VOGONS


First post, by WJG6260

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

Hello everyone,

I've been reading this forum for years and finally managed to start something of a collection of my own. Amidst my growing interest in general old hardware things-mostly spurned by wanting to just learn more generally about computer hardware and electronics-I recently purchased an FX-3000 motherboard. I know Phil and some other members have discussed this board in pretty great depth, but I've had some weird quirks with mine since the start and wanted to ask for some general advice. For reference, it's this board: https://stason.org/TULARC/pc/motherboards/E/E … 86-US-3486.html

This is and was my first 386 board of any kind; nearly all of my experience is with 486s and their associated boards.

When I purchased the board, the seller described it as being new. I'm under the impression he was either correct, or that the board was used only very slightly. What's strange is that the original bios that the board came with was an AMIBIOS dated sometime in 1990. It, however, seemed incorrect for the board and a better match for the ECS US 3486, as it had settings for an OPTi chipset. Further, it only recognized the first 640k of RAM, no matter how many varying configuration I tried and how many different 30-pin SIMMs I used. I grabbed an EEPROM and flashed it with the bios from Phil's board, and then later tried the MR-Bios. I found the MR-Bios extremely preferable.

I've been tinkering with older parts for a while, but managed to make a mistake while testing out the board. I popped in an 80mhz oscillator, and decided to try the board with my 386DX-40. I have relatively poor eyesight, and managed to assume that the white triangle on the end of my 386DX-40 was the corner for pins A and 1. I did not notice, until the board just would not boot, that the markings were on the opposite end. I powered the board down, turned the CPU around and tried again. The 80mhz oscillator was quite hot to the touch, so much so that I let it cool off, removed it, and popped in another that I had. I had a POST card in the machine, and it just read "---," so I presumed the board might be dead.

But I then tried my TI 486DLC at 33mhz, with a 66mhz oscillator, and it POSTed! The memory count was accurate, and everything worked. I did some stress testing, and surely enough there were no issues there either. I powered the board down again, popped in a Cyrix Fasmath Cx83D87-40P, and that worked too. I then switched back to the 386DX-40, and, sure enough, it posted at 33mhz.

After testing various other configurations, it seems that the board POSTs just fine and operates with any combination of 386 and 387 or with any 486 with an oscillator less than 80mhz.

I'm suspecting-but not certain-that I may have damaged an internal trace in the board, especially given the heat from the oscillator. In that case, I am okay with the outcome, seeing as the board works at 33mhz or less, and seems perfectly suited for use there.

That being said, I'd love to get it working at 40mhz. Any and all thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated!

I've attached a few photos for reference. There should be one of each CPU I tried, and the board as it sits now. I put it away temporarily, so there's nothing attached to it at the moment.

Thank you all again for all of your help!

Attachments

-Live Long and Prosper-

Feel free to check out my YouTube and Twitter!

Reply 1 of 6, by DNSDies

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

You've tried with a different 80mhz oscillator, right?
The heat from that short possible ruined the clock crystal.
Since you can post at 33mhz with a different crystal, I'd try getting a new 80mhz one.
The CPU may be damaged too, since if you did have it in the opposite orientation, you created a short circuit.

That the board was posting and running on a different CPU and crystal shows that the board itself likely survived.

Reply 2 of 6, by WJG6260

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
DNSDies wrote on 2021-02-01, 22:05:
You've tried with a different 80mhz oscillator, right? The heat from that short possible ruined the clock crystal. Since you can […]
Show full quote

You've tried with a different 80mhz oscillator, right?
The heat from that short possible ruined the clock crystal.
Since you can post at 33mhz with a different crystal, I'd try getting a new 80mhz one.
The CPU may be damaged too, since if you did have it in the opposite orientation, you created a short circuit.

That the board was posting and running on a different CPU and crystal shows that the board itself likely survived.

Hey, thank you so much for responding!

I did indeed try another 80mhz oscillator. Actually, I tried a bunch of them, and none of them got hot or anything, but I still couldn’t seem to get the board to POST.

I do think the CPU being damaged is an interesting angle, and it’s one I certainly didn’t consider. However, I couldn’t get the TI 486DLC to POST at 40mhz, either. Could that be related?

I am not entirely sure if the model I have is 40mhz-capable, however, as it isn’t speed-graded and I haven’t found many others quite like it. I was under the impression that, perhaps, if I were to run it at 40mhz, it might at worst be an overclock. Is it possible that the chip just won’t post at 40mhz? That would agree with your suspicions and narrow it down to my 386DX-40 being the issue, which I absolutely could see.

Once again, I really appreciate all the help and the reply! Thanks again DNSDies!

-Live Long and Prosper-

Feel free to check out my YouTube and Twitter!

Reply 3 of 6, by DNSDies

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member

I have an FX-3000 as well, and it works fine with an AMD 40mhz 386 processor, but not any 486 processor I've tried.
If you reversed the position of the 386, then you definitely shorted it, since pin A1 is VSS, and the pin the the opposite corner is ground.
If you can, try another processor.

Before that, though, I'd grab a pinout of the 386 socket and check for any shorts, just in case you did fry something elsewhere on the board. Can't tell from your pictures.

Reply 4 of 6, by WJG6260

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
DNSDies wrote on 2021-02-01, 22:45:
I have an FX-3000 as well, and it works fine with an AMD 40mhz 386 processor, but not any 486 processor I've tried. If you rever […]
Show full quote

I have an FX-3000 as well, and it works fine with an AMD 40mhz 386 processor, but not any 486 processor I've tried.
If you reversed the position of the 386, then you definitely shorted it, since pin A1 is VSS, and the pin the the opposite corner is ground.
If you can, try another processor.

Before that, though, I'd grab a pinout of the 386 socket and check for any shorts, just in case you did fry something elsewhere on the board. Can't tell from your pictures.

Interesting! I had a DX2-66 going too, and it worked in the 486 socket. I wonder why yours doesn't like 486s. I actually saw someone else on here mention that their FX-3000 had something similar going on with 486s.

I'll definitely grab a pinout and check for shorts. This may be a dumb question, but how would be the best way to check for shorts? I have a decent multimeter, so would it be a matter of checking for continuity?

I suppose it might be worth grabbing another 386DX-40 and seeing where that leads.

Thank you again for all your help!

-Live Long and Prosper-

Feel free to check out my YouTube and Twitter!

Reply 5 of 6, by pshipkov

User metadata
Rank Oldbie
Rank
Oldbie

This board model can tick at 50MHz.
It is highly unlikely you damaged the crystal oscillator but putting it the wrong way. It will get hot, but that's it.
If two separate CPUs refuse to POST at 40MHz then you should look at RAM and SRAM as the possible culprits.

retro bits and bytes

Reply 6 of 6, by WJG6260

User metadata
Rank Member
Rank
Member
pshipkov wrote on 2021-02-02, 02:15:

This board model can tick at 50MHz.
It is highly unlikely you damaged the crystal oscillator but putting it the wrong way. It will get hot, but that's it.
If two separate CPUs refuse to POST at 40MHz then you should look at RAM and SRAM as the possible culprits.

Thanks for the suggestion pshipkov!

Jeez, 50mhz!? Wow, that’s quite an overclock for a 386! I don’t actually have any 100mhz oscillators, but I’m considering getting a few now to give that a try, just for sheer curiosity’s sake.

I’ve tried a few variations of RAM and, at the moment, am running the board cache-less. The best 30-pin SIMMs I have are 9-chip 4mb sticks, rated for 60ns. I’ve tried those and they still don’t seem to work. Unfortunately, I’m not too familiar with 386s overall. Are there any particular types of 30-pin SIMM that would be optimal for 40mhz, as far as timings/ratings go?

Thanks again for your help! I’ll keep trying some different SIMMs and see what I can come up with.

-Live Long and Prosper-

Feel free to check out my YouTube and Twitter!