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Reply 141 of 189, by mr_bigmouth_502

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On a pure FM synthesis level, between the OPL3 and the Sega Genesis/Megadrive sound chip, which one is more powerful? The reason why I specify FM specifically is because I know that the Genesis sound chip has one sampling channel, along with a PSG with three square wave channels and a noise channel.

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Reply 142 of 189, by DracoNihil

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When you set the OPL3 mode to 4-op, it has the exact same 4-op voice count as the OPN2, I'm not sure what waveforms the OPN2 had to work with but theoretically one might beable to do a damn good job with the OPL3 4-op voices.

Infact there are some really good Adlib Tracker II songs that show off the 4-op functionality of the OPL3.

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Reply 143 of 189, by PhaytalError

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mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:

On a pure FM synthesis level, between the OPL3 and the Sega Genesis/Megadrive sound chip, which one is more powerful? The reason why I specify FM specifically is because I know that the Genesis sound chip has one sampling channel, along with a PSG with three square wave channels and a noise channel.

IMHO, the Sega Genesis soundchip(s) [from the original "High Definition Graphics" modle one units] have superior sound to the OPL3, arguebly i'm going to also state that a competant composer can produce Sega Genesis/Mega Drive FM tunes that can and do rival even the "beloved" SNES soundchip.

However that is MY personal opinion. Maybe something is going AWOL with my Sound Blaster 16 [CT1770] FM synth with a real YMF262-M, but it sounds kinda blah/offish compared to the FM synth quality of the YM2612 FM Synth chip of the Sega Genesis/Mega Drive.

While I fully acknowledge that the Sega Genesis/Mega Drive library is plagued with many horrible 3rd party FM composers, perhaps the same can be said for the DOS era games and I just never realized it, being i've never owned any Roland devices up until recent months, and listened to only FM synth in DOS games. I just can't seem to allow myself to listen to the FM Synth anymore in most DOS games.

DOS Gaming System: MS-DOS, AMD K6-III+ 400/ATZ@600Mhz, ASUS P5A v1.04 Motherboard, 32 MB RAM, 17" CRT monitor, Diamond Stealth 64 3000 4mb PCI, SB16 [CT1770], Roland MT-32 & Roland SC-55, 40GB Hard Drive, 3.5" Floppy Drive.

Reply 144 of 189, by DracoNihil

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Final Fantasy on the MSX2 is amazing, as is Phantasy Star 1... Both use the OPLL chip which is a seriously gimped OPL2. And that takes guts to make decent music on.

Another good one is Lagrange Point, which is LOOSELY based on the OPLL (it features a different set of hardwired instruments), and while the instrument ROM was changed around it still basically meant very limited choice of melodic tones to use.

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Reply 145 of 189, by mr_bigmouth_502

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PhaytalError wrote:
IMHO, the Sega Genesis soundchip(s) [from the original "High Definition Graphics" modle one units] have superior sound to the OP […]
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mr_bigmouth_502 wrote:

On a pure FM synthesis level, between the OPL3 and the Sega Genesis/Megadrive sound chip, which one is more powerful? The reason why I specify FM specifically is because I know that the Genesis sound chip has one sampling channel, along with a PSG with three square wave channels and a noise channel.

IMHO, the Sega Genesis soundchip(s) [from the original "High Definition Graphics" modle one units] have superior sound to the OPL3, arguebly i'm going to also state that a competant composer can produce Sega Genesis/Mega Drive FM tunes that can and do rival even the "beloved" SNES soundchip.

However that is MY personal opinion. Maybe something is going AWOL with my Sound Blaster 16 [CT1770] FM synth with a real YMF262-M, but it sounds kinda blah/offish compared to the FM synth quality of the YM2612 FM Synth chip of the Sega Genesis/Mega Drive.

While I fully acknowledge that the Sega Genesis/Mega Drive library is plagued with many horrible 3rd party FM composers, perhaps the same can be said for the DOS era games and I just never realized it, being i've never owned any Roland devices up until recent months, and listened to only FM synth in DOS games. I just can't seem to allow myself to listen to the FM Synth anymore in most DOS games.

The soundtrack for Streets of Rage leaves me with no doubt that the Genesis had a powerful sound chip, when handled by the right composers. As for the OPL3, I don't actually think that very many DOS games pushed the limits of it. For the most part, most games that supported it either just used its OPL2 compatibility, or they tried to synthesize songs intended for General MIDI modules with it. I can't really think of any games that actually had music composed specifically with the OPL3 in mind.

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Reply 146 of 189, by leileilol

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Gauntlet IV's soundtrack is a bit interesting since one instrument channel constantly modified to do two different notes (and not in an appregio kind of way), sick tricks like that...

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Reply 147 of 189, by bristlehog

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That's right, I can only think of Magic Carpet 2: Netherworlds that utilizes OPL3 in GM mode but does it well. It has separate set of MIDI tracks for OPL.

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Reply 148 of 189, by MaliceX

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necropost...

Cloudschatze wrote:
Joey_sw wrote:

Its works, thanks for telling me about this.

Just need to find a similar feature for "Chinese Paladin" now... 😀

This won't be necessary anymore.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1287967/R … soundtracks.rar
PS: I had to manually extract the RIX data of "Empire of the Angel 2" with a hex editor. Use RIX.EXE via DOSBOX to play them back. (I'm currently in the process of getting these logged/trimmed to the more accessible .VGM format)

Reply 149 of 189, by Cloudschatze

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MaliceX wrote:

This is very-much appreciated, thank-you. I wasn't aware of a proper player for RIX files, but the included one seems to do a legitimate job. It's too bad about the loss of transitioning when played out-of-game, but this is hardly a fault of the player.

Also, DOSBox' FM emulation leaves something to be desired with some of the pieces, so I'd recommend hardware playback, if possible.

Nice job with the extraction of the EA2 data, by-the-way, what with the four "unused" tunes and everything. Do you have any plans to extract the RIX files from other SoftStar titles? 魔道子 is in need of similar treatment, from what I hear.

Last edited by Cloudschatze on 2013-12-27, 13:50. Edited 1 time in total.

Reply 151 of 189, by MaliceX

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Cloudschatze wrote:
This is very-much appreciated, thank-you. I wasn't aware of a proper player for RIX files, but the included one seems to do a le […]
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MaliceX wrote:

This is very-much appreciated, thank-you. I wasn't aware of a proper player for RIX files, but the included one seems to do a legitimate job. It's too bad about the loss of transitioning when played out-of-game, but this is hardly a fault of the player.

Also, DOSBox' FM emulation leaves something to be desired with some of the pieces, so I'd recommend hardware playback, if possible.

Nice job with the extraction of the AE2 data, by-the-way, what with the four "unused" tunes and everything. Do you have any plans to extract the RIX files from other SoftStar titles? 魔道子 is in need of similar treatment, from what I hear.

Yes, that RIX.EXE I found somewhere floating on the internet on some page I believe was part of a reverse-engineering effort for porting Chinese Paladin / Legend of Sword and Fairy, to SDL, and is obviously more accurate than what is implemented in AdPlug.

BTW. I'm trying to ID the EA2 tracks since I can't get the supposed sound test to work. I have a partially tagged .VGM (well, .vgz) for use with in_vgm / VGMPlay here: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1287967/E … %29-taghelp.zip

I am considering looking into the other Softstar games. There is one in particular, Prince of Evil (EDIT: oh so THAT'S what 魔道子 is), which while it appears to have a similar quality to the other SOFTSTAR DOMO group game music, it doesn't look like it uses RIX though and I'm having trouble understanding the binary data structure of the game. 🙁

EDIT: For a start, maybe someone can type out the composer name shown on this credits screenshot I took from a youtube video? : http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1287967/pr … omposername.png

Reply 152 of 189, by Cloudschatze

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MaliceX wrote:

BTW. I'm trying to ID the EA2 tracks since I can't get the supposed sound test to work.

It's not super intuitive, for sure... 😵

I seem to recall that there was a difference when doing it from actual hardware, but if using DOSBox:

- Simultaneously press and hold 1, 3, 5 on the numeric keypad
- Sequentially tap s, w, f
- Release 1, 3, 5
- Press Caps-Lock + m for the music menu

This needs to be entered during gameplay.

Reply 153 of 189, by MaliceX

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Cloudschatze wrote:

This needs to be entered during gameplay.

😦 Thanks for that. Though it looks like it only goes through the MUSIC.SWf and MAGIC.SWF tunes with what appears to be original filenames? Anyway, it's a good reference for me to verify any faults with the .vgm logs.

Reply 154 of 189, by MaliceX

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On a more semi-related note, this is what the YM3812 can sound like playing a song originally made for YM2151. (cover/conversion by yours truly)

Fantasy Zone II DX - Cosmic Dance (OPL2) VGZ | YMF724F-V recording | ESS Solo-1 recording
Original: Manabu Namiki, Tokuhiko Uwabo

vgm/vgz, use in_vgm/VGMPlay or foo_gep.

PS: this was not made with any fm tracker or any publicly known tools. 😀

Reply 156 of 189, by MaliceX

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Stojke wrote:

Neat, I don't have Silhouetti's Eva cover. I do have the .SOP from someone else though which isn't as good as this one however.

Here's one I recorded a while ago with the YMF724F-V:
globe - Feel Like Dance (cover by Silhouetti) [ST-FEEl.SOP]

Reply 157 of 189, by Stojke

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I have recently finally configured PAS16 to work as the damn thing should 😀
I was amazed at the quality of sound, low noise level, high sound level, very nice bass. I don't even care about noise but this card is sick 😀

OPL3 sounds as clear as i ever heard it and destroys CT2230 OPL3 (CT1747) in instrument clarity (Still doesn't make it more dominant or a better choice 😀 , personal taste is where its at).
Here is one recording:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/54462712/ … suenotobira.mp3
[ Maximized Volume to -0.5dB ]

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Reply 159 of 189, by CryoSID

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Here are some OPL3 musics included with Peter Jorgensen's Master Player
http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/40dvxq555b … 20Tester%29.mp3
http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/5yz6xpye8g … %20Toxicate.mp3
http://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/rxk8rgesa8 … ama%20Disco.mp3

Master Player web page:
http://www.fedepede04.dk/DosEditor.html