Bad 2D performance \ VOGONS

Bad 2D performance

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First post, by Flameboi420

Posted on 2021-01-28, 07:45

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So over the past year or so I've been working on building a bit of an oddball windows 98 machine. It used to have a Matrox Millennium graphics card with 2 MB of RAM and when i tried to run some newer (2D) games on it they ran like crap. Games like Civ 3 and Stronghold. So initially i chalked it up to the 2D card just sucking so I recently upgraded it to an 8 MB Diamond Stealth III PCI and i went to start these games... and they still run like CRAP. the machine works for 3D games alright it has a Voodoo 2 12 MB (the diamond variation) but i can't seem to get those pesky 2D games to run well if at all. They seem to run fine in XP but its kind of annoying to switch between 98 and XP and I'd rather have 1 installation of Windows. Specifications of machine are as follows
Pentium III 933 MHz
Diamond Stealth III PCi 8 MB
Soundblaster Live! sound card
Voodoo 2 12 MB
256 MB of RAM

Reply 1 of 6, by Cyberdyne

Posted on 2021-01-28, 08:01

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S3 Savage should have a very compatible and fast 2D performance, and even decent 3D performance especially for those S3TC games.

So the problem lies elswhere. Maybe driver or Direct X problems.

I am aroused about any X86 motherboard that has full functional ISA slot. I think i have problem. Not really into that original (Turbo) XT,286,386 and CGA/EGA stuff. So just a DOS nut.
PS. If I upload RAR, it is a 16-bit DOS RAR Version 2.50.

Reply 2 of 6, by Flameboi420

Posted on 2021-01-28, 08:56

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Cyberdyne wrote on 2021-01-28, 08:01:

S3 Savage should have a very compatible and fast 2D performance, and even decent 3D performance especially for those S3TC games.

So the problem lies elswhere. Maybe driver or Direct X problems.

i have tried a couple of different drivers with no luck
i haven't tried reinstalling windows yet but i might try that. Another thing is would this have anything to do with it being PCi. I'm pretty sure i heard somewhere bandwidth is shared across PCi slots and maybe that has something to do with it?

Reply 3 of 6, by Cyberdyne

Posted on 2021-01-28, 10:03

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Nope, with these cards, PCI is not a big bottleneck.

Reply 4 of 6, by dionb

Posted on 2021-01-28, 11:02

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So, two different OS on same hardware give very different results. That means it's almost certainly driver related. Trying a completely different card (and VGA drivers) didn't help, so that's ruled out VGA as cause.

One thing missing from specs: which chipset does this system have? Have the chipset drivers been installed, more specifically DMA-supporting drivers for the IDE controller?

This could well be missing Via 4-in-1/Hyperion drivers under Win98SE. One potential issue there if that's the case: you really should install the 4-in-1 before any other drivers in the system, otherwise performance and stability issues may ensue, so you might need to reinstall. But before doing any of that, double-check full specs. It could still be something else.

Reply 5 of 6, by Flameboi420

Posted on 2021-01-28, 17:34

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dionb wrote on 2021-01-28, 11:02:

So, two different OS on same hardware give very different results. That means it's almost certainly driver related. Trying a completely different card (and VGA drivers) didn't help, so that's ruled out VGA as cause.

One thing missing from specs: which chipset does this system have? Have the chipset drivers been installed, more specifically DMA-supporting drivers for the IDE controller?

This could well be missing Via 4-in-1/Hyperion drivers under Win98SE. One potential issue there if that's the case: you really should install the 4-in-1 before any other drivers in the system, otherwise performance and stability issues may ensue, so you might need to reinstall. But before doing any of that, double-check full specs. It could still be something else.

Ok full specs
MS-6368 VER:5 Motherboard with
3 PCi Slots
1 ISA slot
VIA VT860T chipset
Edit here i was wrong thats the video chip the chipset is actually VIA Apollo PLE133 / VIA VT82C686B
2 RAM Slots
Pentium III 933 MHz
1 256 MB Stick of RAM
1 Floppy Disk Drive
1 DvD combo drive
1 Zip Drive
2 Mechanical IDE hard disks
Diamond Stealth III 8 MB
Voodoo 2 12 MB
Soundblaster Live!

I'll have to check if i have the chipset drivers installed i probably don't but if anyone has the link to them that would be handy

Last edited by Flameboi420 on 2021-01-28, 22:43. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 6 of 6, by Flameboi420

Posted on 2021-01-28, 17:50

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Flameboi420 wrote on 2021-01-28, 17:34:
Ok full specs MS-6368 VER:5 Motherboard with 3 PCi Slots 1 ISA slot VIA VT860T chipset 2 RAM Slots Pentium III 933 MHz 1 256 MB […]
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dionb wrote on 2021-01-28, 11:02:

So, two different OS on same hardware give very different results. That means it's almost certainly driver related. Trying a completely different card (and VGA drivers) didn't help, so that's ruled out VGA as cause.

One thing missing from specs: which chipset does this system have? Have the chipset drivers been installed, more specifically DMA-supporting drivers for the IDE controller?

This could well be missing Via 4-in-1/Hyperion drivers under Win98SE. One potential issue there if that's the case: you really should install the 4-in-1 before any other drivers in the system, otherwise performance and stability issues may ensue, so you might need to reinstall. But before doing any of that, double-check full specs. It could still be something else.

Ok full specs
MS-6368 VER:5 Motherboard with
3 PCi Slots
1 ISA slot
VIA VT860T chipset
2 RAM Slots
Pentium III 933 MHz
1 256 MB Stick of RAM
1 Floppy Disk Drive
1 DvD combo drive
1 Zip Drive
2 Mechanical IDE hard disks
Diamond Stealth III 8 MB
Voodoo 2 12 MB
Soundblaster Live!

I'll have to check if i have the chipset drivers installed i probably don't but if anyone has the link to them that would be handy

ok so i actually checked again in device manager at the hard disk controllers and this is what i saw
Primary IDE controller (dual fifo)
Secondary IDE controller (dual fifo)
VIA Bus Master PCI IDE Controller
so i have those drivers installed i think

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