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HWiNFO support of vintage hardware

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Reply 461 of 478, by Takedasun

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STB Nitro DVD 4MB AGP (Chromatic Mpact 2).

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Reply 463 of 478, by mbertheau

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I have a 486 DX4 100 that shows up as 50 MHz in HWINFO 6.12:

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During bootup the Bios screen indicates the correct 100 MHz.

Reply 464 of 478, by Mumak

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mbertheau wrote on 2021-01-10, 00:28:
I have a 486 DX4 100 that shows up as 50 MHz in HWINFO 6.12: […]
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I have a 486 DX4 100 that shows up as 50 MHz in HWINFO 6.12:

IMG_20210109_195501.jpg

IMG_20210109_195514.jpg

During bootup the Bios screen indicates the correct 100 MHz.

Can you please attach the HWiNFO Debug File? This can be created by running with the -d argument.

Reply 465 of 478, by mbertheau

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mbertheau wrote on 2021-01-10, 00:28:

I have a 486 DX4 100 that shows up as 50 MHz in HWINFO 6.12:

Ok, disregard that. I had the computer out of the case on the table and the turbo was off 😀 It's showing 100 MHz now with the turbo on. And Warcraft 2 runs nicely fast 😀

Reply 466 of 478, by Am386DX-40

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Mumak wrote on 2021-01-10, 07:53:

Can you please attach the HWiNFO Debug File? This can be created by running with the -d argument.

I have a PcChips M326 V5.2 motherboard with an Am386DX-40 soldered in, and I added an IIT 4C87DLC-40 FPU.

The motherboard is detected as M601/602 which is not correct (that one is a 486 board with 3 VLB slots), and the FPU is detected as Intel 80387DX running at 73.6 MHz. Weird. (NSSI detects it correctly)

image.png

Here's the debug:

HWiNFO v6.1.2 
Flushing disk caches ...

Reading Data ...

DetectCPU - 386
FPUtest=3
Check Cx
Get freq
FreqCPU: 1292-26

Cache 1K: 32.0 -> 32.0
Cache 2K: 62.5 -> 62.5 = 1.95x
Cache 4K: 123.5 -> 123.5 = 1.98x
Cache 8K: 245.5 -> 245.5 = 1.99x
Cache 16K: 489.3 -> 489.3 = 1.99x
Cache 32K: 977.0 -> 977.0 = 2.00x
Cache 64K: 1956.0 -> 1956.0 = 2.00x
Cache 128K: 3908.0 -> 3908.0 = 2.00x
Cache 256K: 20687.0 -> 20687.0 = 5.29x *L2*
Cache 512K: 41366.0 -> 41366.0 = 2.00x
Cache 640K: 51705.0 -> 51705.0 = 1.25x
Check CT
Check FPU: int
FreqFPU: 3632

DetectCPU - 386
FPUtest=3
Resetting CPU [Method 3]

Resetting CPU [Method 1]
CPU ID1=308

Check Cx
Get freq
FreqCPU: 1291-25

Cache 1K: 32.4 -> 32.4
Cache 2K: 62.5 -> 62.5 = 1.93x
Cache 4K: 123.5 -> 123.5 = 1.98x
Cache 8K: 245.4 -> 245.4 = 1.99x
Cache 16K: 489.1 -> 489.1 = 1.99x
Cache 32K: 977.0 -> 977.0 = 2.00x
Cache 64K: 1956.0 -> 1956.0 = 2.00x
Cache 128K: 3909.0 -> 3909.0 = 2.00x
Cache 256K: 20689.0 -> 20689.0 = 5.29x *L2*
Cache 512K: 41369.0 -> 41369.0 = 2.00x
Cache 640K: 51684.0 -> 51684.0 = 1.25x
Check CT
Check FPU: int
FreqFPU: 3632

AMI ID = 40-0100-001437-00101111-080893-4386
Checking VLSI 330
Checking VLSI 331

AMI STR = AMIBIOS (C)1993 American Megatrends Inc.,

Release 10/01/93.

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Searching for BIOS extensions...


Reply 467 of 478, by Am386DX-40

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Here's another one. In this case, the motherboard is an Octek Jaguar V rev 1.4, also with a DX-40 soldered in. This time the IIT 4C87DLC-40 (which is not the same as the one in the motherboard I posted above) is correctly identified as IIT, but incorrectly as 3C87 (though they might be the same chip).

image.png

Debug:

HWiNFO v6.1.2 
Flushing disk caches ...

Reading Data ...

DetectCPU - 386
FPUtest=3
Check Cx
Get freq
FreqCPU: 1295-26

Cache 1K: 32.4 -> 32.4
Cache 2K: 63.0 -> 63.0 = 1.95x
Cache 4K: 124.4 -> 124.4 = 1.97x
Cache 8K: 248.0 -> 248.0 = 1.99x
Cache 16K: 1672.9 -> 1672.9 = 6.75x *L1*
Cache 32K: 3350.0 -> 3350.0 = 2.00x
Cache 64K: 6700.0 -> 6700.0 = 2.00x
Cache 128K: 13406.0 -> 13406.0 = 2.00x
Cache 256K: 26808.0 -> 26808.0 = 2.00x
Cache 512K: 53619.0 -> 53619.0 = 2.00x
Cache 640K: 1489.0 -> 67025.0 = 1.25x
Check CT
Check FPU: IIT
FreqFPU: 3640

DetectCPU - 386
FPUtest=3
Resetting CPU [Method 3]

Resetting CPU [Method 1]
CPU ID1=308

Check Cx
Get freq
FreqCPU: 1294-26

Cache 1K: 32.4 -> 32.4
Cache 2K: 63.0 -> 63.0 = 1.95x
Cache 4K: 124.4 -> 124.4 = 1.97x
Cache 8K: 247.8 -> 247.8 = 1.99x
Cache 16K: 1673.9 -> 1673.9 = 6.76x *L1*
Cache 32K: 3349.0 -> 3349.0 = 2.00x
Cache 64K: 6701.0 -> 6701.0 = 2.00x
Cache 128K: 13404.0 -> 13404.0 = 2.00x
Cache 256K: 26809.0 -> 26809.0 = 2.00x
Cache 512K: 53619.0 -> 53619.0 = 2.00x
Cache 640K: 1490.0 -> 67026.0 = 1.25x
Check CT
Check FPU: IIT
FreqFPU: 3640

AMI ID = 31-0100-426069-00101111-121291-MXIC
Checking VLSI 330
Checking VLSI 331

AMI STR = AMIBIOS (C)1991 American Megatrends Inc.,

MX_DIR_001

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Searching for BIOS extensions...


Reply 468 of 478, by Mumak

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Thanks for the reports, those are interesting systems!
I will adjust the mainboard names so it will be correctly reported.
But the FPU detection is quite strange and I have no clue why the IIT check works on one machine, but doesn't on another one with the same FPU model.
Can you try to open the main screen multiple times to see if the reporting is consistent on each run?
Is there perhaps documentation for that IIT available somewhere?

Reply 469 of 478, by Am386DX-40

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Mumak wrote on 2021-01-27, 19:40:
Thanks for the reports, those are interesting systems! I will adjust the mainboard names so it will be correctly reported. But t […]
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Thanks for the reports, those are interesting systems!
I will adjust the mainboard names so it will be correctly reported.
But the FPU detection is quite strange and I have no clue why the IIT check works on one machine, but doesn't on another one with the same FPU model.
Can you try to open the main screen multiple times to see if the reporting is consistent on each run?
Is there perhaps documentation for that IIT available somewhere?

If you check THIS POST that I made some minutes ago, you'll see that even if the IIT FPUs are the same externally, internally there are differences. I will swap them around and check how HWInfo behaves in that case. If the "IIT" correct report follows an FPU or remains with the same motherboard regardless of which one is plugged in. I'll let you know later.

Reply 470 of 478, by Am386DX-40

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Ok, as I had the Jaguar V on the bench I went and removed the fpu and swapped it with the one on the M326, and HWInfo reports it as an Intel 80387DX at 73.6 MHz, just like the M326. So both FPUs are clearly different (even though they look identical) and they might report a different string to software, I don't know.

I tried NSSI and it's also seeing it as and Intel 387 (instead of the IIT), so my quote in the previous posts was wrong, but the frequency differs from HWInfo, it sees it as 53 mhz.

Reply 471 of 478, by Mumak

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Well, that's interesting. The FPU doesn't report and string, no identification data. It can be only tested using various unique results to detect at least the vendor or type. Various vendors or families have peculiarities that can be tested.
So there's a check method for an IIT FPU (based on denormal result) and the fact that this one reports as 387DX means this check if failing there.
So my conclusion is that it's either some very early IIT FPU or rather a clone attempt of the Intel 387DX or a faked IIT FPU.

Reply 472 of 478, by Mumak

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Now that I look at more details especially FPU clock detection based on execution time, it's clearly not a 387DX as that one has much longer execution times for certain instructions.
I'd rather say that the brownish one is an early IIT part that didn't yet support all later quirks.

Reply 473 of 478, by Am386DX-40

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Mumak wrote on 2021-01-27, 20:55:

Now that I look at more details especially FPU clock detection based on execution time, it's clearly not a 387DX as that one has much longer execution times for certain instructions.
I'd rather say that the brownish one is an early IIT part that didn't yet support all later quirks.

Yup, the brownish one is ~15 weeks older, which is not that much anywyas. I'm thinking maybe they are different batches of FPUs for different factories (hence the color difference) with different cores. Something interesting I found also, is that there are some IIT 3C87 with the same code as my 4C87DLC, 1002FA2F5HC0C, but they were made on the same date as my brownish one, and are brownish!. If only we could decode that string...

IIT%203C87-40%20%28noir%29%2001.jpg

What a mess 😁

PCInfo Version 4.04 detects the black one (newer) as IIT 3C87 / Intel RapidCAD while it detects the brownish one (older) as IIT 3C87 / IIT 3C87sx.

Reply 475 of 478, by Am386DX-40

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Mumak wrote on 2021-01-27, 21:26:

Or maybe the brownish one is somehow defect or unstable and it fails (besides the IEEE test) the generic IIT check. Maybe sometimes, maybe permanently...

I don't want to say that's impossible, because obviously it isn't, but pretty improbable. They both work perfectly fine with all software I throw at them, they perform identical even to the decimals in benchmarks that take care of the fpu. They just seem to behave different in some specific area. BTW the one that is detected as "Intel" is the black one. The brown one is detected as IIT.

Reply 476 of 478, by feipoa

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As I have recently been converting all my daily use machines from Windows to Linux, I was left perplexed by the lack of a "Device Manager", Astra, Everest, or hwinfo type of utility in Ubuntu. While there are a few add-on packages, they are very lacking in detail. I was wondering if there has been any thought in creating a hwinfo version for Linux?

Ultimate 486 Benchmark | Ultimate 686 Benchmark | Cyrix 5x86 Enhancements | 486 Overkill Graphics | Worlds Fastest 486

Reply 477 of 478, by Mumak

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feipoa wrote on 2021-02-16, 00:28:

As I have recently been converting all my daily use machines from Windows to Linux, I was left perplexed by the lack of a "Device Manager", Astra, Everest, or hwinfo type of utility in Ubuntu. While there are a few add-on packages, they are very lacking in detail. I was wondering if there has been any thought in creating a hwinfo version for Linux?

A thought there was, yes.. but no time and resources to dedicate to such a huge effort...