Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Announcements, advice, random banter, unrelated discussion, et cetera.

Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby fitzpatr » 2017-10-17 @ 04:31

Hi everyone,

I've decided to send a request to Seasonic for them to produce a Retro-Friendly PSU. I know that it is unlikely to actually work, but why not try? (I love exercising my futility muscles, maybe?)

I am asking Seasonic because of my excellent experiences with the brand, and the excellent reputation it has among computer enthusiasts. It would certainly be a great gesture of good will towards a community of very dedicated computer enthusiasts.

Here are the specifications that I have come up with:

ATX 12V 1.3;
At Least 30A on the 5V rail without a requirement for load on the 12V Rail;
-5V Rail

Fully Modular;
ATX 20+4 Pin connector;
AT Connector (2x Molex 90331 connectors); (Either ATX or AT, user’s choice)
Connector for external toggle power switch;
At Least 6x MOLEX Power Connectors (AMP MATE-N-LOK 1-480424-0);
At Least 2x Floppy Power Connectors (Berg Connectors);
At Least 2x SATA Power Connectors



I would appreciate any feedback on the specifications or banter about this idea.
MT-32 Old, CM-32L, CM-500, SC-55mkII, SC-88Pro, SC-D70, MU2000EX
P4EE 3.4GHz/P4C800-E/4GB Ballistix Tracer DDR-500/HD3850/Audigy 2ZS Platinum
PIII-1.4S/TUSL2-C/Voodoo5 5500/MX300
K6-III+/450/GA-5AX/G400 Max/Voodoo2 SLI/CT1750/MPU-401AT/Audigy 2ZS
fitzpatr
Member
 
Posts: 135
Joined: 2016-10-30 @ 06:50
Location: Canada

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby x0zm_ » 2017-10-17 @ 05:54

I often thought about approaching some of the smaller manufacturers, especially the ones that work on small industrial or are happy with low MOQ to see what it would cost to have a fairly small run of retro friendly ATX PSUs made, get a kickstarter going so anyone interested could get one in that manufacturing run. Never actually got around to it though.

I agree it's a long shot since it is a very niche community when you compare who PSUs normally sell to, but it would be amazing to have a fully retro capable (+5v/+3.3v/-5v) PSU with all the modern comforts of modular cables and high efficiency/low noise. :-D
User avatar
x0zm_
Member
 
Posts: 158
Joined: 2017-1-06 @ 15:07
Location: Australia

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby Jade Falcon » 2017-10-17 @ 06:29

Not going to happen with a company like seasonic uless you back up your suggestion with money.
A cheap desktop motherboard costs about 50-75k to develop. Wile a psu is no motherboard hardware development cost big money.

That being said, try asking a few smaller companies that been around so long that they made such psu in the past.

I know thermaltake had a psu just like you posted back in like 2008 and rosewill has one that still for sale on newegg.
Your be better off getting a smaller company to bring back a older psu then for a company to make a new psu for old systems. Also up 30amp to 40 amp as some if use like dual cpu setups. :cool:

Edit.
I was not trying to rain on you idea. Id love to see such a psu myself. So much so that if i was any smarter id make one.
User avatar
Jade Falcon
l33t
 
Posts: 3184
Joined: 2016-5-08 @ 19:23
Location: Stuck in Silent Hill after bailing out of my Eyrie

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby KT7AGuy » 2017-10-17 @ 09:19

Jade Falcon wrote:rosewill has one that still for sale on newegg.


Which one do you like?

The RV350 and RP600V2-S-SL have been discontinued for awhile now. Having a spare PSU would be nice.
User avatar
KT7AGuy
Oldbie
 
Posts: 776
Joined: 2012-11-30 @ 19:21
Location: Chicago

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby keropi » 2017-10-17 @ 10:05

great idea about a good retro-psu - it's the key for a long-lived system!
User avatar
keropi
l33t++
 
Posts: 5619
Joined: 2003-9-08 @ 06:45
Location: Greece

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby appiah4 » 2017-10-17 @ 11:08

Try Forton/FSP Group they used to make quality AT and ATX PSUs in the 90s and 2000s they could just reproduce some in limited runs presumably even as kickstarter projects as side money. They still build cheap versions of theşr mid ranfe studfff for OEMs in bulk. They should be approachable.
1993:PCI597-1|P133|32MB|Trio64V2/DX|ES1868/S2
1995:P5I430VX|P233MMX|Virge/DX|CT4520
1997:S1573S|K6-2/400|64MB|M220|V2/SLI|CT4500/32M
1999:BE6-II|P3-700E|256MB|V3-3000|MX300
GX110LP:36XMT|PIII1000|512MB|R7000|CT4780
User avatar
appiah4
Oldbie
 
Posts: 1114
Joined: 2017-2-19 @ 07:36

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby fitzpatr » 2017-10-17 @ 19:07

Great suggestions so far, everyone.

I am certainly open to other OEMs.

Power Draw

Perhaps there is a need for 2 PSUs. A moderate Wattage one for most use cases, and a high Wattage one for the upper end of use cases. I don't want to get ahead of myself, though.

The AMD Athlon XP 3200+ Barton is the most power hungry CPU possible to go into a 5V CPU supply board.

79.2W @ 5V is 15.84A

So 16A single CPU, and 32A dual CPU is the maximum requirement.

GPU power draw is fairly difficult to find. I expect that the GeForce FX5950 Ultra, GeForce4 Ti4600, or Radeon 9800XT would be the heaviest load on the 5V rail, but I do not know.

Cabling

For cabling, I believe that with the modular design, the same output connectors could feed either AT or ATX connectors.

I know that there are some AT boards with a third power connector. Does anyone have any details on that?
MT-32 Old, CM-32L, CM-500, SC-55mkII, SC-88Pro, SC-D70, MU2000EX
P4EE 3.4GHz/P4C800-E/4GB Ballistix Tracer DDR-500/HD3850/Audigy 2ZS Platinum
PIII-1.4S/TUSL2-C/Voodoo5 5500/MX300
K6-III+/450/GA-5AX/G400 Max/Voodoo2 SLI/CT1750/MPU-401AT/Audigy 2ZS
fitzpatr
Member
 
Posts: 135
Joined: 2016-10-30 @ 06:50
Location: Canada

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby cyclone3d » 2017-10-17 @ 20:05

I don't really see the need for a special retro power supply.

You can get good power supplies for not that much and then just use an ATX 24-pin to 20-pin or AT with -5v added via the adapter.

The adapters also have support for the AT style switches and even come with a switch.

The adapters only cost around $16 a piece max.

Much cheaper to just adapt current, good power supplies then have a super low volume run of specialty power supplies.

Anybody want to hazard a guess at what they would have to sell each retro power supply at to break even?
User avatar
cyclone3d
Oldbie
 
Posts: 848
Joined: 2015-4-08 @ 06:06
Location: Huntsville, AL USA

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby Richo » 2017-10-18 @ 00:18

cyclone3d wrote:I don't really see the need for a special retro power supply.

You can get good power supplies for not that much and then just use an ATX 24-pin to 20-pin or AT with -5v added via the adapter.

The adapters also have support for the AT style switches and even come with a switch.

The adapters only cost around $16 a piece max.

Much cheaper to just adapt current, good power supplies then have a super low volume run of specialty power supplies.

Anybody want to hazard a guess at what they would have to sell each retro power supply at to break even?


The best and most likely only/cheapest option is to use old designs from a company like FSP and adapt it to modern standards and utility. I would be up for it depending on the costs ofcourse, like most of us here I presume.

ATX 12V 1.3;
At Least 30A on the 5V rail without a requirement for load on the 12V Rail;
-5V Rail

Fully Modular;
ATX 20+4 Pin connector + 6 pin auxiliary power cable
AT Connector (2x Molex 90331 connectors); (Either ATX or AT, user’s choice) + Connector for external toggle power switch (put this together in 1 cable and seperate later, more practical)
3 x 3 MOLEX Power Connectors (AMP MATE-N-LOK 1-480424-0);
1 x 1 Molex + floppy connector
2 x 1 Floppy Power Connectors (Berg Connectors);
2 x 2 SATA Power Connectors
1 x 4+4 pin +12 volt power cable
1 x 6 pin PCI Express power cable


make that 40A on the 5V rail for OC (my athlon is hungry, after calcs with full OC I hit 34A and my PSU is rated for MAX 36A)
6x molex? try 10.... I already use 5 on my athlon just to power the basics not counting additional fans etc.
to make fully compatible with about everything you additional support for P4 an athlons
TX97-XE, P55C, S3Virge, Voodoo, AWE64
GA-60XT, Tualatin, Albatron Geforce4 4200TI
A7N8X Deluxe, Barton, A9800 XT
Strix X99, Haswell-E, Gigabyte Aorus Pascal
User avatar
Richo
Member
 
Posts: 397
Joined: 2016-11-13 @ 21:57
Location: Your local chemical plant

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby dexvx » 2017-10-19 @ 19:52

I think even on some Athlon 64/FX's, a strong 5V is required. I picked up an Asus SK8N/FX-53 combo and it would not boot with newer Corsair CX430/CX750 (!) PSU's with 20A 5V. Boots up fine with a 420W Antec Earthwatts or 365W Enermax Whisper.

However, I think the writing is on the wall regarding PSU's targeted for older platforms. There simply isn't much a market for them.
dexvx
Oldbie
 
Posts: 698
Joined: 2017-3-07 @ 03:32
Location: USA

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby cliffclaven » 2017-10-20 @ 00:25

What about the Startech ones?
User avatar
cliffclaven
Newbie
 
Posts: 73
Joined: 2017-4-10 @ 18:50

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby gdjacobs » 2017-10-20 @ 03:53

I don't currently have data on capacitor selection or any internal shots, but the AT model they currently produce is okay (except for Teapo caps which are a 'B' grade component). If the ATX model is like that, it will be a credible option.
User avatar
gdjacobs
l33t
 
Posts: 4190
Joined: 2015-11-03 @ 05:51
Location: The Great White North

Re: Sending a Product Suggestion to Seasonic

Postby Ozzuneoj » 2017-10-21 @ 16:03

While a good name brand unit like a Seasonic would be infinitely better in the long run, I found a cheap ATX PSU that claims to have a 40A +5v rail. Someone put it in a horribly cobbled together computer which they SOLD to a friend of mine (X2 5000+ with no thermal paste, mismatched RAM, bad caps, HDD with 0% health in SMART, whistling PSU with bad caps, floppy drive that wasn't even connected...). I was surprised to see the high +5v rail. The unit doesn't trip my PSU tester, but I could tell from the faint whistle that it had some issues. Upon opening, it has some bad caps. Only a few though... not hard to replace if I really wanted to.

If you guys are feeling adventurous, when I search for this model of PSU I find lots of them under different brand names all over the internet, all with a 40A +5v rail. Mine is an "L&C LC B400 ATX". I found these:

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_odkw=l ... x&_sacat=0

There's also a discussion about replacing caps in them (and whether its worth it or not):
https://www.badcaps.net/forum/showthread.php?t=926
Time Machine = FIC PA-2013 2.1 - K6-2 500 - 256MB PC-100 - TNT2 Pro 16MB AGP - Labway Yamaha YMF719-E - Midiman MM401
Amibay For Sale Threads
I have lots of PC stuff for sale on Mercari! Get a $10 sign up credit with invite code VBGQMM.
User avatar
Ozzuneoj
Oldbie
 
Posts: 609
Joined: 2016-3-16 @ 21:33


Return to Milliways

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Cyberdyne, F2bnp, fitzpatr and 4 guests