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First post, by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman

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So I eventually got the chance to play my GoG-purchased copy of Martian Dreams when I stumbled upon this, this, and this.

Every version of the game I can find has a bug (at least for me) by which once you cross the 180° meridian with a sextant in your possession, you can no longer save your progress. This remains true even if you go back to the other side of the meridian. Both crossing the meridian and tracking your progress with a sextant are pretty vital to the game.

I have a theory, if anyone wants to give it a try. As far as I can tell, the savegame seems to reliably corrupt itself if one saves in the area north of 31°15'S and east of 158°00'E unless one had previously saved in the area south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E at least once some time before that.

Once the savegame has become corrupted, the game will freeze upon the third time the game is saved following the corruption, again unless one saves in the area south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E before the third save. The third save after a corruption won't complete regardless of location. Once the game has been saved south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E at least once, further saves don't seem to cause any further problems (for me at least).

Can somebody else with the game installed corroborate the above? I assume the corrupting area also has eastern and northern boundaries, but I didn't bother looking for them. On a sidenote, as Dibbs is located at 31°00'S, it also seems plausible to me that a lot of people would save south of 31°00'S after getting him, possibly explaining why many people report completing the game without ever encountering the issue.

So it seems the game becomes corrupt and unable to save if you do at least one of the following:
1. crossing the 180° meridian with a sextant in your position; or
2. saving in the area north of 31°15'S and east of 158°00'E, unless you had previously saved in the area south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E.

Nonetheless, back in 1993, a friend of mine finished Martian Dreams without experiencing such problem. So, is the problem exclusive to the GoG version of Martian Dreams? Nonetheless, in this thread I'm going to share my gaming experience, which hopefully can be useful to narrow down the problem.

My first gaming session: the save game bug didn't happen.

I created my character before discovering about the bug above, so I played it quite innocently. That is, saving everytime I felt like it, without worrying whether I was in the area north of 31°15'S and east of 158°00'E and whatnot. Right after starting a new game, I saved quite often before prying the capsule's door open, partially because my daughter was sitting on my lap the whole time. I rather worried she would press CTRL X or ALT F4 out of curiosity, and I didn't want to repeat mundane things like opening crates and equipping my party. 😁

I immediately went to the 1893 landing site, met Lieutenant Dibbs, and asked him to join the party. I saved quite often around the area, but I didn't remember saving in the area south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E. Well, it was still east of 158°00'E, but the latitude could not be lower than 31°00'S, more likely around 29°00'S or so.

With Dibbs in my party, I went to Buffalo Bill and Calamity Jane's trading outpost at 12°00'S and 129°00'W. The area was north of 31°15'S and east of 158°00'E, so I was supposed to experience the save game bug because of saving on the said area, wasn't I?

Funnily enough, the bug didn't happen.

session-01.jpg
Yes, I saved at at 12°00'S and 129°00'W, and yet the bug didn't happen.

This was the first time I read the article about the save game bug, by the way. According to the said article, I could only save two times more after saving in such allegely 'wrong' area. Yet, out of curiosity, I walked around and saved my games thirteen times, once for each step, and the bug never happened.

To sum up:
(1) I saved quite carelessly and wantonly, because I didn't know about the savegame bug at that time.
(2) I had indeed saved in the area east of 158°00'E, but I'm not sure whether the save location was south of 31°00'S.
(3) my east-of-158°00'E save area is accross the 180° meridian.

I shared the SAVEGAME folder here, in case anyone wishes to test it further.

The second gaming session: this is where I got the bug.

I decided to create a new character and start it over after reading about the save game bug. In this session, I became nervous about my saving location. In fact, I went too careful that I decided to save in the area south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E before doing anything else --even before recruiting Dibbs. In the process, I went eastward too far until I bumped into the easternmost canal, probably somewhere between Arsia Mons and Icaria Planum.

session-02-the-easternmost-canal.jpg
The canal I bumped into in my journey eastward.

I then went back westward, crossing the 180° meridian again in the process, then I saved my game at 34°00'S and 163°00'E. It was my very first save, and I hadn't talked to Dibbs yet, because I was so busy searching for a 'safe' savegame location instead of going to the 1893 expedition landing site.

Then I got the bug!

I could only save again once after making that save. After that, the game crashed after I pressed CTRL S. The music stayed, though, as if nothing happened.

To sum up:
(1) I saved in the area east of 158°00'E and south of 31°00'S, and it was my very first save. Also, I had barely done anything before that save, I hadn't even recruited Dibbs yet.
(2) my save area is not accross the 180° meridian; it was XXX°E instead of XXX°W.
(3) however, I have crossed the 180° meridian at least twice before saving the game.

Too bad I didn't keep the savegame folder; I deleted it in an attempt to create a new character, and forgot to make backup.

The third gaming session: more thorough testing.

On the third session, I decided to play it quite normally, but decided not to save until I reached the 1893 landing site and recruited Dibbs. I saved at 147°00'W and 33°00'S, and after recruiting Dibbs. The save location was south of 31°00'S and east of 158°00'E, so it is supposed to be save. It is also accross the 180° meridian.

session-03.jpg
My first save at 147°00'W and 33°00'S.

The game didn't seem to corrupt either, but here I decided to perform more thorough testing. First I crossed back the 180° meridian, saving at 177°00'E and 8°00'S. It is a supposedly dangerous save location, since the coordinates are east of 158°00'E and north of 31°00'S. Yet the corruption didn't happen.

session-03-save-successful-001.jpg
Saving at 177°00'E and 8°00'S, the game didn't corrupt.

I wandered around and saved the game thirteen times here, one save for each step, and didn't experience crashes.

I then went further to the east, and saved at 110°00'E and 8°00'S. Again, I wandered around while saving the game thirteen times, and the corruption didn't happen.

session-03-save-successful-002.jpg
Saving at 177°00'E and 8°00'S, the game didn't corrupt.

I then decided to save at the 180° meridian, which was said would cause the game to corrupt. So I went to 180°00' and 9°00'S and saved the game there. The corruption didn't happen either.

session-03-save-successful-003-AT-THE-MERIDIAN.jpg
Apparently, saving at 180°00' meridian didn't cause the game to corrupt.

Then I went northward and saved at 149°00'E and 1°00'N, the game didn't corrupt. As usual, I saved the game thirteen times while fooling around, one save for each step.

session-03-save-successful-004-after-crossing-back.jpg
Saving at 149°00'E and 1°00'N, the game didn't corrupt.

I decided to go eastward and cross the 180° meridian again, and saved my game at 6°00'W and 6°00'S, and the game didn't corrupt.

session-03-save-successful-004-after-crossing-the-meridian.jpg
Saving at 172°00'W and 6°00'S, the game didn't corrupt.

At this point, I already got bored with the experiment, so I decided to call it a day. Try as I might, this time I failed to make the game to corrupt. Here is my savegame files, though. Anyone interested to experiment with it?

In any case, I still don't exactly understand what causes the savegame bug in Martian Dreams, anyone?

Never thought this thread would be that long, but now, for something different.....
Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman.

Reply 1 of 6, by ripsaw8080

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As mentioned in the links at the top of your post, adding Dibbs to your party is purported to ward off the save bug, and your tests seem to corroborate that if I'm not misunderstanding what you wrote. However, it may not be Dibbs in particular that helps, but additional party members in general.

Reply 2 of 6, by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman

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ripsaw8080 wrote:

As mentioned in the links at the top of your post, adding Dibbs to your party is purported to ward off the save bug, and your tests seem to corroborate that if I'm not misunderstanding what you wrote. However, it may not be Dibbs in particular that helps, but additional party members in general.

That was my thought as well, but in my first gaming session, I had saved at least five times before meeting Dibbs, and yet the bug didn't happen.

Never thought this thread would be that long, but now, for something different.....
Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman.

Reply 3 of 6, by ripsaw8080

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Well, the actual conditions may be complicated, but with a relatively simple and effective workaround there's not much incentive to dig into the specifics. Maybe it's close enough to say that if you haven't added enough party members by a certain point in the game then you are susceptible to the save bug.

Reply 4 of 6, by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman

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I hope so. The savegame problem is actually something I heard very recently --no more than two weeks ago. Back in 1992 ago my highschool friends finished Martian Dreams without encountering problems whatsoever, so I wonder if the problem actually comes from the GoG copy of the game.

Anyway, does Martian Dreams run on Nuvie? Or probably Exult?

Never thought this thread would be that long, but now, for something different.....
Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman.

Reply 5 of 6, by ripsaw8080

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Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman wrote:

Back in 1992 ago my highschool friends finished Martian Dreams without encountering problems whatsoever, so I wonder if the problem actually comes from the GoG copy of the game.

As you mentioned, it is quite possible to avoid the problem without realizing it exists. Also, according to MobyGames there was a Euro zone release in 1991 that might not have the bug, and GoG is likely to be distributing the US release, although I'm not sure about that.

I think the "ultimate test" in this case would be to use a copy of the game on original media, played on a real DOS system, and there's probably nowhere better than vogons to find people that possess both. However, rather than asking for time-consuming testing, it is very useful to provide a simple and reliable method of reproducing the problem. I envision this method as something like a save file that does not yet exhibit the problem, and then a relatively short list of steps to take in the game after restoring the save, after which saving results in the hang condition. Even this may not be ideal, though, as the problem may exist in the save file in a latent state. However, I still think it's important, as testing from the very beginning of the game is less likely to see help from the community.

Reply 6 of 6, by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman

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Anyway, this is completely unrelated to the bug, but still about Martian Dreams savegame anyway. One of my favorite pastimes is hex-editing the attributes of my RPG party, be it Ultima, SSI Advanced Dungeons & Dragons Goldbox series, or Quest for Glory. Yesterday I recalled again how to hex-edit Martian Dreams party members' experience, and here are the details.

01-avatar-stats.jpg
The Avatar has 3081 experience points, which translate into 090C in hexadecimal values.

01-avatar-exp-hex-editor.jpg
The Avatar's experience points are located in the Adr. dec 3,074 in the OBJLIST file.

02-spector-stats.jpg
Spector has 1460 experience points, which translate into B405 in hexadecimal values.

02-spector-exp-hex-editor.jpg
Spector's experience points are located in the Adr. dec 3,076 in the OBJLIST file.

03-nellie-bly-stats.jpg
Nellie Bly has 1157 experience points, which translate into 8504 in hexadecimal values.

03-nellie-bly-exp-hex-editor.jpg
Nellie Bly's experience points are located in the Adr. dec 3,078 in the OBJLIST file.

04-dibbs-stats.jpg
Dibbs has 1265 experience points, which translate into F104 in hexadecimal values.

04-dibbs-exp-hex-editor.jpg
Dibb's experience points are located in the Adr. dec 3,080 in the OBJLIST file.

05-sherman-stats.jpg
Sherman has 140 experience points, which translate into 8C in hexadecimal values.

05-sherman-exp-hex-editor.jpg
Sherman's experience points are located in the Adr. dec 3,082 in the OBJLIST file.

Of course I am going to edit their experience; partially because I just don't have the patience to wait for them to level up, partially because I need sufficiently strong party members to fight with melee weapons. Bullets ain't free, y'know! 😉

You can find the savegame files here, by the way.

Never thought this thread would be that long, but now, for something different.....
Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman.