VOGONS


First post, by renejr902

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Hi! I compare several sound cards.

I compare the CT4180 with CT2740 in keen4(has a ct1747 chip with a licensed Yamaha genuine opl3)
They sounds exactly 100% the same in Keen4. Even the CT4180 has better clarity in music but its still sounds 100% the same than ct2740

I compare ct2970 ( CQM chip) and sounds bad in Keen4

Crystal CS4236b sounds good enough but nothing like ct2740 and opl3. (keen4)

ES1869f sounds good enough but nothing like ct2740 and opl3. Crystal cs4236b FM even beat the ES1869f FM too. (keen4)

I heard the music very carefullly and several times with each sound cards. I compare each sound and effect in the music.

I will compare them in Doom now. and Let you know soon.

Maybe each ct4180 has a different FM chip. its a strange sb16 sound card with mostly only one big chip. Check my pictures of CT4180 vs CT2740 .
A Vogons discussion of 2012 talk about the same Sb16 ct4180 and FM confusion. Most people believe it has a CQM FM chip. Personally i dont believe it.

Thanks for your opinion and answers. I tried to figure a way to record my sound cards in a file..

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Last edited by renejr902 on 2020-09-05, 05:20. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 1 of 23, by renejr902

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i recorded a music but i recorded with my cell phone, im sorry 🤣! im not sure the file quality is good enough for compare each sound card. im sorry about that
Click on the uploaded link and heard the music.

0 to 1:00 min = sb16 ct2740( real opl3)
1:00 to 2:00min = sb16 ct4180
2:00 to 3:00min = crystal cs4236b

Note: COPY and PASTE the link yourself in web browser. the direct link doesnt always work.

https://sndup.net/75yh

( Keen4: i didnt recorded yet es1869f but it plays just a little worst quality than cs4236b. i didnt recorded yet sb16 Ct2970, but this CQM sound card sounds really bad vs all others sound card i own. i really hate the ct2970 CQM FM)

Reply 2 of 23, by renejr902

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Hmmm! It seems doom sounds nothing like Keen4.

i recorded the file below

0:00 to 2:00= cs2740( real opl3)
2:00 to 4:00 = cs4180
4:00 to 5:45 = Crystal cs4236b

Finally maybe Keen4 is not a good example.
Doom show DIFFERENCE in FM music quality
between Cs2740 and cs4180. I think CS2740 beat cs4180 even easily and sounds like the youtube genuine yamaha opl3 link that you gave me earlier in another topic.

CS2740 sounds like a genuine yamaha opl3 in Doom. Ct4180 doesnt sound like a genuine yamaha opl3 to me. Its sound better than Ct2970 with his CQM tough. Maybe ct4280 has a custom CQM or another FM but i dont believe anymore its a real genuine yamaha opl3. Crystal cs4236b sound worse than both sb16 cards, but still not bad at all, indeed very good. Crystal cs4236b sounds better than cs2970 and better than es1869f to me.

But please judge for yourself and tell me your opinion and answers. Thanks guys !

(By the way, with the help of my doom uploaded file below, please tell me if you find that my SB16 CT2740 sounds like a real genuine Yamaha opl3 FM and like a genuine Sound Blaster 16 sound card, just to be 100% sure, thanks for answer. Im not a audiophile expert.)

https://sndup.net/6476

Note: COPY and PASTE the link yourself in web browser. the direct link doesnt always work.

edit: i just corrected the link.

Ok for keen 4 SB16 ct2740+opl3 win easily vs crystal cs4236b.

But for Jazz Jackrabbit 1st stage:
(i think its digital music and no fm)

Crystal cs4236b wins. Music quality is better than SB16 ct2740 sound card. Before you ask, i already patched Jazz MDRV004D.MUS for DSP 4.0 and SB16.

The difference is not big between each sound card, but Crystal cs4236b sounds better, better quality. Its like music is 44khz for crystal vs 22khz for SB16 ct2740. ( Before i patched Jazz, SB16 music sounds like 8khz LoL!)

( i already installed the disk version of dos driver for SB16. I didnt change any parameter yet. And i didnt move any jumper on the card. I just played with the volume rocker. By the way i heard no noise with this sb16 ct2740. )

Do you have any idea to get Jazz music with SB16 ct2740 good as the CS4236b ?

Thanks for answer. I cant believe Sound Blaster 16 cant beat Crystal in digital music quality. 😀

Edit: i compare them several times. The big difference is the music CLARITY. Music with Crystal cs4236b has much better Clarity than SB16 ct2740. Both have the same setup.exe parameters in Jazz. For Both sound card i choose Sound Blaster 16 with A220 I5 D1.

Thanks for answer or help.

Last edited by renejr902 on 2020-09-03, 18:38. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 3 of 23, by renejr902

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I compare my sound cards a lot in Jazz Jackrabbit again ( I think no FM is in use, only digital music, normal music) The music has much more CLARITY with Crystal Cs4236b than SB16 CT2740. Any ideas to get more Clarity in music with my SB16 ct2740 ? Even in doom music has more clarity with crystal cs4236b than SB16 ct2740 even if quality was much worse in general.

Maybe my SB16 ct2740 has not a lot of clarity in music vs others sound cards. Honestly i dont know much about that stuff ! 😉 Any help would be appreciated. Maybe with the help of driver utilities or jumper. Thanks a lot guys for answer, opinion or help 😀

Edit: EVEN ct4180 has much more clarity in Jazz than ct2740. For clarity Ct4180 play similar to cs4236b. But i would give the win to Crystal cs4236b for clarity. A little better than ct4180, not by much. Honestly Cs4236b and ct4180 play Jazz music like the same quality. Maybe both sound cards play the Jazz music exactly the same way and the same quality at 10o%, its surprising. they sounds exactly the same.

Edit2: Im not sure but if digital music and normal music are playing using ct2505-tdq2 chip, i think its the vibra chip(ct4180) and chip ct1745a for (ct2740) maybe the Vibra chip more recent version play digital music and normal music better than old a1745a chip. Maybe 3rd Sound Blaster recent 2505-tdq2 vibra chip play digital music and normal music Better and with more clarity than 3rd Sound Blaster generation with older chip (like ct1745a, ct1741, ct1703-t,ct1747..) What do you think ? Is it possible ? Thanks a lot for answer or opinion.

Edit3: Enough strange All SB16(vibra) that come with a 250x-TDQ chip have a Yamaha genuine opl3. and ct4180 has a 2505-TDQ2 chip. Only difference is the " 2 ". But honestly after my tests i dont find at all that ct4180 sounds like a opl3 chip with doom ( check my music file posted earlier).
But its still strange that ct4180 has only one BIG chip the ct2505-tdq2 and no others chip. no ct1978, no ymf, no ct1747. nothing other than one big ct2505-tdq2 chip. Its a strange revision and sb16 (vibra) version.

Reply 4 of 23, by renejr902

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Ok read my previous post before if you didnt or all my previous posts 😀

Finally after 30min testing.. Jazz music play a little better , but it noticeable, with SB16 ct4180 than Crystal cs4236b. Only the SB16 ct2740 sounds bad and too low quality to me with Jazz, but its probably because the clarity is not good enough with the ct2740. i really want to find a way to get better clarity with my ct2740. Dont forget Jazz dont use FM, only digital music and normal music, i think its like playing a wav file. But ct2740 has more loud bass playing in Jazz music, i dont know if it can explain low clarity.

There you go comoare by yourself:

0:00 to 1:00 = Crystal CS4236b
1:00 to 2:00 = SB16 ct4180 (Vibra chip 2505-tdq2)
2:00 to 4:00= SB16 ct2740 (ct1745a,1747,1741..)
Thanks for your opinion and answer or help about my ct2740 clarity problem.

https://sndup.net/35py

Note: COPY and PASTE the link yourself in web browser. the direct link doesnt always work.

Note2: If youre curious, Es1869f play worse than cs4236b, not a lot but its noticeable. Ct2970(CQM ct1978) play even worse than ES1869f. So its the worst sound card in Jazz. Im sorry it was too complicated for me, for now, to record 5 computers music at the same time. I choose my 3 favorites sound cards for the recording. But i heard every music of all games with my 5 sound cards.

Reply 5 of 23, by renejr902

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I begin to confuse.

The ct4180 CLARITY is really a lot better than Ct2740 with all games. and keen4 sounds exactly the same except clarity on both sound cards.

So i begin to doubt that ct4180 still have a Genuine Yamaha opl3. Since 1 hour i compare ct4180 and ct2740 in Doom only.

We need a audiophile expert to heard my doom file and his opinion if ct4180 could have a genuine opl3 after all, at least in my ct4180.

Thanks a lot guys, i really want a audiophile expert to give us his opinion about my ct4180 and genuine yamaha opl3 possibility.

Thanks a lot for answer and opinion.

Edit: I heard again for a last time. Im not sure but probably the Ct4180 has a CQM chip. Maybe a custom CQM chip that play better than most CQM chip or more like a real yamaha opl3, but still CQM.
At least it plays even better than awe64 CQM from joestar link.

OPL3 vs. ESFM vs. CQM vs. SBLive

My ct2970 CQM FM sound card play doom not good at all.

But i know the ct2740 genuine yamaha opl3 sounds better quality, more authentic too, BUT THE CLARITY IS SO LOW and bad, that because of this i prefer to heard the music from my ct4180 because the clarity is awesome even if its play worse and less quality in doom.

The Yamaha YMF724F-V web site link from Joestar have more clarity in music than my SB16 ct2740, at least i think this.

Man! I really need help to get more clarity from my ct2740. Even if i have to change caps, any ideas is welcome. My father is a electronic technician.

Reply 7 of 23, by renejr902

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Finally i received my Sound Blaster 16 Value ct2770 with real opl3 ct1747 today. ( 5 days only from Bulgary to Canada)

After some testing, The SB16 ct2770 play a lot more clean, very good clarity. Not as good like ct4180, but good enough. The ct2740 sounds really a lot muffled. I dont know if they are all like that, but i dont recommend the ct2740 to anyone.
I will only use the ct2770(opl3) and ct4180(even without opl3, i prefer it to the super muffled ct2740 edition) 😀

Reply 8 of 23, by The Serpent Rider

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Topic name should be changed, since it's no really about CT4180, but any card with Vibra16C

I must be some kind of standard: the anonymous gangbanger of the 21st century.

Reply 10 of 23, by renejr902

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I succeed to configure correctly the SB16 ct2770. Its sounds better and even more clean than ct4180. I use recommend mixerset settings by James. I dont hear any noise or distortion. I think this Sound Blaster 16 value ct2700 should sounds good like the ct2230 or ct2290. But i never tested them. The SB16 ct2770 is the perfect sound card for me. I'm very happy with it.

(For ct2770, i use 300 instead of 330 for mpu and irq 7 instead of 5, but im not sure if it could have help to obtain a cleaner music quality output, if someone can tell me more about that possibility, thanks)

But nothing can be done with the SB16 ct2740. Even with James mixerset settings, this sound card sounds a lot muffled. Too much muffled for me. The music is not clean at all. I recommend people to skip this model.

I have 2 questions guys ! Thanks a lot !

1. How many Windows 98 games can use the Yamaha opl3 synth ? Which games for examples ? Honestly i know a lot of dos games that use opl3, but for windows 98 i have no idea at all. Thanks for answer. If its no use for win98 i will keep it in my pc build for dos only.

2. What are the advantages of a awe32 with a opl3 chip vs SB16? I read that they use soundfonts with ram. But honestly i dont know really the purpose of that. Is it for playing better quality midi music files? Thanks for more explanation. ( i had a awe64 when i was young, but i really didnt know how to use soundfonts. Maybe i never use that)

Reply 11 of 23, by darry

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renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 00:24:
I succeed to configure correctly the SB16 ct2770. Its sounds better and even more clean than ct4180. I use recommend mixerset se […]
Show full quote

I succeed to configure correctly the SB16 ct2770. Its sounds better and even more clean than ct4180. I use recommend mixerset settings by James. I dont hear any noise or distortion. I think this Sound Blaster 16 value ct2700 should sounds good like the ct2230 or ct2290. But i never tested them. The SB16 ct2770 is the perfect sound card for me. I'm very happy with it.

(For ct2770, i use 300 instead of 330 for mpu and irq 7 instead of 5, but im not sure if it could have help to obtain a cleaner music quality output, if someone can tell me more about that possibility, thanks)

But nothing can be done with the SB16 ct2740. Even with James mixerset settings, this sound card sounds a lot muffled. Too much muffled for me. The music is not clean at all. I recommend people to skip this model.

I have 2 questions guys ! Thanks a lot !

1. How many Windows 98 games can use the Yamaha opl3 synth ? Which games for examples ? Honestly i know a lot of dos games that use opl3, but for windows 98 i have no idea at all. Thanks for answer. If its no use for win98 i will keep it in my pc build for dos only.

2. What are the advantages of a awe32 with a opl3 chip vs SB16? I read that they use soundfonts with ram. But honestly i dont know really the purpose of that. Is it for playing better quality midi music files? Thanks for more explanation. ( i had a awe64 when i was young, but i really didnt know how to use soundfonts. Maybe i never use that)

1) Windows applications/games normally access the OPL3 through the MIDI mapper and a driver that attempts to use the OPL3 as synthesizer with statically pre-defined "instruments" (this is much less flexible than under DOS, where custom instruments can be defined for OPL2 and OPL3 chips in the sound middleware that a game uses). This usually sound rather crappy, IMHO . For Windows applications/games, you are better off with a General MIDI compatible sound card or module. This is a bit simplified, but a good general picture .

2) On SB16/AWE32/SB32/AWE64 cards, there are two possible FM synthesizer chips Yamaha OPL3 or Creative CQM (imperfect "clone" of the OPL3) . Many people, myself included, prefer the sound of the original Yamaha OPL3 . This is really mostly significant for DOS games as mentioned in point 1 . OPL3 and CQM have nothing to do with soundfounts .

EDIT : Soundfonts are instrument sounds than can be loaded in banks (groups) into the AWE32/SB32 or AWE64 memory . They can bu used in conjunction with or instead of the instruments present in these cards' 1 MB ROM .

Reply 12 of 23, by Joseph_Joestar

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renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 00:24:

2. What are the advantages of a awe32 with a opl3 chip vs SB16? I read that they use soundfonts with ram. But honestly i dont know really the purpose of that. Is it for playing better quality midi music files?

Soundfonts improve the quality of General MIDI music. They have no effect on FM synth music.

If you want to play around with soundfonts, you're probably better off with a SBLive than an AWE32/64. They load much faster on the Live and you're only limited in size by the amount of your system RAM, when using the correct drivers. For the AWE cards, you're limited by the amount of RAM installed on the card itself.

Here's how General MIDI sounds on a SBLive when a high quality soundfont is used.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / YMF719 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 2100+ / ECS K7VTA3 / Voodoo3 / Audigy2 / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3400+ / Asus K8V-MX / 5900XT / Audigy2
PC#4: i5-3570K / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 970 / X-Fi

Reply 13 of 23, by renejr902

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darry wrote on 2020-09-07, 01:33:
1) Windows applications/games normally access the OPL3 through the MIDI mapper and a driver that attempts to use the OPL3 as syn […]
Show full quote
renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 00:24:
I succeed to configure correctly the SB16 ct2770. Its sounds better and even more clean than ct4180. I use recommend mixerset se […]
Show full quote

I succeed to configure correctly the SB16 ct2770. Its sounds better and even more clean than ct4180. I use recommend mixerset settings by James. I dont hear any noise or distortion. I think this Sound Blaster 16 value ct2700 should sounds good like the ct2230 or ct2290. But i never tested them. The SB16 ct2770 is the perfect sound card for me. I'm very happy with it.

(For ct2770, i use 300 instead of 330 for mpu and irq 7 instead of 5, but im not sure if it could have help to obtain a cleaner music quality output, if someone can tell me more about that possibility, thanks)

But nothing can be done with the SB16 ct2740. Even with James mixerset settings, this sound card sounds a lot muffled. Too much muffled for me. The music is not clean at all. I recommend people to skip this model.

I have 2 questions guys ! Thanks a lot !

1. How many Windows 98 games can use the Yamaha opl3 synth ? Which games for examples ? Honestly i know a lot of dos games that use opl3, but for windows 98 i have no idea at all. Thanks for answer. If its no use for win98 i will keep it in my pc build for dos only.

2. What are the advantages of a awe32 with a opl3 chip vs SB16? I read that they use soundfonts with ram. But honestly i dont know really the purpose of that. Is it for playing better quality midi music files? Thanks for more explanation. ( i had a awe64 when i was young, but i really didnt know how to use soundfonts. Maybe i never use that)

1) Windows applications/games normally access the OPL3 through the MIDI mapper and a driver that attempts to use the OPL3 as synthesizer with statically pre-defined "instruments" (this is much less flexible than under DOS, where custom instruments can be defined for OPL2 and OPL3 chips in the sound middleware that a game uses). This usually sound rather crappy, IMHO . For Windows applications/games, you are better off with a General MIDI compatible sound card or module. This is a bit simplified, but a good general picture .

2) On SB16/AWE32/SB32/AWE64 cards, there are two possible FM synthesizer chips Yamaha OPL3 or Creative CQM (imperfect "clone" of the OPL3) . Many people, myself included, prefer the sound of the original Yamaha OPL3 . This is really mostly significant for DOS games as mentioned in point 1 . OPL3 and CQM have nothing to do with soundfounts .

EDIT : Soundfonts are instrument sounds than can be loaded in banks (groups) into the AWE32/SB32 or AWE64 memory . They can bu used in conjunction with or instead of the instruments present in these cards' 1 MB ROM .

Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2020-09-07, 03:01:
Soundfonts improve the quality of General MIDI music. They have no effect on FM synth music. […]
Show full quote
renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 00:24:

2. What are the advantages of a awe32 with a opl3 chip vs SB16? I read that they use soundfonts with ram. But honestly i dont know really the purpose of that. Is it for playing better quality midi music files?

Soundfonts improve the quality of General MIDI music. They have no effect on FM synth music.

If you want to play around with soundfonts, you're probably better off with a SBLive than an AWE32/64. They load much faster on the Live and you're only limited in size by the amount of your system RAM, when using the correct drivers. For the AWE cards, you're limited by the amount of RAM installed on the card itself.

Here's how General MIDI sounds on a SBLive when a high quality soundfont is used.

Thanks a lot for answers guys! I just read several hours about wavetable, fm synth, mt-32, general midi, soundfont, general midi dos and win95-98 compatibility game list..

I learned so much things !! I think i understand it all now. I had a awe64 when i was young and i never choose general midi for dos games LoL! I missed something big, i heard only cqm music in dos.

It seems Opl3 FM synth is no use for win98 games, so i will install a sblive (i have one) for my P3 933mhz win98 build ( i use it for dos too, but i prefer my p233mmx for that)

I want to try Doom and Duke nukem 3D with general midi with my sblive. i never heard a dos game in general midi. ( except FF7 but that was for win98) LoL!

Edit: Now i hesitate to buy a awe32 with a real opl3 instead of using my sblive in that build. I dont want a awe64 because i want a real Yamaha opl3.
But i know the sblive can do the job in my P3 with general midi games. And use my sb16 ct2770 in my p233mmx for others dos games with opl3 support only. ( i also have a sb pci 128 sound card )

Reply 14 of 23, by renejr902

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I just checked on youtube Doom with SBlive in general midi. The music sounds really weird to me, maybe it just too new for my ears. I heard doom with sc-55 too and its still a little weird, but much better than sblive. With doom I heard the Yamaha opl3 for so long or opl3 clones that it feel weird to heard it with general midi. I'm surprised that sc-55 play much better than sblive. i thought that all wavetable or general midi devices play very similar, but its not the case with sc-55 vs sblive in doom.

Reply 15 of 23, by Joseph_Joestar

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renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 06:31:

I just checked on youtube Doom with SBlive in general midi. The music sounds really weird to me, maybe it just too new for my ears. I heard doom with sc-55 too and its still a little weird, but much better than sblive.

How General MIDI sounds on a SBLive depends entirely on the soundfont that it uses.

In the example that I linked above, I'm using a soundfont which mimics the SC-55. The YouTube videos that you saw probably use something else.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / YMF719 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 2100+ / ECS K7VTA3 / Voodoo3 / Audigy2 / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3400+ / Asus K8V-MX / 5900XT / Audigy2
PC#4: i5-3570K / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 970 / X-Fi

Reply 16 of 23, by renejr902

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Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2020-09-07, 07:40:
renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 06:31:

I just checked on youtube Doom with SBlive in general midi. The music sounds really weird to me, maybe it just too new for my ears. I heard doom with sc-55 too and its still a little weird, but much better than sblive.

How General MIDI sounds on a SBLive depends entirely on the soundfont that it uses.

In the example that I linked above, I'm using a soundfont which mimics the SC-55. The YouTube videos that you saw probably use something else.

Hi! i just heard your link. I'm sorry i forgot to heard it yesterday. Oh yes! it sounds much better. Even better than sc-55 i heard on youtube.

Please can you give me a link for the soundfont that you use ? I want to use the same than yours for my sblive.
thanks a lot !

If i try to use a isa sound blaster 16 in my P3 with a Sound Blaster live, both soundcard together, do i miss something ? Maybe this way i dont need a awe32 or awe64, if i use a sblive with a sb16 in my P3 ? right? ( i know it wont be easy to configure, any advice ? thanks !) (Edit: I just read some topics about having 2 sound cards in the same time. I understand everything that was explaind, but its not a easy thing to configure correctly. I will think about it. I have 4 ready retro build so maybe i will use only the sblive in one of my computer )

Reply 17 of 23, by Joseph_Joestar

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renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 15:01:

Please can you give me a link for the soundfont that you use ? I want to use the same than yours for my sblive.
thanks a lot !

I'm using Patch93's SC-55 soundfont. You can find a detailed explanation on how to set up a SBLive like that in my guide: Guide: Installing Windows 9x and DOS drivers on Sound Blaster Live! cards (version 3.1)

If i try to use a isa sound blaster 16 in my P3 with a Sound Blaster live, both soundcard together, do i miss something ? Maybe this way i dont need a awe32 or awe64, if i use a sblive with a sb16 in my P3 ? right? ( i know it wont be easy to configure, any advice ? thanks !)

As long as you configure both sound cards to use different resources, it should be fine. My advice regarding DOS games is to use the SB16 for digital sound effects + FM synth and then set up the SBLive purely as a General MIDI device. For Win9x games, just select the SBLive as your preferred sound device so they will use it by default and ignore the SB16. You will also need a short cable with a 3.5 mm jack on each end to connect both cards together (line out to line in).

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / YMF719 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 2100+ / ECS K7VTA3 / Voodoo3 / Audigy2 / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3400+ / Asus K8V-MX / 5900XT / Audigy2
PC#4: i5-3570K / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 970 / X-Fi

Reply 18 of 23, by renejr902

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Joseph_Joestar wrote on 2020-09-07, 16:14:
I'm using Patch93's SC-55 soundfont. You can find a detailed explanation on how to set up a SBLive like that in my guide: Guide: […]
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renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 15:01:

Please can you give me a link for the soundfont that you use ? I want to use the same than yours for my sblive.
thanks a lot !

I'm using Patch93's SC-55 soundfont. You can find a detailed explanation on how to set up a SBLive like that in my guide: Guide: Installing Windows 9x and DOS drivers on Sound Blaster Live! cards (version 3.1)

If i try to use a isa sound blaster 16 in my P3 with a Sound Blaster live, both soundcard together, do i miss something ? Maybe this way i dont need a awe32 or awe64, if i use a sblive with a sb16 in my P3 ? right? ( i know it wont be easy to configure, any advice ? thanks !)

As long as you configure both sound cards to use different resources, it should be fine. My advice regarding DOS games is to use the SB16 for digital sound effects + FM synth and then set up the SBLive purely as a General MIDI device. For Win9x games, just select the SBLive as your preferred sound device so they will use it by default and ignore the SB16. You will also need a short cable with a 3.5 mm jack on each end to connect both cards together (line out to line in).

Oh my god ! Wow! Im impress ! I followed all your guide carefully. All works perfect! I can't believe how great the music sounds in Doom and King Quest VI. Its much better than Yamaha Opl3 FM synth. I'm really impress. King Quest VI in village play so great its unbelivable ! Thanks so much !
( i prefer that by a long shot, but its feels less nostalgia because i never heard music like that when i was young, for me it sounds like a King Quest VI remake made in 2020 LoL! 😀)

But i have a few questions again. LoL! 😀

1. If i buy the awe32, is the default soundfont play as great like sblive with SC-55 soundfont ? im pretty sure not really, but i want your answer 😉 and i have the same question vs Awe64 vs sblive with SC-55 soundfont ! Thanks a lot for answer !

2. Is a real SC-55 wavetable play exactly like the sblive with SC-55 soundfont ? Thanks for answer.

3. Is the Sound Blaster live have a real authentic wavetable ? even if its integrated in the card.
(i think its called emu 10k)

4. Does it have any advantage to buy a awe32 or awe64 or a wavetable midi card for my sb16 ct2740 VS using a Sblive with the SC-55 soundfont loaded in it ? ( Could any other sound card option play better or exactly the same quality as my sblive with sc-55 soundfont loaded ? ) Thanks !

5. For the 3.5mm cable. Which sound card should has line in and line out ? ( i didnt try using my sblive with my sb ct2740 yet on my P3 933mhz. I will try it later today.) (And about my sb16 ct2770 i keep it for my p233mmx pc build only)

Thanks so much for your answers ! I'm very interested at that stuff now 😀 I really appreciated a lot your previous help and your guide, you are a nice guy! 😀

Reply 19 of 23, by Joseph_Joestar

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renejr902 wrote on 2020-09-07, 22:46:

Oh my god ! Wow! Im impress ! I followed all your guide carefully. All works perfect! I can't believe how great the music sounds in Doom and King Quest VI. Its much better than Yamaha Opl3 FM synth. I'm really impress. King Quest VI in village play so great its unbelivable ! Thanks so much !

You're welcome. Can you tell me which SBLive model you're using? I'd like to add it to the "confirmed working" model list in my guide.

1. If i buy the awe32, is the default soundfont play as great like sblive with SC-55 soundfont ? im pretty sure not really, but i want your answer 😉 and i have the same question vs Awe64 vs sblive with SC-55 soundfont ! Thanks a lot for answer !

No. By default, an AWE32/64 card uses the 1 MB sample ROM which sounds like this. You can add up to 32 MB RAM to an AWE card, of which 28 MB will be usable for soundfonts. With the extra RAM, you can load any soundfont that is smaller than that, but Patch93's soundfont which I use on the SBLive won't work since it's 45 MB in size.

2. Is a real SC-55 wavetable play exactly like the sblive with SC-55 soundfont ? Thanks for answer.

A real SC-55 will sound better. See Phil's Doom SC-55 video for comparison. I would say that Patch93's soundfont comes fairly close though, but the real thing will always be superior.

3. Is the Sound Blaster live have a real authentic wavetable ? even if its integrated in the card.
(i think its called emu 10k)

No. Unlike the AWE cards, there is no integrated ROM with sound samples on a SBLive. By default, the drivers load one of Creative's soundfonts into memory, but nothing is on the card itself.

4. Does it have any advantage to buy a awe32 or awe64 or a wavetable midi card for my sb16 ct2740 VS using a Sblive with the SC-55 soundfont loaded in it ? ( Could any other sound card option play better or exactly the same quality as my sblive with sc-55 soundfont loaded ? ) Thanks !

The advantage of using a wavetable daughterboard is that you can run games in pure DOS. For the SBLive, soundfont loading works only when running DOS games under the Win98 DOS prompt. As for wavetable daughterboards which can give you sound similar to the SC-55, I know only of this one: New Waveblaster card : Reptile Paradise - Yucatan FX There may be others but I'm not familiar with them.

5. For the 3.5mm cable. Which sound card should has line in and line out ? ( i didnt try using my sblive with my sb ct2740 yet on my P3 933mhz. I will try it later today.) (And about my sb16 ct2770 i keep it for my p233mmx pc build only)

I would try using the line out from the SB16 and plugging that into the line in of the SBLive. However, if that gives you too much background noise, try the reverse.

Thanks so much for your answers ! I'm very interested at that stuff now 😀 I really appreciated a lot your previous help and your guide, you are a nice guy! 😀

No problem! I'm just sharing what I've learned over the years from people on this forum and some other places too.

PC#1: Pentium MMX 166 / Soyo SY-5BT / S3 Trio64V+ / Voodoo1 / YMF719 / AWE64 Gold / SC-155
PC#2: AthlonXP 2100+ / ECS K7VTA3 / Voodoo3 / Audigy2 / Vortex2
PC#3: Athlon64 3400+ / Asus K8V-MX / 5900XT / Audigy2
PC#4: i5-3570K / MSI Z77A-G43 / GTX 970 / X-Fi