I looked into ways of connecting some consoles through RGB and found this: http://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/sony-pvm-s … verter-bnc.html

The price is quite hefty for what is probably a rather small color bandwidth improvement compared to S-Video, but this is arguably the ultimate way to hook up certain old consoles. I'm not very versed as far as the different sync types go with RGB and I've heard of differences with the wiring of SCART cables, and in that link there is also an even more expensive version with a built-in sync separator. What is to consider with those solutions?

I posted this over on ASSEMbler Games forum, hopefully it answers your question:

http://www.assemblergames.com/forums/showthre … 216-The-PVM-FAQ

Essentially, it depends on the console, the cable, AND the screen, as to whether or not the sync-separator is necessary.

OK, this clears it up a bit. However I have no idea whether my BVM supports CVBS as sync input or not. Does the sync stripper circuit at least not mess with image quality? I also see that it requires the SCART cable to be wired for +5V to +12V, but IIRC at least my GC RGB cable has all pins wired, so perhaps most cables should work with that.

What is the reason why 480p won't work over RGB btw?

I also have an older PVM on the way that seems to be not on the list, so maybe I'll be able to make a contribution to your thread eventually.

d1stortion wrote:

OK, this clears it up a bit. However I have no idea whether my BVM supports CVBS as sync input or not. Does the sync stripper circuit at least not mess with image quality? I also see that it requires the SCART cable to be wired for +5V to +12V, but IIRC at least my GC RGB cable has all pins wired, so perhaps most cables should work with that.

The sync stripper doesn't touch the Red, Green or Blue signal lines at all. It just takes the CVBS signal and taps the sync signal. It has no impact on picture quality what so ever.

d1stortion wrote:

What is the reason why 480p won't work over RGB btw?

Because 480p is VGA resolution (60Hz vertical, 31kHz horizontal), and PVM/BVM monitors usually won't sync that high, at least none of the ones listed will, as they're not multisync monitors.

Your BVM might be different, the manual should tell you.

d1stortion wrote:

I also have an older PVM on the way that seems to be not on the list, so maybe I'll be able to make a contribution to your thread eventually.

Please do!

You can submit your BVM monitor too, if you like. The more the merrier! 😀

I've had no luck finding the manual for the exact BVM model I have as PDF. Of course there are manuals available for similar mid-90s models (at least I'm pretty sure that was the time frame when they introduced the newer Trinitron logo), but likely there will be some differences between them. Need to test thoroughly to find out all the specs.

Also I found something nifty here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-eokXK9mB0. I always thought this button was just for teletext... now I need to try this out 😀 and in fact I couldn't find such a deinterlace option on my BVM, so this could be actually something unique to consumer sets...?

The BVM-1454D should support 480p. Its certainly new enough to. Another forum to check for assistance is GameSX/NFG. There are a few Sony PVM/BVM owners there: http://nfggames.com/forum2/index.php?board=5.0

So you mean it'll sync to 31kHz? Actually I did just read that the PS2, for example, will switch to Sync-on-green and turn off CVBS with Component set to RGB+progressive scan enabled ingame (source). But this is not mentioned in the FAQ thread, so maybe PVM/BVM monitors take that just fine?

Edit:

Wikipedia wrote:

Sync on Green (SoG) is less common, and while some VGA monitors support it, most do not. Sony is a big proponent of SoG, and most of their monitors (and their PlayStation line of video game consoles) use it. Like devices that use composite video or S-video, SoG devices require additional circuitry to remove the sync signal from the green line. A monitor that is not equipped to handle SoG will display an image with an extreme green tint, if any image at all, when given a SoG input.

http://epic.awi.de/32539/1/sony-monitor_pvm-2054qm.pdf

The PVM-1454QM is your monitor minus the SDI I/O. The monitor supports sync-on-green by default, just turn of "EXT SYNC" and it will try and grab sync from the green video channel. The manual doesn't specify if it supports 480p.

Actually mine does have the SDI I/O, probably due to an upgrade then 😉

Concerning the PVM I was talking about earlier. It's DOA. What a shame... 🙁 the seller didn't put any fragile markings on the package so it must have been whacked around quite a lot. At least I basically only paid for shipping...

I used to own a PVM-2730QM, I had to give it away before moving to Brazil, I couldn't sell it. I used it with arcade boards, C64, an Amiga 500 etc.

There are two composite I/O with sound, a composite monitor+sound output (all BNC), the input labeled VTR is probably for U-Matic recorders, digital RGB (like CGA I guess) and finally SCART with composite (but no S-Video) + RGB and sound.
I used RGB on the SCART input for almost everything with cables I made myself, never had any sync trouble, my arcade boards are all around 60Hz but my Amiga and C64 were PAL.

It didn't mind being turned on its side for vertical games either, as long as you flipped it while it was unplugged.

Feel free to use the photos for your PVM FAQ.

if i ever build a mame cabinet i know what CRT to use now.

When I recently tried to use the S-Video out on my BVM I noticed that there would be a noticeable moire pattern on the screen whenever the cable was plugged into the out port. Now I see that with any interlaced inputs (and not using the out port) there is some slight moire going on as well 😒 it looks like this may be the most widespread issue with these monitors... at least 240p/288p are still fine!

I'm also planning on picking up the RGB adapter. Really looking forward to finally having a RGB console setup 😀

Try to find out if there's a hidden service menu where you can make adjustments. Most of the time these can be reached by holding down a certain combination of buttons while switching on the monitor. It's possible that the BVM is too old to have that kind of menu though. Maybe there are trimpots inside, ever tried taking off the cover?

A service technician would know how or where to look, if you can find one who ever worked on one of these things.

Going by the manual there is no hidden menu. I wouldn't say that hiding some settings on a professional-grade monitor makes that much sense anyway, but who knows...

I'm sure there are trimpots inside but neither do I know how to set them exactly nor do I feel like messing with HV electronics. For the time being it'll have to stay like this I guess. It may even be a wear issue of some sort as this monitor does seem to have reduced brightness; I have to keep contrast at max to get a nice bright picture. The fact that a monitor with visible scanlines produces a naturally darker image than one without could play a role in this as well.

So, picked up the next one. 🤣 A PVM-20M2E. I think now I'm really set with those monitors 🤣

This thing is a real monster. Pictures on the internet simply don't do it justice. It doesn't have the HR tube (going by the lack of the logo) but I have to say games look absolutely stunning on it just due to its sheer size. It's basically an arcade monitor.

I found the situation with the brightness to be similar to my BVM. It's a bit better when comparing medium settings on both but I simply prefer the brighter, more vibrant colors when contrast is set to max. Am I the only one feeling like that? I remember the contrast setting causing the colors to quickly become oversaturated and ugly on consumer sets, but with these professional ones not at all for whatever reason. It just feels like this is the "real" brightness setting, as the actual brightness dial just causes everything to go white.

Funnily enough, the moire when feeding it interlaced video is just exactly the same. It must be either due to the 3rd party AV cable im using with the PSX or it's just what the console outputs. Either way I can't imagine the two monitors having the exact same defect.

It does have its own imperfections though... the convergence is a just a tad off, and it seems like it's only affecting the bottom part of the screen. I only notice it with white text. It's certainly not visible when sitting far enough away. Also something that I have to get used to when using this beast is the high pitched noise. With 14"ers it's insignificant but here... yeah, it is audible (when not running a game at least). I don't want to know how loud a 27"er would be. But that and the bulkyness is just the price you have to pay to use a CRT 😀

Edit:
Figured the moire issue out... it was simply the cable not making good contact with the AV out. Can happen with 3rd party peripherals.

Also, figured out how to bring up the service menu (menu, degauss+enter), so no need for any monitor opening 😀

Cool. Post a photo!

Right now I only have two test grid pics:
http://i43.tinypic.com/2ep1z6f.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/2i6lx1e.jpg

First one is that BVM-1454D I've had for the longest time, you can see that everything is pretty much dead on except for the whole image shifted a bit to the left, doesn't bother me really. Second is a PVM-1453MD that I've picked up a while ago because it was dirt cheap. Sadly as seen in the picture, there are some annoying issues which cause me to not use it as much as I would like to. What the picture doesn't show though is that the PVM has a lot less hours on the tube, so the image is somewhat brighter... meh, I wish I'd have the skills to open these monitors and fiddle with the pots without zapping myself to death 😒 so right now I'm doing all of my console gaming on that BVM, I'm happy with it as it is right now.

Btw, I got the RGB adapter from retrogamingcables a while ago (great seller, totally recommend him), the difference in color quality is huge with games that use bright color palettes. Now the icing on the cake would just be 480p, but the PVMs that do this go for a lot of money still, and seem rather rare...

I have a Sony PVM 14M2U that I picked up awhile back to use with older consoles. Right now the only console I have that outputs RGB, and have a SCART cable for, is my modded SNES Jr. It makes me so jealous that Europeans had easy RGB access all these years after seeing the difference.

Now to try to answer some of your questions, d1stortion, the best I can. My understanding is that all of the Sony PVMs can accept Composite Sync and you shouldn't need a sync stripper for consoles. As far as the Gamecube, if it's an NTSC it does not natively output RGB and I don't believe it's possible to mod them because it uses a different video encoder than the PAL systems that do have RGB output. I think the options are to use component cables then a converter box to go back to RGB. But the GC component cables are really expensive. 🙁

Here is a good website that has information about each system that has RGB or can be modded for RGB: http://retrorgb.com/systems.html Luckily most consoles do have native support or are easy to mod.

Yup, thanks, I figured out most of the questions asked in this thread 😀 the models I've talked about support CVBS as sync source. Not all PVMs do though.

RGB SCART is indeed the redeeming thing about PAL region gaming. You could really see it as a compensation for all those years of bad 50 Hz ports. And honestly I'm so used to some 50 Hz games that the original versions feel like on caffeine to me 🤣

For GC games on NTSC hardware I'd say get a Wii, Component cables for that are cheap. The question is whether you should run it in 480i on your PVM or in 480p 16:9 (with lower pixel density) on an HDTV.

Also Sony consoles support RGB worldwide.

This is the very purpose for which I periodically search for Commodore 1084's! Thanks for bringing back memories, OP!