Scali wrote:

For example, someone made the game "You have to win the game": http://store.steampowered.com/app/286100/
It looks like an early 80s CGA game. However, it requires a modern PC with a GPU with shaders to run it.
To prove how the game is missing the point, someone re-made the game on an actual C64: http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=60890

Of course the *actual* proof should have been a real 8088/CGA remake (or possibly Tandy, since there's an "EGA" tileset too). 😉

Tetrium wrote:

I do. And you already explained it here:

There must be some kind of miscommuncation here.
You said: "By this definition, anything running Glide games is also vintage"
I pointed out that there are ways to run Glide games without any vintage hardware (emulators/Glide wrappers).
Which falls under 'anything running Glide games', but not under 'vintage'.
I also mentioned that it had to be Glide games from that era, since you could still write new Glide games today, which would again not be 'vintage'.

Scali wrote:

There must be some kind of miscommuncation here.

Scali, I don't see how this miscommunication of yours could continue to exist as I have already clarified things hours ago.

And if you hadn't noticed yet, the talking tended to be centralized around hardware.

Glide's an API. Glide doesn't know age. Glide can get wrapped by anything new. Voodoo hardware is not required for Glide. Drivers for Voodoo hardware support Glide. If other companies (nvidia, amd etc) ever cared about a minor API and wanted a way to waste their money, they could've made their drivers support Glide natively also. Retro hardware isn't about using Glide.

leileilol wrote:

Glide's an API. Glide doesn't know age. Glide can get wrapped by anything new. Voodoo hardware is not required for Glide. Drivers for Voodoo hardware support Glide. If other companies (nvidia, amd etc) ever cared about a minor API and wanted a way to waste their money, they could've made their drivers support Glide natively also. Retro hardware isn't about using Glide.

Virtually all Glide games played today are retro, so the point of Glide API not necessarily being retro seems a moot point anyway.

This might end up becoming a quite interesting thread 😀.

We use the term Retro somewhat differently here than is conventional - "retro music" or "retro fashion" are things created now in the spirit of a "passé" style trend. Our use of retro is closer to "vintage" in the sense it refers to products or creations that are themselves old and growing older regardless of how highly they may be esteemed (or not).

Casually I'd say retro gear is anything someone not in the know might start laughing if they saw you using it - or that prompts the inevitable question - "(dude) why are you using that?!?" Outdated, passé, past it's prime, over the hill, of specialists interest only - "retro" is that sort of thing... you know - cool!

I'd say it's anything that has left the mainstream of usage, support, or general usefulness in the modern world, but also has some enduring charm or "coolness" factor that lends itself to continuing usage by enthusiasts.

By this definition, pretty much anything before the Pentium 4 era qualifies, but the line is fuzzy.

I think if you wanted to try to be objective about it, you can't say there's a concrete definition of what is or isn't retro. (As opposed to "What 'retro' is to me.")

It's more of a curve. Things fade from being cutting edge niche, gaining mainstream acceptance, losing popularity immediately following obsolescence, then tapering back upwards being fashionable as retro/vintage (even if that's mainly within an interest group).

You can apply it to all sorts of stuff, cars, audio stuff, clothing, computers and video games, etc.

To me old=fun fun+old=retro.

I only like old hardware as its, to me is fun to play with.

Tetrium wrote:

Scali wrote:

There must be some kind of miscommuncation here.

Scali, I don't see how this miscommunication of yours could continue to exist as I have already clarified things hours ago.

Clearly there is miscommunication here, because your statement and clarification conflict with mine.

Tetrium wrote:

And if you hadn't noticed yet, the talking tended to be centralized around hardware.

Again, as I say, you can run Glide software on new hardware (as in 'not vintage'), using Glide wrappers.

There's some very good stuff being said here, very nice to read 😀.

SquallStrife wrote:

I think if you wanted to try to be objective about it, you can't say there's a concrete definition of what is or isn't retro. (As opposed to "What 'retro' is to me.")

It's more of a curve. Things fade from being cutting edge niche, gaining mainstream acceptance, losing popularity immediately following obsolescence, then tapering back upwards being fashionable as retro/vintage (even if that's mainly within an interest group).

You can apply it to all sorts of stuff, cars, audio stuff, clothing, computers and video games, etc.

I think it indeed is more of a curve, I can still get surprised even by how something gets old, 'everyone' looses interest and it seems to be doomed for forgotness, and then it reappears! Heck, even though the present-day group of users of Virges is a lot smaller then when they were 'state of the art', I dare say that, in a way, these days Virges are much more popular now then they were when they were still new (everyone called them graphics decelerators, but in itself they are very good for what they are, these were thrown out by the boxes!). But even though on paper they didn't seem much, when we worked with them rebuilding computers for poor and sick people (charity work), they were a joy to work with compared to many of the other cards we were gifted by schools and such, even when we used them in XP.

tincup wrote:

We use the term Retro somewhat differently here than is conventional - "retro music" or "retro fashion" are things created now in the spirit of a "passé" style trend.

Yes, this is also the way I used 'retro' above.
My blog also contains articles about "retroprogramming", which is writing new code for old ('vintage') machines/OSes/etc, which may or may not be done with old ('vintage') tools.

In my case what I consider "retro" in computing hardware is basically everything pre-Athlon XP. I mostly focus on PC compatible stuff starting from the early 90s since I didn't have a computer until I was about 13, I only experienced 80s computers through my friends so I'm not really attached to those.

While nostalgia plays a role, I am not specifically interested in owning the exact same things I had back then, I mostly enjoy building systems that would have been impossible for me to acquire at that time, not just to play the old games at decent framerates but because I enjoy tinkering with electronics. In that sense "retro" hardware is much more fun because it has quirks and unexpected issues that you need to solve in order to get it working (the 486 era is especially interesting with all the jumper craze).