In my humble opinion, religions were founded/evolved to be a guiding force for inculcating morals/discipline into the life of general public either by unique local customs, symbols, focus/concentration (attain inner peace) or else ultimately by fear of God/Supreme if all others fail. Initially most,if not all, of the so called 'religions' might have been more like 'a way of life' rather than a 'movement', with local demography/topography integrated into it or being a part of it. Some of the local customs might have been created by great minds for keeping the people healthy based on a scientific fact that might be hard to grasp & beyond the understanding of common and mostly naive people during those early ages and also aid in concentration to attain peace of mind. IMO the customs were a clever way of propagating these good things down the ages among illiterate people (mostly), when there were limited or no tools for recording or passing of knowledge down the next generations. Obviously the local customs may look odd to people of other culture unless the underlying fact(if any) or basis is understood. Somewhere along the road as time passed, these scientific facts might have been conveniently forgotten leaving behind only the customs like a body without a skeleton. It could have deviated too from the scientific fact on which it would have been based upon for all we know.

Enter the internet age, where there is no lack of knowledge once you know where to look and only the dilemma of which is right/correct or wrong compounded by so many available options. The framework of religion mentioned above instantly collapses in this instance where the guiding force may no longer be a necessity and has become more of an identity. In current sorry state of affairs, we, as humans, have breached and stooped below the level of ....(fill with whatever, doesn't matter really). Founders of the religions would have found the current state (utter lack of compassion) too painful to bear and guilt-ridden too as all they did was preach good things. We may have to lose this fake sense of identity and emerge as unadulterated human beings first for a better future, fat chance 🤣 .

Most of the world's problems would get resolved, if & only if both the fighting parties put themselves in the shoes of the other party and try to understand their reasoning to their best of abilities.

gerwin wrote:

In general; The muslim vs 'the West' dillema's are setup to be without end and without solution. Just ignore it.

This I agree with. It's senseless and mostly to keep people occupied in a way. I feel like there's no solution as people simply don't want one. They just want to have something to blame and something to pick on and that's it.

Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:

The truth is, the man did not only wave a piece of bacon in front of the Muslim women, but also followed them and kept harassing […]
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The truth is, the man did not only wave a piece of bacon in front of the Muslim women, but also followed them and kept harassing them after the women left him.

As such, I don't understand the remark "if the man only wave bacon and not follow the women, then it's okay," while it is definitely not what happened on the first place. I don't understand either why Jade Falcon suggest both sides to grow up, while the women had in fact tried to leave, but still followed and harassed by the offender.

Could anyone kindly tell me, with a straight face, that the women had done anything wrong during the incident?

Allow me to put things into perspective then.

1. Kept the bacon, but replace the Muslim women with Jewish women. Paul approached the Jewish women and then waved the bacon in front of them. Somebody please tell me, with a straight face, that it's okay for Paul to do so.

2. Replace the bacon with beef, and replace the Muslim women with Hindu women. Paul approached the Hindu women and then waved the beef in front of them. Somebody please tell me, with a straight face, that it's okay for Paul to do so.

3. Replace the bacon with any kind of meat, and replace the Muslim women with vegetarian Buddhist monks. Paul approached the vegetarian Buddhist monks and then waved the meat in front of them. Somebody please tell me, with a straight face, that it's okay for Paul to do so.

4. Replace the bacon with Nazi swastika, and replace the Muslim women with Germans. Paul approached the Germans and then waved the Nazi swastika in front of them. Somebody please tell me, with a straight face, that it's okay for Paul to do so.

5. Replace the bacon with bodybuilding magazine. You know, the one with large pictures of half-naked men in thongs. Then replace the Muslim women with Catholic nuns, whom naturally have taken the vows of celibacy. Paul approached the Catholic nuns and then waved the magazine full of muscular, half-naked men in front of them. Somebody please tell me, with a straight face, that it's okay for Paul to do so.

6. Replace the bacon with US confederate flag, and replace the Muslim women with black Americans. Paul approached the black Americans and then waved the confederate flag in front of them. Somebody please tell me, with a straight face, that it's okay for Paul to do so.

The list can go on and on and on, but the point is the same; it could be religion, it could be race, and heck, it could be historical trauma, but bullying is bullying, regardless whether it's done in the context of religion, race, or history. And if I recall correctly, Sweden is one of the countries with anti-bullying laws.

And again, the man did not only come to the Muslim women and waved the pork in front of them while calling names; he also followed them and kept harassing them after they left him. So could anyone kindly explain why it is both sides that need to grow up? Could anyone tell me, with a straight face, what's the women's fault during the incident?

In a free country, it is okay to do any of those things, it is not illegal. What IS illegal and wrong, is that the dude kept following those women and kept harassing them. From your examples, only the swastikas are actually illegal to show in public, and that is only in Germany. The whole world needs to grow up, and also grow a pair of balls, so as not to be offended about everything other people do. No matter the race or religion, there are always some dicks who try to harass other people, and that is wrong, but everyone should have the amount of dignity to not care about some idiot on the streets, even if they think differently than you.

The dude in question is clearly an idiot, and I do not approve of his doings, but as I said, in a free country it is legal to wave bacon around.

With all this talk of bacon, I had to go buy quite a bit of it. I fried it up for breakfast this morning.

so very tasty.

Aideka wrote:

in a free country it is legal to wave bacon around.

Forget the legality for a moment. In certain sects, no form of meat is permitted for consumption (probably due to their local beliefs & customs, right or wrong is irrelevant) and the children are brought up without exposure to them(especially before globalization). Consider dangling a piece of meat in front of them and probably they will puke right away due to different reactions of their senses and triggers of their enzymes/hormones compared to that of normally meat-eating people. Not much different to seeing someone eat a plate of worms as a slightly extreme example. It is the aversion factor, which can vary from person to person.

Coming to this specific incident, if the guy who was charged was simply eating his bacon close to those women and not uttered any adverse comments then you can't really find any fault with him. In that case, the women should have probably ignored and need not have moved too unless the aversion mentioned above comes into picture. You don't need a puking incident in a public transport. Not so sure that aversion is in play here due to my limited knowledge of other religions. In case if the guy had dangled the bacon in front of those women but not uttered anything adverse, then the women should have just ignored and stayed in their place considering that they were in a non-native environment, unless the aversion factor being true. The guy would have got bored/disinterested and stopped it due to lack of response and failure of his provocation attempt. But the guy knowingly did what he did, both the dangling and the comments, those are definitely not nice things to do in this polarized world. Maybe he had his reasons, but let us leave it out of the picture due to lack of any such facts. Ideally if the fake identities don't exist, the adverse comments would not have had any meaning too, as we all belong to the same species, naturally. Whatever that came afterwards and created by man is artificial and can be changed for the better, if found to be non-conducive in present context.

Maybe if everyone stayed in their native environment(no globalization) and had there been no desire for world domination among the various countries, these type of incidents never would have happened. There are a lot of things that are presently bad in this world with no glimmer of hope to be hopeful of making it a better place.

luckybob wrote:

With all this talk of bacon, I had to go buy quite a bit of it. I fried it up for breakfast this morning.

so very tasty.

Way ahead of you 😁

Anybody remember "Sizzlean"? It was this faux bacon product that was supposed to be healthier than the real thing. I remember loving the stuff when I was a kid. I actually liked it better than real bacon. Sadly, I haven't seen it in grocery stores for ages.

I would really love to get some of that again.

KT7AGuy wrote:

Anybody remember "Sizzlean"? It was this faux bacon product that was supposed to be healthier than the real thing. I remember loving the stuff when I was a kid. I actually liked it better than real bacon. Sadly, I haven't seen it in grocery stores for ages.

I would really love to get some of that again.

Honestly, why can't I report a post for heresy?

The man has blasphemed. He must die.

His punishment is to be forced to eat prodigious amounts of the fake bacon until his stomach bursts.

you heard him, he says he likes the stuff.

this comes to mind, pardon the potato quality. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtEFEdrrXc4

Jeez, you guys are religious about your salty pork.

I mean, bacon is OK. If it was all meat I would like it alot more. Unfortunately, there's just as much fatty strips as meaty strips. That chewy fat is just gross. Sizzlean was awesome because it was like bacon, but without the fatty strips. It had all the bacony goodness without all the gross fatty badness.

luckybob wrote:

this comes to mind, pardon the potato quality. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtEFEdrrXc4

Heh, that made me laugh. Here's another appropriate Simpson's reference:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS05Okms7cM

He wasn't literally charged with assault; the news item talks about harassment and hate speech, which is a different crime. How often do you see people just happen to be enjoying their bacon on mass transit, and in Europe? Shouting, flailing bacon around and following the women around the train - what a contemptible nutter.

The laws similarly protect Christians from Satanists, though almost certainly not the other way around. 🤣

.

Thank you for your insightful and constructive comment, WolverineDK. This is why we can't have nice things.

gdjacobs wrote:

Thank you for your insightful and constructive comment, WolverineDK. This is why we can't have nice things.

Yeah, I don't even understand how my commits can even be remotely seen as racist. If anything WolverineDK is being racist for implying Muslim=race. People need to grow up and learn to deal with things them selves. There are alot of butt holes in the world and the police can't stop everyone from being rude and offending you.

Anyway dose anyone find it odd that there was no mention of the Muslim womens escorts/guardian? Aren't Muslim women not allowed in public without an male guardian to escort them? Like a father, husband or older brother?

Strange story. Was this some sort of weird protest against the attack in London a few days previously?

Jade Falcon wrote:

Anyway dose anyone find it odd that there was no mention of the Muslim womens escorts/guardian? Aren't Muslim women not allowed in public without an male guardian to escort them? Like a father, husband or older brother?

I once dated a Muslim girl - it was certainly awks but she was an independent woman. Like anything, people do things differently all over the world, by country, state - right down to the indivudual level.

WolverineDK wrote:

Jade Falcon: Go fuck yourself, you racist piece of shit !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HtvFJqCQt4

totally worth watching.

Jade Falcon wrote:

Anyway dose anyone find it odd that there was no mention of the Muslim womens escorts/guardian? Aren't Muslim women not allowed in public without an male guardian to escort them? Like a father, husband or older brother?

There's many schools of thought in Islam, the same as Judaism, Christianity, and Economics. Don't make the mistake of thinking that one doctrine is the sum of all of them. If you want to know what's what, go mingle with some people from different muslim countries.

gdjacobs wrote:

Jade Falcon wrote:

Anyway dose anyone find it odd that there was no mention of the Muslim womens escorts/guardian? Aren't Muslim women not allowed in public without an male guardian to escort them? Like a father, husband or older brother?

There's many schools of thought in Islam, the same as Judaism, Christianity, and Economics. Don't make the mistake of thinking that one doctrine is the sum of all of them. If you want to know what's what, go mingle with some people from different muslim countries.

I never quite understand that. I mean, the Bible, torah and keron are all pretty straight forward. I guess some people like to focus on certain parts and come up with there own flawed interpretations of the meaning of a passage wile ignoring parts to fit their needs. Eventually it rolls down hill and we have a different sect of the religion that fails to properly fallow their religions teachings.

Take the Catholic Church for example, it's considered a Christian denomination but half of the things they do/teach are forbidden in the Bible. Id go into detail but this is not the place for it.