VOGONS


The "Tweener"

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First post, by viper32cm

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I need some help figuring out what to do with my Socket 7 Pentium 100 system: 16MB ram, 2GB HDD, S3 Trio 64V+, Aztech Sound Galaxy, and 256KB of asynch cash.

I'm currently running Dos 6.22 and Windows 3.11 on it. This is a very similar configuration to what I had in the computer my family bought in the summary of 1995, right before Windows 95 came out. It's blazing fast with Windows 3.x.

However, in my collection, it's sandwiched between a 486DX/33 running Dos 6.2 and Win 3.1 and a P233MMX running Windows 95. Anything that the 486 can't do that well, the P233 can handle better than the P100. Anything that the P233 is too fast for, the P100 is too fast for as well.

The best idea I've had is running the earliest version of Win95 I can get my hands on--RTM preferably. I run Win95 OSR2.5 on my P233, and it's definitely a much better experience than what I can recall from early Windows 95. So having early Windows 95 could be interesting, I guess. In conjunction with early Wind0ws 95 I guess I could try playing around with earlier 3d accelerators. I run a TNT in my P233, so something like a Rendition card or a Riva 128 in the P100 could be interesting but likely significantly under utilized.

So is there anything that these early Pentiums are particularly well suited for, or are they somewhat of a "tweener" CPU, not quite advanced nor quite old enough to merit use over their immediate predecessors and successors?

Reply 1 of 9, by chinny22

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Differences in the the Win95 revisions are pretty minor when all said and done, but it does give you an excuse.

What I like to do with PC's in this situation is mix the hardware up a bit with a different sound and video card.
Dos based Pentium is good bases for this, giving you access to S3D or Matrox M3D based games
3D Accelerated Games List (Proprietary APIs - No 3DFX/Direct3D)

Reply 2 of 9, by Pierre32

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Yep, familiar with the conundrum, and I agree with chinny22. I have a P200, and also a P166 I found on the street which I restored and got quite attached to. The P200's schtick is DOS Glide gaming. So the P166 runs W95 for something different, and will likely receive a Virge GX that I picked up recently.

Reply 3 of 9, by gerry

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giving them different 'roles' is indeed the way to go as suggested

in your case i'd dedicate the 486/33 to win 31. and dos, the p233mmx to gaming glory, getting all the best hardware, and the p100 would be for interesting applications of the era, some programming tools and the like

I'd actually go with win 95osr on the p100 and win98se on the p233 provided that had 64 or more mb ram, then also get a different OS each power on 😀

I have quite a few repeat computers, as example two almost identical Duron 800's. So one is win 98se with a geforce 4 and some games, the other has win XP, more ram but a modest graphics card and is full of applications rather than games.

there are more adventurous things too, going on line with esoteric OSes and so on, many things are possible

Reply 4 of 9, by dionb

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I've moved up and down the range a bit with my primary DOS system, from DX4-100 to P3-1400S, and from trying to lump every bit of sound hardware together to reducing it to two or three cards per machine.

Right now I've just split it, with a high-end P3-600 with AWE64, GUS and (because I *really* can't get my EWS64XL to play ball) an Aztech SBPro2 compatible card with bug-free MPU-401. It's overkill, but runs anything DOS that needs speed.
Underneath that is a 486SX-33 (actually an UMC U5S) with SB1.0 replica, SSI-2001 replica and a Roland MPU401AT for MIDI (including an MT-32).

Still I'm hitting some games that are problematic, that don't like 600MHz and 64MB RAM but need more than 33MHz and 4MB. P100 would be great for things like Colonization, Dune and Descent.

Reply 5 of 9, by AlexZ

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Pentium III 600 slows down to about 386DX33 speed when cache is disabled. Some DOS games that crash in DOS (e.g Command & Conquer, Nascar 2) work from Windows 98. Most games that require much slower CPU work fine at 386DX33 speed. I was surprised how many old games work correctly at full speed. Pentium III is a perfect retro rig.

Pentium 100 will be of very limited use if you have 233. I would probably sell it as it's nothing special. That would leave room for another generation like 386DX/40.

Pentium III 900E, ECS P6BXT-A+, 384MB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce FX 5600 128MB, Voodoo 2 12MB, 80GB HDD, Yamaha SM718 ISA, 19" AOC 9GlrA
Athlon 64 3400+, MSI K8T Neo V, 1GB RAM, NVIDIA GeForce 7600GT 512MB, 250GB HDD, Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS

Reply 6 of 9, by drosse1meyer

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I too have 430HX board laying around with a spare p100 and p166.... (have another P233 that I use for Win9x/DOS gaming)... I've been trying to come up with something to use it for, aside from troubleshooting parts, which it's not that great at as it doesnt support MMX and many 3d accelerator cards... 🙁

Let us know what you decide to do with yours!

Last edited by drosse1meyer on 2021-09-20, 21:16. Edited 1 time in total.

P1: Packard Bell - 233 MMX, Voodoo1, 64 MB, ALS100+
P2-V2: Dell Dimension - 400 Mhz, Voodoo2, 256 MB
P!!! Custom: 1 Ghz, GeForce2 Pro/64MB, 384 MB

Reply 7 of 9, by Gmlb256

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Most people here have 486 computers for nostalgia reasons which I'm not even attached to. You can use SetMul with the P233MMX for disabling the L1 cache and playing with the TR12 registers for additional slowdown and the special L1DX parameter, which disables the L1 cache but makes other program think that it's still enabled. The slowest speed that I could achieve was around 386DX-40 with everything disabled including the motherboard cache.

I think that the P100 CPU computer could be used for special purposes such as using the Rendition card out of curiosity or better compatibility with DOS due to the S3 Trio64V+ video card.

VIA C3 Nehemiah 1.2A @ 1.46 GHz | ASUS P2-99 | 256 MB PC133 SDRAM | GeForce3 Ti 200 64 MB | Voodoo2 12 MB | SBLive! | AWE64 | SBPro2 | GUS

Reply 8 of 9, by viper32cm

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Thanks, everyone. Here's another factor in all of this. My P100 has the Opti Viper chipset. I've heard on here that it sucks, and my experience is that it's a bear to get working in Win98 due to a driver issue with the IDE controller. However, I've never been able to quantify how much it sucks. Is it only a few percentage points difference or is it something that's going to suck all the life out of an early 3d card?

I'm kind of partial to the idea of using the P100 as an alternative platform for another early 3d card. I have a P200 chip that will run in it, so maybe in conjunction with my P233MMX I could have one with Voodoo Graphics and either my RIVA TNT or S3 Trio and then the other with a Rendition card or other early graphics card.

Reply 9 of 9, by BitWrangler

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You should worry, I'm having trouble reducing myself to at least 10% clockspeed differences 🤣 ... well here's my ramblings on that subject in general.... Some logical basis for refining the collection, E3 series, 1-2-5 series, slowest, middle, fastest... in that scheme I'm figuring on 3 per generation, which is still a lot, and tops and bottoms overlap, hence why I call it a first pass. The bottom of my Pentiums would be a P60, so middle would be P120-133 then top as top can go would be a 200 (P54) But you'd see there that P60 is probably matched by a DX-120 and P200 might be unnecessary next to a P166MMX.. but I've got all most all of everything here to mess with already and pick from, and get running to decide what feels different enough. Then eventually the pile will turn into a collection, discerningly curated, rather than being whatever old junk I happen to have.

Unicorn herding operations are proceeding, but all the totes of hens teeth and barrels of rocking horse poop give them plenty of hiding spots.