VOGONS


First post, by mrfusion92

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I have 3 main systems currently.

  1. System One
    MB: Abit VH6T
    CPU: Celeron 1300 (Tualatin)
    RAM: 512 MB
    GPU: Nvidia Geforce MX 440 + Voodoo2 8MB
    Sound: SB Live!
    The idea behind this build is to have the best Windows 98 computer for late 2000 games without losing much DOS compatibility.
  2. System Two
    MB: Jamicon 566A (or SuperPower A586B)
    CPU: AMD K6-2 450Mhz
    RAM: 256MB
    GPU: Matrox Millennium G200 8MB
    Sound: SB16 Vibra
    I wanted a PC with a K6 with I never had back in the days. I'm not sure that the GPU is the best choice.
  3. System Three
    MB: Ford Lian TX-5IB2
    CPU: Pentium MMX 233Mhz
    RAM: 64MB
    GPU: S3 Virge/DX
    Sound: SB16 Vibra
    I'm very happy with this build too. I'm currently seeking for a Voodoo1 and maybe a better sound card, then this build should be complete.

And I have other hardware on the loose.

Graphic cards (all AGP):

  • Voodoo3 3000
  • Nvidia Geforce FX 5200 Ultra
  • Nvidia Geforce Quadro4 980 XGL
  • Nvidia Geforce 6600 GT
  • ATI 3D Rage Pro 4MB

Motherboards and\or CPUs:

My major questions are:

  • Can I improve the first system? I know the 6600GT is the most powerful but I also know that it breaks most DOS games. Should I keep the Abit with the Celeron or the Biostar M7VIZ with an Athlon XP would be better?
  • Does make sense have the Voodoo2 in first system? Is better use a glide wrapper and put the Voodoo2 in another system?
  • I want the Voodoo3 in active service but I don't know what other components it should be paired with.
  • What GPU can I put in the second system while remaining period accurate? I'm not interested in the *best* gpu, just a good one. Perhaps the Voodoo3?

Yes, I know that those systems are mostly redundant and I may just go with the first system. And indeed that is the only retro PC I have always ready to be used.
The others are just for the joy of have bits of history I have missed.

Reply 1 of 6, by chinny22

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I think you have it about right.

I agree the 6600 GT doesn't make much sense in a S370 P3 Out of your existing cards I'd keep it as is. Voodoo 2 is fine in this rig as it gives you glide support real hardware is cooler then nglide and sli is sexy.
You could switch for the FX5200 for a marginal improvement but if the MX440 is performing fine I'd not bother.

You could put the Voodoo 3 in system 2 and use this as your primary glide PC. The V3 has great dos compatibility and just about all glide games will be fine on a 450Mhz computer and for the few that don't you have PC1

PC3 is also fine even the SB16, but as you already have another PC with the same card I'd agree something different makes sense.

Reply 2 of 6, by dionb

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System 1 is clear, and seems very fit for the purpose.

I have a similar system, only difference in goal is that I do not include DOS, as I have a nice early P3 for late DOS. Only difference is that I have a Gf3Ti instead of 4MX. It's slightly faster, but negligibly. As the board has an ISA slot you can do DOS.

As for the other systems, you don't say what you want to achieve.

With your hardware, I would use system 2 for high-end DOS. Only thing that urgently needs changing is the G200 (Matrox is bad at VESA), the Voodoo3 is best for DOS VESA support. I would also consider a better sound card (or cards, you can dive deep down rabbit hole here) to avoid all the SB16 and specifically Vibra bugs and inadequacies, but how urgent that is depends on exactly which Vibra you have and what you want to do with it.

Reply 3 of 6, by mrfusion92

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@chinny22:
I do agree that the real Voodoo is way more cool but sadly I don't have other free PCI slots so no SLI. I have sound, usb 2.0, sata and ethernet cards installed. Even the AMR slot is occupied by a 2.5'' hard disk mounting bracket.

@dionb:
The other systems don't have a specific purpose. Just have to be the most period accurate as possible. As a matter of fact, system two and three have IDE hard disks instead of SSD or any other modern solution for storage (as opposed to the first system, which is basically a frankenstein's monster).

As both of you advised, I will install the Voodoo3 in the second system then. And keep the first as is.

About the SB16 Vibra, I already know is just okay-ish as quality. I have two of them just because they were in sold with a bunch of other cards. I have also an ESS ES1869 currently installed in an IBM PC and that's it, I don't have other ISA sound cards.

What cards should I be looking at to buy? As I said I don't need the best, just a good product of that time.

EDIT: By the way, the Vibras model is CT4170.

Reply 4 of 6, by chinny22

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Ah yeh Seems like I imagined you had a SLI setup, doesn't change anything though. It's nice to have the V2 installed to give you hardware glide support.
I would say though if you ever do want to install something else in that computer I'd probably remove the USB card. Do you really need USB 2.0? I'm assuming file transfers are done via network.

I don't think you need to buy anything but you do have a few optional extras.
Sound wise you could upgrade the SBLive! for an Audigy 2, slightly cleaner sound, the SBLive! could then be moved to the K6 which is still period correct.

Alternatively get a Aureal Vortex 2 for the K6 which gives you A3D 2.0 support, Something none of your setups have at the moment.
List of games with A3D support
https://dosdays.co.uk/topics/3daudio_games.php
That K6 does make for a high end dos machine and while both the Creative and Aureal cards have dos support, much better would be installing both a PCI card for windows and ISA card for dos.

ISA sound cards is where the real fun begins as many have good points but no 1 card can do everything.
Creative, ESS, Yamaha are the big 3 but it may be more fun to find what you can get for a good price and research it's pro's and cons. With upto 4 PC's with ISA slots you have a good arrangement for a few different setups 😀

Reply 5 of 6, by dionb

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mrfusion92 wrote on 2023-03-20, 16:33:
@chinny22: I do agree that the real Voodoo is way more cool but sadly I don't have other free PCI slots so no SLI. I have sound, […]
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@chinny22:
I do agree that the real Voodoo is way more cool but sadly I don't have other free PCI slots so no SLI. I have sound, usb 2.0, sata and ethernet cards installed. Even the AMR slot is occupied by a 2.5'' hard disk mounting bracket.

@dionb:
The other systems don't have a specific purpose. Just have to be the most period accurate as possible. As a matter of fact, system two and three have IDE hard disks instead of SSD or any other modern solution for storage (as opposed to the first system, which is basically a frankenstein's monster).

As both of you advised, I will install the Voodoo3 in the second system then. And keep the first as is.

About the SB16 Vibra, I already know is just okay-ish as quality. I have two of them just because they were in sold with a bunch of other cards. I have also an ESS ES1869 currently installed in an IBM PC and that's it, I don't have other ISA sound cards.

What cards should I be looking at to buy? As I said I don't need the best, just a good product of that time.

EDIT: By the way, the Vibras model is CT4170.

With no specific purpose there's no specific advice to give. CT4170 is one of the better Vibra cards, but it still has clipping and ringing (and MIDI slowdowns if playing 16b audio at same time), and CQM instead of real OPL3. Provided the build quality is decent, the card with the ES1869 will probably be better, with no MIDI bugs, no clipping or ringing and ESFM instead of CQM (still no real OPL3, but much nicer sound). Downside is it only supports ESS Audiodrive 16b audio, not SB16. Of course you could use both - Vibra for SB16 16b audio, ES1868 for 8b audio, FM and MIDI.

Reply 6 of 6, by mrfusion92

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Thanks to both of you!

I think I will try to look around for other sound cards but nothing urgent.

In the last couple of days I was enjoying very much the Voodoo3 3000 in the K6 system! It's really a fantastic card! Also it's pretty much the only "powerful" card that I have that displays correctly the Colin McRae Rally's game menu!

Of course I tested also with Glide games, very very fun. But I couldn't make Pod to even start in the pc, but I think because of the not-Intel cpu?