!) this technology differs to the older tech of the 80's and 90's. And not talking about only a technical not always and often not needed know-how but more a personal point of view and opinion of the whole consumer digital tech "evolution" history.

So nowdays I try to build and use only machines with older/oldest possible components for the most optimized os configs (lightest gui with most modern kernels on linux) and for usual modern office tasks I could still live with a late Pentium4 or with a Raspberry Pi. But one goal would be to use a really old config (like a 486DX-100) as modern machine, and maybe another future goal will be not using any computer/tech at all.

386SX wrote:

So nowdays I try to build and use only machines with older/oldest possible components for the most optimized os configs (lightest gui with most modern kernels on linux) and for usual modern office tasks I could still live with a late Pentium4 or with a Raspberry Pi. But one goal would be to use a really old config (like a 486DX-100) as modern machine, and maybe another future goal will be not using any computer/tech at all.

I hear ya' loud and clear.... My daily driver is an IBM/Lenovo Thinkpad R61 running Xubuntu.
I use it for everyday tasks, like photo's, forum's, online shopping, home banking, email and so on. The basic stuff.
It has the following configuration (check out the memory usage when only having FireFox open)

-Computer-
Processor : 2x Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7100 @ 1.80GHz
Memory : 4062MB (877MB used)
Operating System : Ubuntu 16.04.5 LTS

-Display-
Resolution : 1280x800 pixels
OpenGL Renderer : Mesa DRI Intel(R) 965GM x86/MMX/SSE2
X11 Vendor : The X.Org Foundation
-Multimedia-
Audio Adapter : HDA-Intel - HDA Intel
Audio Adapter : ThinkPad EC - ThinkPad Console Audio Control

I generated it with "system information". Yes. The machine IS fast enough for Youtube.

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not up-gradable or ability to modify.
All-in-One
Built-in keyboard, speakers, display, etc....
All-in-One

IPad

Screw Apple, get an etch-a-sketch!

brostenen wrote:

I hear ya' loud and clear.... My daily driver is an IBM/Lenovo Thinkpad R61 running Xubuntu. I use it for everyday tasks, like p […]
Show full quote

386SX wrote:

So nowdays I try to build and use only machines with older/oldest possible components for the most optimized os configs (lightest gui with most modern kernels on linux) and for usual modern office tasks I could still live with a late Pentium4 or with a Raspberry Pi. But one goal would be to use a really old config (like a 486DX-100) as modern machine, and maybe another future goal will be not using any computer/tech at all.

I hear ya' loud and clear.... My daily driver is an IBM/Lenovo Thinkpad R61 running Xubuntu.
I use it for everyday tasks, like photo's, forum's, online shopping, home banking, email and so on. The basic stuff.
It has the following configuration (check out the memory usage when only having FireFox open)

-Computer-
Processor : 2x Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Duo CPU T7100 @ 1.80GHz
Memory : 4062MB (877MB used)
Operating System : Ubuntu 16.04.5 LTS

-Display-
Resolution : 1280x800 pixels
OpenGL Renderer : Mesa DRI Intel(R) 965GM x86/MMX/SSE2
X11 Vendor : The X.Org Foundation
-Multimedia-
Audio Adapter : HDA-Intel - HDA Intel
Audio Adapter : ThinkPad EC - ThinkPad Console Audio Control

I generated it with "system information". Yes. The machine IS fast enough for Youtube.

I am lately trying a "similar" Core2 E8600 with lubuntu and it's fast enough for a modern machine even if I don't really like latest gui changes.

Perfection would be boring. Nothing to tinker with and nothing to upgrade. I don't think I would want one.

386SX wrote:

I am lately trying a "similar" Core2 E8600 with lubuntu and it's fast enough for a modern machine even if I don't really like latest gui changes.

Sweet... Yup. No need for the latest and greatest, when standard tasks are what one need a computer for. 😀

Baoran wrote:

Perfection would be boring. Nothing to tinker with and nothing to upgrade. I don't think I would want one.

Yup. A perfect computer is something that one can actually fix. And not like the modern ones were everything is soldered in.
Shure there are no such thing as the perfect computer, though some machines come close, like a modular machine.

Intel486dx33 wrote:

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not upgradable or abibility to modify. […]
Show full quote

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not upgradable or abibility to modify.
All-in-One
Built-in keyboard, speakers, display, etc....
All-in-One

IPad

You know... Even Woz dislike iPads and Iphones....
To him they are nothing but fancy toys that breaks down without any reason.
They are flimsy, they break down, they are tough to manage files on, and data are sometimes stored inside an app.
Now... Does that sound like a candidate for the perfect computer? Nope, it does not.
Android tablets and phones are way better, just not on all levels. Some the iPad or iPhone does better.
And those are not candidates for the perfect computer eighter.

Get something that will run some form of Windows, Linux or Unix.
And find one with real buttons with mechanical and tactile feedback.
Then you will find one that are close to the perfect computer.

brostenen wrote:

Intel486dx33 wrote:

Get something that will run some form of Windows, Linux or Unix.
And find one with real buttons with mechanical and tactile feedback.
Then you will find one that are close to the perfect computer.

Except they won't be as portable.

See, there's absolutely not even an objectively best concept. I don't think we'd even be able to choose a set of criteria that were consistent and not conflicted.

gdjacobs wrote:

See, there's absolutely not even an objectively best concept. I don't think we'd even be able to choose a set of criteria that were consistent and not conflicted.

Shure... That is perhaps the only advantage that an tablet like the iPad has.
Though I think that a chromebook is just as portable as an tablet. You know, thin and light.

Yes, Obviously the perfect computer is not on the market as of today.
But it sure looks like they are trying to build one.
A computer with a personal advisor to guide you into the future.

Intel486dx33 wrote:

Yes, Obviously the perfect computer is not on the market as of today.
But it sure looks like they are trying to build one.
A computer with a personal advisor to guide you into the future.

Wait isn’t iPad already released? Is this a trick or troll post?

The perfect computer for me will fix me sammiches, cook me dinner, and *ahem* replace my need for a woman.

Also, every 18 months it should double its own transistor count, overclock itself and increase it's own instructions per clock.

all i/o should be done directly with my brain, so I can just rock back and forth in my expensive chair, keeping my hands warm by stuffing them down my shorts, rather than being forced to learn forward and type on a keyboard.

The perfect computer will decide what I want to watch tonight based on a self learning neural net, so it would be shuffling through computer chronicles hardware episodes as we speak and placing it on my 270" TV (which is wall mounted above my 12 27" 8k bezel-less monitors.

Finally, the perfect computer can self replicate, and each iteration will go get a job and direct deposit their checks into my checking account.

------------

I made a funny but honestly, what is a perfect computer aside from a machine that does virtually everything I could ever imagine to make my life easier and more efficient. So while funny, it has truth, until the machine is capable of virtually everything and doing it silently and powering itself, there will always be something better coming up.

I just want a few extra cores for my own brain. Octa-core would be nice, although I'd settle for hexa or quad. And an updated hyperthreading algorithm because my current one sucks.

For everyday computing and retro computing and not so demanding games, i us a AMD APU A10 based computer. 65W TDP, everithing works and runs, i can play even all the Wolfenstein, Half-Life, Doom, and even Warcraft 2 natively. I just got fed up with videocards, but i like a desktop computer, so it is like a AMD cpu plus a Radeon on a single chip. I have used it like at least 4 years, and i am still happy.

Intel486dx33 wrote:

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not up-gradable or ability to modify. A […]
Show full quote

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not up-gradable or ability to modify.
All-in-One
Built-in keyboard, speakers, display, etc....
All-in-One

IPad

Well, I'm so speechless that I couldn't even laugh. (well, I lied, I did 🤣 🤣)

So, apparently, the perfect computer is still not out there, and will be in the market after "Everything that can be Invented has been Invented", eh?

Intel486dx33 wrote:

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not up-gradable or ability to modify. A […]
Show full quote

The perfect computer will have fixed components because it is perfect. Like on a tablet. Not up-gradable or ability to modify.
All-in-One
Built-in keyboard, speakers, display, etc....
All-in-One

IPad

You must be trolling or smoking some weird crap. The iPad isn't even a good tablet. It's doesn't have a built in keyboard. The speakers on them are crap. The display is good; that's about it.

Can you access the filesystem on them? No
Can you transfer files easily to and from an iPad to a PC? No
Can you add storage? No
Can you add memory? No
Can you use a mouse? No
Can you develop programs on it without a Mac? No
Can you install programs without jailbreaking the iPad or putting them on the App Store? No
Can you use other browsers without using Apple's shitty broken Webkit and javascript engines? No
Can you repair or replace iPad parts easily? No
And so much more.

The iPad is not a computer, it is a toy. Please stop trolling.

The perfect computer, for me would be the oldest you can live with. I don't understand why a tablet would be a "perfect" computer when you have no other choices to do beside buying it. But maybe the market is going into that direction building techs you will not ever customize. Not hardware side not software side. People can only (=must) just buy it.