VOGONS


First post, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

Greetings everyone

Recently got an MSI ms-6168 which, as you can see, needs some work.
Some caps need replacing, missing heatsink on northbridge, missing heatsink and fan on the voodoo chipset, bios is missing, etc.

I've been reading some stuff: MSI MS-6168 ... is a rebirth possible ? and understand that there's two bios available for this.

Before I start repariring other stuff, I'm in doubt on wich bios to use. Award or AMI? Also, can I just write an eeprom with the bios? If so, what kind of chip should I use?

Thank you!
Note: The board does get power.

Attachments

Reply 1 of 14, by PD2JK

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie

https://de.msi.com/Motherboard/support/MS6168

In the .exe I concluded the following:

The board uses an Award BIOS.
It needs an DIP-32 EPROM from SST or Winbond with a capacity of 256kB (2Mbit / 2048kbit)

The northbridge doesn't need a heatsink per se, but is nice to have. The Voodoo of course, needs to be cooled. Originally it had a heatsink with a fan.
If you create enough airflow, you could stick a larger heatsink on it. It's a shame there aren't any holes around the chip, then you could use something like a Zalman NB47J. Now you have to thermal-glue a heatsink on it. 🙁
Hope the VRAM on that board is okay! Nice project. 😀

Reply 2 of 14, by dionb

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

AMI and Award. The retail BIOS is AMI, the Award BIOS is Packard Bell OEM.

You have slightly more options in the retail BIOS, but some things from the PB Award BIOS aren't in there. Overall, I've not found a pressing reason to use one or the other. Do go for latest version of either for best CPU support.

Here's the latest retail BIOS I could find:
http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=1 … menustate=29,28

As for burning - it's a 2Mb (256kB) image so you need (at least) a 2Mb EEPROM. All the usual suspects should work, when in doubt, just grab a chip from a dead board of similar age and re-use. I have both images flashed onto two chips and swap them out whenever I feel the urge.

Replace the two bad caps, put a heatsink+fan on the Voodoo (it gets *really* hot and there are no mounting holes for the heatsink 🙁 ) and burn a BIOS and you should be good to go. If you want to feel happy, add a low passive heatsink on the 82443BX northbridge, but unlike the Voodoo that's not necessary (unless you want to OC to 133MHz FSB, which I've never gotten stable...)

Reply 3 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 10:53:
AMI and Award. The retail BIOS is AMI, the Award BIOS is Packard Bell OEM. […]
Show full quote

AMI and Award. The retail BIOS is AMI, the Award BIOS is Packard Bell OEM.

You have slightly more options in the retail BIOS, but some things from the PB Award BIOS aren't in there. Overall, I've not found a pressing reason to use one or the other. Do go for latest version of either for best CPU support.

Here's the latest retail BIOS I could find:
http://vogonsdrivers.com/getfile.php?fileid=1 … menustate=29,28

As for burning - it's a 2Mb (256kB) image so you need (at least) a 2Mb EEPROM. All the usual suspects should work, when in doubt, just grab a chip from a dead board of similar age and re-use. I have both images flashed onto two chips and swap them out whenever I feel the urge.

Replace the two bad caps, put a heatsink+fan on the Voodoo (it gets *really* hot and there are no mounting holes for the heatsink 🙁 ) and burn a BIOS and you should be good to go. If you want to feel happy, add a low passive heatsink on the 82443BX northbridge, but unlike the Voodoo that's not necessary (unless you want to OC to 133MHz FSB, which I've never gotten stable...)

I can use one from another mobo? I've tried, but I have to tell the programer which chip I'm using and i honestly don't know.

Reply 4 of 14, by dionb

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:27:

I can use one from another mobo? I've tried, but I have to tell the programer which chip I'm using and i honestly don't know.

Look on the top of the chip, it's normally written there.

Reply 5 of 14, by Deksor

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t

I don't think you can use a bios from another board if that's what you mean, because the bios here must be containing the voodoo 3 bios.
For the chip however you can definitely use one from another board. You can try to guess the type of ROM, check the id (which will probably fail but will report you the rom's id) and then search for a rom with this id.

Or you can pull off the sticker on the EPROM.

Trying to identify old hardware ? Visit Ultimate Hardware 2019

Reply 6 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:39:
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:27:

I can use one from another mobo? I've tried, but I have to tell the programer which chip I'm using and i honestly don't know.

Look on the top of the chip, it's normally written there.

Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software.
I think I can say the bios is written. I guess.

Of course nothing happens with the machine 🙁

Attachments

Reply 7 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
PD2JK wrote on 2020-09-15, 10:11:
https://de.msi.com/Motherboard/support/MS6168 […]
Show full quote

https://de.msi.com/Motherboard/support/MS6168

In the .exe I concluded the following:

The board uses an Award BIOS.
It needs an DIP-32 EPROM from SST or Winbond with a capacity of 256kB (2Mbit / 2048kbit)

The northbridge doesn't need a heatsink per se, but is nice to have. The Voodoo of course, needs to be cooled. Originally it had a heatsink with a fan.
If you create enough airflow, you could stick a larger heatsink on it. It's a shame there aren't any holes around the chip, then you could use something like a Zalman NB47J. Now you have to thermal-glue a heatsink on it. 🙁
Hope the VRAM on that board is okay! Nice project. 😀

I have some thermal "stickers" also from zalman which I can use for that.

Reply 8 of 14, by dionb

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 12:13:
Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software. I think I can say the bios is writ […]
Show full quote
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:39:
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:27:

I can use one from another mobo? I've tried, but I have to tell the programer which chip I'm using and i honestly don't know.

Look on the top of the chip, it's normally written there.

Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software.
I think I can say the bios is written. I guess.

Of course nothing happens with the machine 🙁

29C010A is a 1Mb (128kB) EEPROM, so no way will a 2Mb image fit on it.

Reply 9 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 13:09:
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 12:13:
Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software. I think I can say the bios is writ […]
Show full quote
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:39:

Look on the top of the chip, it's normally written there.

Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software.
I think I can say the bios is written. I guess.

Of course nothing happens with the machine 🙁

29C010A is a 1Mb (128kB) EEPROM, so no way will a 2Mb image fit on it.

Crap. Looking for more.

Reply 10 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 13:09:
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 12:13:
Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software. I think I can say the bios is writ […]
Show full quote
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 11:39:

Look on the top of the chip, it's normally written there.

Ahh, I've found one from another mobo. A AT29C010A and I got this on my programer's software.
I think I can say the bios is written. I guess.

Of course nothing happens with the machine 🙁

29C010A is a 1Mb (128kB) EEPROM, so no way will a 2Mb image fit on it.

Have six donors but, according to google, they're all 128k.

Would something like this do? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ti-TMS27C020-12-25 … EEAAOSw-v5eMAGs
Those recognized by my programmer.

Reply 11 of 14, by dionb

User metadata
Rank l33t
Rank
l33t
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 13:29:
[...] […]
Show full quote

[...]

Have six donors but, according to google, they're all 128k.

Would something like this do? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Atmel-AT28C256-15P … mAAAOSwcp9ezkfB

Edit:
That's a 28dip. Nevermind

It's also 256kb, not 256kB. Don't mess up bits and Bytes with these things 😮

Look for something like the Winbond W29C020C instead.

Reply 12 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 14:28:
DeckardGames wrote on 2020-09-15, 13:29:
[...] […]
Show full quote

[...]

Have six donors but, according to google, they're all 128k.

Would something like this do? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Atmel-AT28C256-15P … mAAAOSwcp9ezkfB

Edit:
That's a 28dip. Nevermind

It's also 256kb, not 256kB. Don't mess up bits and Bytes with these things 😮

Look for something like the Winbond W29C020C instead.

Found these:

90B - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/W29C020C-90B-INTEG … BkAAOSwX61ZDIHT
90Z - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/W29C020C-90Z-WINBO … xQAAOSwpDdU7c3B

UV - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ti-TMS27C020-12-25 … EEAAOSw-v5eMAGs

Reply 14 of 14, by DeckardGames

User metadata
Rank Newbie
Rank
Newbie
dionb wrote on 2020-09-15, 15:20:

Steep prices, but the 90Z looks decent. Don't do the UV unless you have a UV chip eraser handy...

Check whether your programmer supports it though...

Going to order a few 90Z.
Thank you all for the help.

I'll be back with news within a few days.