Indeed. Unfortunately couldn't tell you for sure, I never had a Sound Blaster 16 Value...
But if I were to guess, I would say that there really shouldn't be a noticeable sound quality difference.

bloodem wrote on 2020-09-01, 06:47:

Indeed. Unfortunately couldn't tell you for sure, I never had a Sound Blaster 16 Value...
But if I were to guess, I would say that there really shouldn't be a noticeable sound quality difference.

Ah cool! Nice to hear ! Thanks a lot ! Most original Sound blaster 16 sound card with opl3 are 120$ca or more, i was not ready for that price yet. And i dont think i care about the multiples jumpers or multiples cdrom interface of more expensive sound blaster 16 sound cards. and i dont understand really the difference between a pnp and non pnp sound card, so i dont want to pay more for that too.

Note: By the way, I now have 8 or 9 computers ! LoL ! Much of them are not configured yet. And i also have a socket 462 athlon xp computer and a 754 socket one too. But no K6. Im still disappointed i can get my p233mmx not slower than a 486 dx 33mhz. i tried all utilities. So Moon Patrol is not playable LoL! A really old game from my 7 years old. its a mid 80 game. Bubble ghost too fast too. Warcraft a little too fast too.

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-01, 07:15:

and i dont understand really the difference between a pnp and non pnp sound card, so i dont want to pay more for that too.

In short, the resources of a PnP card are configured through a software utility in DOS. For Creative sound cards, that's CTCU/CTCM. Under Windows 9x and above, PnP cards are automatically detected and installed by the operating system.

On the other hand, the resources on a non-PnP card are configured by hand, using jumpers. In most cases, Windows 9x doesn't automatically detect non-PnP cards and they have to be installed manually, either through a driver pack or using the Add New Hardware Wizard.

THANKS a lot Joseph_Joestar for this explanation.
I understand it better now.

Today was a special day for me. One of my friend (he works at Bethesda) give me for free a Sound Blaster 16 sound card with a yamaha opl3. I could choose between 3 card. It was not a easy choice, i go with my heart 😀 The choice was ct2740, ct2770 and ct2940( with YMF289B-S) . Finally i choose the ct2740. and i love it. That card beat any others soundcards that i own. The Yamaha OPL3 FM is impressive. It sounds better in doom and keen4 than es1869f, cs4236b, ct4180 and ct2970. But cs4236b is still very good but cant beat ct2740. I didnt compare them directly yet.

I have a question guys. Is it all sound blaster 16 sound card with a ct1747 chip that have a real genuine Yamaha OPL3? So, does my ct2740 have a real Yamaha OPL3. Check pictures.

See the uploaded pictures of my sound card.

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-02, 05:45:

I have a question guys. Is it all sound blaster 16 sound card with a ct1747 chip that have a real genuine Yamaha OPL3? So, does my ct2740 have a real Yamaha OPL3. Check pictures.

Yes, the CT1747 has an integrated OPL3. 😀

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-01, 07:15:

Im still disappointed i can get my p233mmx not slower than a 486 dx 33mhz. i tried all utilities. So Moon Patrol is not playable LoL! A really old game from my 7 years old. its a mid 80 game. Bubble ghost too fast too. Warcraft a little too fast too.

You probably forgot to disable the motherboard (external) cache in the BIOS. After you do that, use setmul to disable L1 cache, and you should end up with a 386 DX33 equivalent speed. If it's still too fast for some games, you can further decrease the speed by using ACPI Throttle (although, from my experience, this one works much better on VIA chipsets; on Intel chipsets it's quite unpredictable).

Or just get a slower PC... 😅

devius wrote on 2020-09-02, 16:47:

Or just get a slower PC... 😅

Thanks for answer guys. LoL! Yeah i want a 386 or 486. im still searching one in my city.

bloodem wrote on 2020-09-02, 08:18:

Yes, the CT1747 has an integrated OPL3. :) […]
Show full quote

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-02, 05:45:

I have a question guys. Is it all sound blaster 16 sound card with a ct1747 chip that have a real genuine Yamaha OPL3? So, does my ct2740 have a real Yamaha OPL3. Check pictures.

Yes, the CT1747 has an integrated OPL3. 😀

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-01, 07:15:

Im still disappointed i can get my p233mmx not slower than a 486 dx 33mhz. i tried all utilities. So Moon Patrol is not playable LoL! A really old game from my 7 years old. its a mid 80 game. Bubble ghost too fast too. Warcraft a little too fast too.

You probably forgot to disable the motherboard (external) cache in the BIOS. After you do that, use setmul to disable L1 cache, and you should end up with a 386 DX33 equivalent speed. If it's still too fast for some games, you can further decrease the speed by using ACPI Throttle (although, from my experience, this one works much better on VIA chipsets; on Intel chipsets it's quite unpredictable).

Im very surprised by the Yamaha OPL3 quality. It sounds even much better than my Crystal cs4236b in Keen4. i thought my Crystal FM was unbeatable 😀 But no, SB16 CT2740 and Yamaha OPL3 FM beat my Cs4236b FM easily. I cant believe how a Yamaha OPL3 can sounds so great in FM dos games. I really missed something when i was young 😀 i never had a Sound Blaster 16, only a awe64.

Thanks for the speed tips, i will try it later.

Ok for keen 4 SB16 ct2740+opl3 win easily vs crystal cs4236b.

But for Jazz Jackrabbit 1st stage:
(i think its digital music and no fm)

Crystal cs4236b wins. Music quality is better than SB16 ct2740 sound card. Before you ask, i already patched Jazz MDRV004D.MUS for DSP 4.0 and SB16.

The difference is not big between each sound card, but Crystal cs4236b sounds better, better quality. Its like music is 44khz for crystal vs 22khz for SB16 ct2740. ( Before i patched Jazz, SB16 music sounds like 8khz LoL!)

( i already installed the disk version of dos driver for SB16. I didnt change any parameter yet. And i didnt move any jumper on the card. I just played with the volume rocker. By the way i heard no noise with this sb16 ct2740. )

Do you have any idea to get Jazz music with SB16 ct2740 good as the CS4236b ?

Thanks for answer. I cant believe Sound Blaster 16 cant beat Crystal in digital music quality. 😀

Edit: i compare them several times. The big difference is the music CLARITY. Music with Crystal cs4236b has much better Clarity than SB16 ct2740. Both have the same setup.exe parameters in Jazz. For Both sound card i choose Sound Blaster 16 with A220 I5 D1.

Thanks for answer or help.

Hi guys! I would appreciate if someone can upload or give me a link for the nvidia detonator 7.76 driver. I need it for a tnt2 and geforce 2 mx200. I cant find it anywhere on google or vogons.
( I only have the detonator 7.76 driver modified for a geforce 3 ti200)

Thanks so much !

Hi, renejr902!
The modifed 7.76 drivers that I gave you for the GeForce 3 Ti200 also support the GeForce 2 MX200 and many other cards. Here is the full list:

NVIDIA&DEV_0020.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT" NVIDIA&DEV_0028.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2/TNT2 Pro" NVIDIA&DEV_0029.DeviceDesc=" […]
Show full quote

NVIDIA&DEV_0020.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT"
NVIDIA&DEV_0028.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2/TNT2 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0029.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2 Ultra"
NVIDIA&DEV_002C.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Vanta/Vanta LT"
NVIDIA&DEV_002D.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2 Model 64/Model 64 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_00A0.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Aladdin TNT2"
NVIDIA&DEV_0100.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce 256"
NVIDIA&DEV_0101.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce DDR"
NVIDIA&DEV_0103.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Quadro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0110.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 MX/MX 400"
NVIDIA&DEV_0111.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 MX 100/200"
NVIDIA&DEV_0113.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Quadro2 MXR"
NVIDIA&DEV_0150.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 GTS/GeForce2 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0151.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 GTS"
NVIDIA&DEV_0152.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 Ultra"
NVIDIA&DEV_0153.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Quadro2 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0154.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 Ti 200"
NVIDIA&DEV_0200.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce3"
NVIDIA&DEV_0201.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce3 Ti 200"
NVIDIA&DEV_0202.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce3 Ti 500"

bloodem wrote on 2020-09-07, 10:24:

Hi, renejr902!
The modifed 7.76 drivers that I gave you for the GeForce 3 Ti200 also support the GeForce 2 MX200 and many other cards. Here is the full list:

NVIDIA&DEV_0020.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT" NVIDIA&DEV_0028.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2/TNT2 Pro" NVIDIA&DEV_0029.DeviceDesc=" […]
Show full quote

NVIDIA&DEV_0020.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT"
NVIDIA&DEV_0028.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2/TNT2 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0029.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2 Ultra"
NVIDIA&DEV_002C.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Vanta/Vanta LT"
NVIDIA&DEV_002D.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA RIVA TNT2 Model 64/Model 64 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_00A0.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Aladdin TNT2"
NVIDIA&DEV_0100.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce 256"
NVIDIA&DEV_0101.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce DDR"
NVIDIA&DEV_0103.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Quadro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0110.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 MX/MX 400"
NVIDIA&DEV_0111.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 MX 100/200"
NVIDIA&DEV_0113.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Quadro2 MXR"
NVIDIA&DEV_0150.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 GTS/GeForce2 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0151.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 GTS"
NVIDIA&DEV_0152.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 Ultra"
NVIDIA&DEV_0153.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA Quadro2 Pro"
NVIDIA&DEV_0154.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce2 Ti 200"
NVIDIA&DEV_0200.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce3"
NVIDIA&DEV_0201.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce3 Ti 200"
NVIDIA&DEV_0202.DeviceDesc="NVIDIA GeForce3 Ti 500"

LoL! I didn't know, i didnt try it ! Ok then i will use it. Thanks so much Bloodem for answer. Have a great day ! ( Yesterday i read several hours about sound card technology mt-32, wavetable,soundfont.. I learned a lot of new things, its very interesting. If you have a chance read my sound cards benchmark topic and my pci video cards picture quality tests topic 😀 )

today was a wonderful day. One of my father computer tech contact gave me as a gift 40 pc agp and pci cards and a computer. I will name a few of them: Pentium III 1000mhz, Sound Blaster 16 ct2940, (not the one with opl3 but 1978) agp Radeon 9800 pro, agp geforce fx 5500, pci S3 virge dx, agp tnt2, agp radeon 9600 pro, agp ati rage 128 pro and ultra, agp matrox millenium G450,
agp Geforce mx 4000, pcie geforce 7300, agp radeon 7000, agp radeon 9250, agp nvidia Vanta 16, pci Quadro 280.. and more i cant remember all of them right now. I'm very lucky today 😀

I will have more video cards for benchmark and picture quality tests when i have more time.
Right now i have 10 retro pc build and like 60-70 video cards and 10 sound cards. Wow! All of this within 2 months LoL! And in general, it costs me only a few dollars. I'm so happy !

- P3 1000mhz
- P3 933mhz
- P3 800mhz
- P2 266mhz
- P2 450mhz
- P1 233mmx
- P1 166mmx
- Amd Athlon xp 3000+
- Amd Sempron
- Pentium 4

and some others motherboard and cpu too. Some of them work but i have no more psu or case and for some others i didnt test them yet.

Within the next 2-3 months i will buy a 486 motherboard and cpu and make a build with these with a custom case. I think i have all necessary components. I want either a Intel 486 Dx 33mhz or dx2 66mhz cpu, no others cpu.

I dont have a lot of free time recently, when possible i will do others benchmarks and others build. But in general right now i only use my p233mmx for playing dos games with my sb16 ct2770 or i use my P3 933mhz for playing win98 games with my geforce 3 ti200 and voodoo3 with my sb16 ct2740 or my sb live. ( i use both sound cards configured in the same build. Since yesterday, i love to use my sblive with the SC-55 soundfont and dos games in general midi, like doom and King Quest VI)

Have a great day guys !

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-09, 02:36:

today was a wonderful day. One of my father computer tech contact gave me as a gift 40 pc agp and pci cards and a computer.

That's always good when it happens 😄

renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-09, 02:36:

I think i have all necessary components.

Ha ha ha I'm sure soon enough you'll find that you don't 😆

I will let you know if i forgot about something LoL! 😀

Hi! I made some new benchmarks for some minutes. This is the result.

P2 450mhz, NFS III 1024x768 Full graphics, except medium view distance:

Geforce 2 MX200: Between 25 to 37 fps. A lot of cars is between 25 and 30fps(v7.76) Playable

Geforce FX 5500: Between 35 and 60fps. A lot of cars is between 35 to 45fps. No cars between 55 and 60fps. (V56.64) Very playable. Even with v56.64 nvdia driver the FX 5500 is much better than Geforce2 mx200. So not too much overhead driver on a P2 450mhz.

Geforce 3 Ti200: 99% of time is perfect 60fps stable. ( without vsync can go to 65fps)
1% of time, or for a few seconds it can drop between 50 to 59fps, but only if a lot cars with a lot of effects or a lot of action. (V7.76)
The Geforce 3 ti200 (with v7.76) is much better and has much more performance than the FX5500 (with v56.64)

Geforce 3 ti200 (v56.64)
I'm impress. Its 100% the same fps than FX 5500 all of the time. Samexsituatuon same fps variance.
Any video card give exactly the same fps with v56.64 nvidia driver.

Geforce 3ti200 (v45.23)
Its froze on NFS III in main menu and show a error screen. I reinstalled driver 2 times. I can't test it.

Both videocards is able to maintain 30fps in Moto Racer 2 with vsync. A few drop to 20-25fps in Amazonian Race with Geforce 2 mx200 and FX5500. Both cards run similar fps.
Geforce 3 ti 200 in Moto Rcaer 2 is always 35 fps in fps drop in any races. I think the game has a 35fps caps. My screen is at 60hz.

For playing NFS III in 1024x768 with full graphics at 60fps, a P2 450mhz can do the job with a few fps drops with a Geforce 3 Ti200 and v7.76 nvidia driver. No need for my Pentium 3 at 800mhz or 933mhz. P2 450mhz can do pretty much the same fps in NFS III in 1024x768 and full graphics at 60fps stable.

_______________________

P2 450mhz NFS Hot pursuit 2

Geforce 3 ti 200 (v7.76) Min graphics 8 to 10fps

Geforce 3 ti 200 (v45.23) Min graphics 25 to 45fps playable.

Geforce 3 ti 200 (v45.23) Medium graphics 25 to 45fps playable

v7.76 works but its really slow.

The Pentium 3 933mhz give me more fps around 10 to 20 more fps with the same graphics setting in NFS Hot Pursuit 2.

___________________________

P2 266mhz NFS III 1024x768 Full graphics except medium view distance.

PCI TNT 2 Between 25 t0 38fps Playable.(v7.76)

Geforce 2 MX 200 is able to maintain 30fps stable much of time. (v7.76) Very playable. Better than TNT2.

Geforce 3 Ti200

WOW! I'm impress with the P2 266mhz and the Geforce 3 Ti200 (v7.76) with NFS III.
With a lot of cars 44 to 48fps.
A few cars 50 to 57fps.
No cars 60fps. The game is very playable.
Not much overhead driver if any, with a P2 266mhz with a geforce 3 Ti 200 and v7.76 Nvidia driver.

My P2 266mhz froze with all my 4 AGP TnT2 in any games, i only test yet with v7.76 driver. Its very strange. But my pci tnt2, agp geforce 2 mx200 and agp geforce 3 ti 200 work all perfect with v7.76
Any ideas ? Thanks a lot !

Have you tried enabling/disabling AGP options in the BIOS like "side-band addressing", "AGP Aperture size", etc. ?

Thanks for help. I changed some bios options without success. I will check for side-band adressing but i dont think the bios have this parameter. I tried agp aperture size at 64mb and 32mb.