VOGONS


First post, by brian105

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I recently acquired a Compaq Presario 5284 with a K6-2 450, 96mb RAM, and a Rage Pro LT AGP 2x. I poked around a bit and decided some upgrades would probably be in order.
The motherboard has the MVP3 chipset. I checked the CPU in Everest and for some reason there was no L2 cache, which I heard is a massive performance deficit. In addition, I need to figure out which GPU / 3D accelerator would be the best to get for this thing. I thought of something like the Riva TNT2, but there are newer AGP cards such as the Radeon 7000 or FX 5200 which while aren't time period correct are much faster and would eliminate a GPU bottleneck. Maybe somebody has an idea of what the potential of this little CPU is so that I don't overspend on underutilized hardware.
Thanks in advance.

Presario 5284: K6-2+ 550 ACZ @ 600 2v, 256MB PC133, GeForce4 MX 440SE 64MB, MVP3, Maxtor SATA/150 PCI card, 16GB Sandisk U100 SATA SSD
2007 Desktop: Athlon 64 X2 6000+, Asus M2v-MX SE, Foxconn 7950GT 512mb, 4GB DDR2 800, Audigy 2 ZS, WinME/XP

Reply 1 of 12, by bloodem

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The L2 cache is external, located on the motherboard. The K6-2 does not have built-in L2 cache, for that you would need a CPU like K6-3, K6-2+ or K6-3+. (the K6-3 could work on your motherboard, but the "Plus" versions are tricky, you need BIOS support which I'm not sure you will find for your motherboard).
My GPU recommendation for AMD K6-2 is a GeForce 2 MX 400 (128bit) card paired with a Voodoo 2 (if you want to play Glide games).
As a rule of thumb, you will want to use older video cards, with old drivers (since those tend to be optimized for slow CPUs). When you get to cards like the FX series, you need to use newer drivers which add a lot of CPU overhead. This will result in slower performance with more powerful cards (I know, it's counter-intuitive).
I did many tests and I found that the GeForce 2 MX has the best bang for buck/performance/power consumption on a Super Socket 7 platform. An older driver like 7.76 is what you want.

Last edited by bloodem on 2020-04-17, 06:41. Edited 2 times in total.

1 x PLCC-68 / 2 x PGA132 / 5 x Skt 3 / 9 x Skt 7 / 12 x SS7 / 1 x Skt 8 / 14 x Slot 1 / 5 x Slot A
5 x Skt 370 / 8 x Skt A / 2 x Skt 478 / 2 x Skt 754 / 3 x Skt 939 / 7 x LGA775 / 1 x LGA1155
Current PC: Ryzen 7 5800X3D
Backup PC: Core i7 7700k

Reply 2 of 12, by BinaryDemon

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Are you sure you actually have an AGP slot? My quick google seems to indicate that the Presario 5284 does not. The AGP 2x is for the integrated video (Rage Pro LT) only.

I'm guessing you will be looking at PCI upgrade options, and your probably better with something a little older than Radeon 7000 or FX 5200 due to driver overhead. Something 3dfx (Voodoo3) would probably be ideal, but then you might be spending more than you would like. Like you suggested, the TNT2 would probably be a great option too. There will be little added benefit, but I'm guessing a PCI Geforce2 MX would be an easier card for you to find.

Check out DOSBox Distro:

https://sites.google.com/site/dosboxdistro/ [*]

a lightweight Linux distro (tinycore) which boots off a usb flash drive and goes straight to DOSBox.

Make your dos retrogaming experience portable!

Reply 3 of 12, by brian105

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I believe I saw an AGP slot near the PCI slots. Black, a bit smaller than a PCI slot?
Anyways, I'll likely go for the MX 200 or 400 if I can find them for a good price on eBay after this mess is done with.
Another question, is there a way to force resolutions? The monitor I'm using is 16:10 but Windows only offers 4:3, and Powerstrip says I can't add custom resolutions because the driver doesn't support it.

Presario 5284: K6-2+ 550 ACZ @ 600 2v, 256MB PC133, GeForce4 MX 440SE 64MB, MVP3, Maxtor SATA/150 PCI card, 16GB Sandisk U100 SATA SSD
2007 Desktop: Athlon 64 X2 6000+, Asus M2v-MX SE, Foxconn 7950GT 512mb, 4GB DDR2 800, Audigy 2 ZS, WinME/XP

Reply 4 of 12, by BinaryDemon

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brian105 wrote on 2020-04-17, 15:05:

I believe I saw an AGP slot near the PCI slots. Black, a bit smaller than a PCI slot?

Your description sounds right, although I think often a different color like brown or dark purple is used to differentiate agp.

I was going by this picture: https://651c328d1de292af2c4b-28651361a0deac96 … /320645-001.jpg

And cnets description:

Slots
1 (total) / 1 (free) x ISA
1 (total) / 1 (free) x PCI
1 (total) / 0 (free) x shared PCI / ISA

Check out DOSBox Distro:

https://sites.google.com/site/dosboxdistro/ [*]

a lightweight Linux distro (tinycore) which boots off a usb flash drive and goes straight to DOSBox.

Make your dos retrogaming experience portable!

Reply 5 of 12, by brian105

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Hmm, you're right, I just checked again. What are the big black slots near the PCI slots then?

Presario 5284: K6-2+ 550 ACZ @ 600 2v, 256MB PC133, GeForce4 MX 440SE 64MB, MVP3, Maxtor SATA/150 PCI card, 16GB Sandisk U100 SATA SSD
2007 Desktop: Athlon 64 X2 6000+, Asus M2v-MX SE, Foxconn 7950GT 512mb, 4GB DDR2 800, Audigy 2 ZS, WinME/XP

Reply 6 of 12, by dionb

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brian105 wrote on 2020-04-17, 21:44:

Hmm, you're right, I just checked again. What are the big black slots near the PCI slots then?

ISA. Great for DOS sound cards. Less so for K6/2-era video cards.

Tbh the Rage Pro isn't too bad - onboard VGA with its own RAM is far better than the integrated VGA sharing system memory with CPU all too common on this type of board. It's no speed demon, but it suits the CPU nicely.

Want more performance in the graphics department? Two options:
1) a dedicated 3D card, i.e. a Voodoo2.
2) a PCI 2D/3D card to replace the onboard VGA.

1 is pretty self-explanatory. Not cheap, but does the job and a perfect match for the CPU and Rage Pro.
2 can be cheaper, but less elegant, and less period correct. The obvious choice would be a TNT2 or GeForce2MX PCI card. They are relatively easy to find, affordable and trouble-free. Radeon 7000 PCI might also be an option. Don't expect the same performance as the AGP versions though. Anthing depending on transfers over the bus (loading textures) will be much slower.

As for your resolution/aspect ratio issue: that may be a reason to go for an nVidia card, as 16:9 resolutions simply weren't a thing in WIn98 era (I'm assuming that's what you are running), but some drivers supported it, including nVidia's Detonator drivers.

Reply 7 of 12, by brian105

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I'll likely go for the Geforce 2 MX, then. Even if it's on PCI, it should at least reach the performance of the AGP Riva TNT2 (I hope). Voodoo cards just seem too expensive on eBay , almost $40 for the Voodoo3.
Also, RAM-wise, should I just go for PC100 RAM, since 96mb is a bit low? Thanks for the advice!

Presario 5284: K6-2+ 550 ACZ @ 600 2v, 256MB PC133, GeForce4 MX 440SE 64MB, MVP3, Maxtor SATA/150 PCI card, 16GB Sandisk U100 SATA SSD
2007 Desktop: Athlon 64 X2 6000+, Asus M2v-MX SE, Foxconn 7950GT 512mb, 4GB DDR2 800, Audigy 2 ZS, WinME/XP

Reply 8 of 12, by darry

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brian105 wrote on 2020-04-17, 22:22:

I'll likely go for the Geforce 2 MX, then. Even if it's on PCI, it should at least reach the performance of the AGP Riva TNT2 (I hope). Voodoo cards just seem too expensive on eBay , almost $40 for the Voodoo3.
Also, RAM-wise, should I just go for PC100 RAM, since 96mb is a bit low? Thanks for the advice!

Where did you see a Voodoo 3 for under 40 dollars US ? If you can get a working Voodoo 3 2000 or 3000 PCI for that price, you should go for it, IMHO .

EDIT: Just saw you wrote Ebay . Anyway, that would have been a good deal .

On another note , PC100 should be fine

Reply 9 of 12, by dionb

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USD 40 for a Voodoo3 PCI? Grab it, they frequently go for twice that...

RAM-wise: what OS do you want to run on this? 96MB is more than enough for Win98 and any games that would happily run on a K6/2. Conversely, Win2k or XP like a lot more RAM. But... this is an So7 system. Cacheable memory limits are always an issue. For the MVP3 the rule is that 256x the amount of cache can be cached. The chipset supports up to 2MB of cache, but what I can find on that Presario suggests 512kB. That means max 128MB cacheable. If you go over that you get a significant (10-20%) performance hit. Of course, the performance hit from thrashing to HDD is far, far higher. So only go over 128MB if you are absolutely sure you will actually use the RAM over 128MB.

In any event, PC100 or PC133 will work, just make sure the DIMMs use max 128Mb chips, so 128MB with at least 8 chips. If you want to go crazy, 768MB should be possible, but make sure you use 256MB DIMMs with 16 chips (of 128Mb each). Also, consider a K6-3 or K6-2+ with its own cache in that case, as the on-chip L2 cache can address everything.

Reply 10 of 12, by Errius

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I have a very similar system, but it's in an old XT case with poor ventilation so I worry about overheating. No way am I putting a Voodoo in there.

Is this too much voodoo?

Reply 11 of 12, by brian105

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Is the power supply an issue? I just looked and it's 110W. Guess PSUs used to be a lot weaker.

Presario 5284: K6-2+ 550 ACZ @ 600 2v, 256MB PC133, GeForce4 MX 440SE 64MB, MVP3, Maxtor SATA/150 PCI card, 16GB Sandisk U100 SATA SSD
2007 Desktop: Athlon 64 X2 6000+, Asus M2v-MX SE, Foxconn 7950GT 512mb, 4GB DDR2 800, Audigy 2 ZS, WinME/XP