VOGONS


First post, by Cyber Akuma

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I have been trying to figure out what to do in terms of being able to read/write my old floppy disks on newer systems as well as use said drive to image and create boot disks for my older systems.

I originally thought that I could just buy one of those hundreds of cheap USB Floppy drives on Amazon and be done with it, but now I am hearing that they are pretty poor in terms of what they support and most will pretty much only read standard 1.44 disks as if they were a USB drive and that's it.

Are there any of those that support both 1.44 and 720? Can I even use these to make an image from a floppy disk, or even write an image to a floppy disk, or are these purely designed for just reading data off your old 1.44 floppies and nothing else?

My second option that I saw was many people recommending some older models before all of these cheap clones exploded everywhere, but they haven't been made for years so I would have to rely on getting them used somewhere, and it's not clear if they also support any of this. I saw these models commonly mentioned:

DELL FDDM-101: This one seems like the cheapest and easiest option. I was confused at first why this was mentioned because it looks like it's just a slimline laptop drive. But apparently it has a mini-usb port on the side and you can use it as an (albeit a bit janky/ugly) external just by plugging it into USB? I saw an enclosure for some of them so I am not sure if that enclosure is required or not. And if you would need external power if you use the bare drive without an enclosure (assuming I didn't mis-understand that the bare drive has a USB port on it). I also heard some others say that their Dell drives could NOT read 720 floppies, although I also saw this model specifically mentioned as being able to. Anyone have any idea about this drive?

NEC UF0002: Another one I saw mentioned. Seems to be a bit pricier than others on eBay, but I can't find any other information about if it will work or not.

LS120: Saw these mentioned several times, and they will supposedly read 720 and 1.44 on top of superdisks. But it's hard to find a drive at all, much less external USB ones. And when I can, they seem like the most expensive option by far. Did the slimline ones for laptops by any chance also have a USB port on them like that Dell model I mentioned? Or do I have to get an external one?

HP DP353FUE: Another one I saw talked about... but I could not find any information on it, or even find it on eBay at all.

SmartDisk FDUSB-TM2: This one seems popular... too popular. I saw several on eBay in different colors, so I am worried if this was also popular to make cheap crappy clones out of at the time. On top of that, supposedly depending which drive was used as it's internals would matter if it works with 720 disks or not?

And my third nuclear option would be to just get this device I saw talked about called a GreaseWeazle that's supposed to read and write EVERYTHING.... supposedly. This would be the most expensive option by far since on top of getting the device that would cost me anywhere from $36-46 after shipping, I would need to still attach my own floppy drive to it, and I am not sure if I have any spare old floppy drives lying around anymore.

On top of that, it's not clear if you can really use this for standard IBM PC floppy disks. It's supposedly supposed to work through multiple formats, but every single video I tried to look up about it was shown using it to read/write Amiga disks. Is this thing only for Amiga? Or would it work for IBM PC formatted disks too?

It also presents me with the opposite issue I have with the USB drives I mentioned. I have no idea if this device will even let you browse a disk and read/write files as if they were a USB drive.... or if it ONLY lets you create images of the disks or write images to them, not mount the disk as a drive and use it in Windows.

So I am not sure which of any of these three options will work for me, the cheaper USB drives on Amazon, trying to hunt down specific models of older USB floppy drives, or using a GreaseWeazle. Can anyone help give me some advice on this?

Reply 1 of 10, by Joakim

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I have two IBM usb drives I use sometimes for copying drivers and such when usb sticks is not an option or I'm feeling nostalgic for that floppy sound. Reliability seems good to me but floppies are floppies if you know what I mean. I have not tried to write 720kb disks but I could try.

I'm no expert but I would not buy the modern variants. I doubt these old usb had a lot of milage anyway. I think I bought mine for 5-15$ and they are like new.

Curious, what system do you have that only has a 720 kb drive? Ibm ps1 comes to mind.

Reply 3 of 10, by Horun

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Back a year or so ago same question came up and had a lot of good answers: USB Floppy
Reading/writing a 720k is easier than formatting one on a good USB floppy and there are other factors involved such as OS support
I use a Win7 machine for reading old 720k disks off the USB floppy drives that support 720k, the Win10 box has some issues with them for some reason.....but is probably just it's hardware.

Hate posting a reply and then have to edit it because it made no sense 😁 First computer was an IBM 3270 workstation with CGA monitor. Stuff: https://archive.org/details/@horun

Reply 4 of 10, by Rocket202

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i have an usb floppy drive, i bough it like 10 years ago, never used too much untill now, im using it to make bootable disk and sometimes transfer files in my main pc for my retro pc, it works good.
Is 3rd brand "freecon" (never seen this brand in my life), anyway is good, is really better than the crap one i have installed in the retro pc, less noise (a lot less).
The only objection is it came with 3-4 floppy disks included and they did not work.

Im using the tool rawwritewin-0.7 and its like Mission impossible autoself dectruction, because everytime i make a bootable disk, the next time it didnt work. I have to delete the program and extract it again to have a fresh one. No idea if its related to the OS version, is not prepared for windows 11. I dont think is a problem related to the drive.

Reply 5 of 10, by Pierre32

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I have an IBM USB floppy drive, which seems to have read/write issues when the disk is near capacity. It's like it's safe to fill it to 1.2MB, but beware from there.

I started using a clunkier but way more reliable method. mTCP running FTPSRV on my 386, Filezilla on the modern rig, and do it all over the network. Biggest external floppy drive ever! But I can also do 5.25's that way 😁

Reply 6 of 10, by mbbrutman

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Ouch. I hate it when people describe FTP as clunky:

  • FTP is cross platform; it works on anything from personal computers to mainframes.
  • FTP is routable beyond your home network. You can connect to servers all across the world.
  • The FTP server you are using in particular supports multiple concurrent connections, a flexible user permission model, and squeezes a lot of performance out of the machine.

Let's be thankful that elephants can be taught to dance. ;-0

Reply 7 of 10, by Pierre32

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mbbrutman wrote on 2022-08-15, 02:33:
Ouch. I hate it when people describe FTP as clunky: […]
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Ouch. I hate it when people describe FTP as clunky:

  • FTP is cross platform; it works on anything from personal computers to mainframes.
  • FTP is routable beyond your home network. You can connect to servers all across the world.
  • The FTP server you are using in particular supports multiple concurrent connections, a flexible user permission model, and squeezes a lot of performance out of the machine.

Let's be thankful that elephants can be taught to dance. ;-0

Ha, didn't mean it that way! I meant that using an entire, running 386 as an external floppy drive was clunky compared to a USB drive.

The software part of the equation is beautiful magic - and bulletproof in my experience doing this. Love your work 😉

Reply 8 of 10, by Demo85

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Forgive me for hijacking this thread but I'm also looking for a way to get floppy drives to work with USB. I'm really only worried about 1.44 floppies to use with DOS and Win9x systems. I really want to get an internal floppy drive to work over USB with a Win10/XP dual boot sleeper PC that doesn't have a 34pin floppy header. I bought one of them 34pin to USB floppy adapters on Amazon and while that shows up when plugged in as A drive and reports as a floppy drive. It won't read any known good disks with a known good drive, you hear the drive being accessed but it just says the disk is unreadable after 20 or so seconds but when the drive and disk are used with my 98 computer with native floppy support the read and write fine. The adapter seem to work for other people going by reviews so I either got a bad unit or the handful of drives I have lying around don't work with the adapter. Before I try another one from Amazon I see OP talking about GreaseWeazle, looking into that it seems way more advanced then what I'm looking for but I can't seem to tell if it has a mode to work the same way the cheapo floppy to USB adapters work, as in just reports the drive to Windows and lets me open the disks via file explore, does it work that way or does it need some sort of specialty application to access the disks? If GreaseWeazle can't work that way is their any other options I should look into outside the cheap no name brand adapters on Amazon?

Thanks!

Reply 9 of 10, by Cyber Akuma

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Horun wrote on 2022-08-14, 23:24:

Back a year or so ago same question came up and had a lot of good answers: USB Floppy
Reading/writing a 720k is easier than formatting one on a good USB floppy and there are other factors involved such as OS support
I use a Win7 machine for reading old 720k disks off the USB floppy drives that support 720k, the Win10 box has some issues with them for some reason.....but is probably just it's hardware.

Yeah, that's one of the threads I based my post on, as well as several Reddit threads as well on retro/vintage computing. I wasn't able to figure out a definitive answer from what I tried to research as people seemed to just either only suggest one of the three solutions I mentioned or toss out random models of drives they used. There wasn't much debate or discussion on any specific method or models. I was hoping to try to get a bit more definitive information than just trying random models and methods.

Reply 10 of 10, by mbbrutman

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Pierre32 wrote on 2022-08-15, 02:44:

Ha, didn't mean it that way! I meant that using an entire, running 386 as an external floppy drive was clunky compared to a USB drive.

The software part of the equation is beautiful magic - and bulletproof in my experience doing this. Love your work 😉

Oh, I'll give you that, but that is the "Tweener" or "Mothership" machine problem, isn't it?

I have to keep the following "network floppy drives" around:

  • 386-40: 360KB 5.25 floppy, 1.44MB 3.5 floppy, and sometimes a parallel port Zip drive
  • Pentium 233: 1.44MB floppy, IDE Zip, TR-4 tape drive
  • PC XT: 360KB 5.25 floppy, Bernoulli Box 10 and 20MB drives
  • Pentium 133: 1.44MB, floppy, 1.2MB floppy

(All of these machines have other similar uses too, like IDE controllers or SCSI controllers ...)