The Death of Commander Keen

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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby Jo22 » 2019-6-13 @ 03:54

I second that. On the other hand, weren't historic cartoons from the 1920 to 1950 incredible violent and psycho(delic) sometimes ?
Or maybe it's just me.. I believe I once read that some early Disney cartoons weren't meant for children at all, but soldiers.
So perhaps we get it all wrong and some of these "kids" cartoons/games were (secretly) intended to appeal older audiences ? :confused:
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby BinaryDemon » 2019-6-13 @ 20:03

Was anyone really expecting a dos based sequel? Would Keen on a console be a better option? I am sure the mobile version will get ported to windows store, which is realistically the best anyone should have been expecting.
Check out DOSBox Distro:

https://sites.google.com/site/dosboxdistro/ [*]

a lightweight Linux distro (tinycore) which boots off a usb flash drive and goes straight to DOSBox.

Make your dos retrogaming experience portable!
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby krcroft » 2019-6-13 @ 20:38

BinaryDemon wrote:Was anyone really expecting a dos based sequel? Would Keen on a console be a better option? I am sure the mobile version will get ported to windows store, which is realistically the best anyone should have been expecting.


Everyone expects remakes to land on current platforms; just like remastered movies come out on Bluray and now 4k, as opposed to VHS and BetaMax. In this case, there's zero issue with the platform (yes - desktop would be great too): it's the implementation that people don't like.

Let's use Super Mario as a gold standard in competent remakes:
  • Super Mario Bros released in North America on Oct 1985 for the NES Console
  • Super Mario Run released in North America on March 2017 for Android Phones
  • 31 years between releases
  • Example of modern remake: https://youtu.be/qjHSn4GwQWY?t=6
  • I lost count of how many elements (graphics, characters, sound effects, and gameplay mechanics) that were retained and evolved.
Any old-timer that grew up on Super Mario Bros can jump right in and have fun with Super Mario Run.
It carries forward all of the key elements from Super Mario Bros, while making use of the benefits
offered by the new platform while addressing the limitations of the phone interface through a one-tap input mechanism.

Now let's compare that to Keen:
  • Commander Keen, Invasion of the Vorticons released in North America Dec 1990 for PC (DOS)
  • Commander Keen, Mangled-by-Bethesda released summer 2019 for Android Phones
  • 29 years between releases
  • Example of original gameplay: https://youtu.be/YUyQSfKRU1w?t=161
Ask yourself if any of the key elements about Keen have been carried forward and evolved?
I would say "no" across the board; and suspect most of the original Keen audience would agree.
Therefore, by failing to win the original audience, Bethesda is off to an incompetent reboot of the Keen franchise.

Yeah, I realize my review is critical, which doesn't fit with today's only-positive-feedback-allowed-world of "If you don't like it then don't partake in it, so shut-up and move along". But I value negative knowledge; and hopefully Bethesda and other gamers do to.
Last edited by krcroft on 2019-6-13 @ 21:09, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby keenmaster486 » 2019-6-13 @ 20:49

The only things they retained are the name, the Packers helmet, and the BWB.
I flermmed the plootash just like you asked.

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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby krcroft » 2019-6-13 @ 20:55

keenmaster486 wrote:The only things they retained are the name, the Packers helmet, and the BWB.


Lol; indeed keenmaster486! (name checks out too :cool:)
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby brostenen » 2019-6-13 @ 21:59

AlphaPapa wrote:I am surprised no one has come here to comment/post on the new Keen announcement yet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtQjGPfkEe8
I have down-voted the video and expressed my dissent in the youtube comments :-)
what is everybody else's thoughts?
I feel it would have been simple to make a fast platforming game with some action tossed in and call it keen.
What it appears to be is a puzzle/trading card game??
https://commanderkeen.bethesda.net/en-us/home
EDIT: Gameplay trailer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14ZD9_tLwgA


I usually do not use meme's, yet as much as I never really liked Keen games, then I respect the history it carries.
Sooo.... Here we go'.

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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby BinaryDemon » 2019-6-14 @ 10:43

Was any of the footage representative of gameplay? The only promotional material I saw made it look like Bethesda was planning on using the franchise to launch a cartoon. It just seems super early to be so critical.
Check out DOSBox Distro:

https://sites.google.com/site/dosboxdistro/ [*]

a lightweight Linux distro (tinycore) which boots off a usb flash drive and goes straight to DOSBox.

Make your dos retrogaming experience portable!
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby cyclone3d » 2019-6-14 @ 14:33

BinaryDemon wrote:Was any of the footage representative of gameplay? The only promotional material I saw made it look like Bethesda was planning on using the franchise to launch a cartoon. It just seems super early to be so critical.


Yep, a lot of gameplay footage, especially if you go visit the page linked to below the youtube video.
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby BinaryDemon » 2019-6-14 @ 18:34

cyclone3d wrote:Yep, a lot of gameplay footage, especially if you go visit the page linked to below the youtube video.


Oh that does look pretty bad.
Check out DOSBox Distro:

https://sites.google.com/site/dosboxdistro/ [*]

a lightweight Linux distro (tinycore) which boots off a usb flash drive and goes straight to DOSBox.

Make your dos retrogaming experience portable!
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby keenmaster486 » 2019-6-15 @ 04:02

I have to say it's encouraging to see the vast numbers of people that have been turning up all over Twitter to defend Keen's legacy. I have seen not one single positive comment on the new mobile game - everyone is just talking about how much they loved the originals.

Perhaps this will be a good thing for the Keen fan community, as attention is being strongly drawn not to the new game in and of itself, but to how it stands in contrast with the legendary originals.
I flermmed the plootash just like you asked.

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http://keenmaster486.github.io
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby kode54 » 2019-6-19 @ 05:23

I have to say, the kiddies will probably love this new thing, and isn’t that all that really matters for their bottom dollar?
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby bifo78 » 2019-6-23 @ 00:59

I don't understand why this exists. Keen is a dead franchise, the only value it holds is in nostalgia for the people who grew up with it and with the retrogaming crowd who have tried it out since it died. This won't appeal to young people because they have no idea what Keen is, it won't appeal to anyone who has ever played a Keen game because it's a micro-transaction card game, and it's pissing into an ocean of identical micro-transaction games with the only unique thing about it being the relation to Keen.

If they'd brought out something like the great giana sisters remake and sequel from about ten years ago, which were completely modernized but utterly loyal to the original platformer from the 80s, then that would make perfect sense and be an extremely easy way to cash in on the franchise.
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby krcroft » 2019-6-23 @ 01:26

bifo78 wrote:If they'd brought out something like the great giana sisters remake and sequel from about ten years ago, which were completely modernized but utterly loyal to the original platformer from the 80s, then that would make perfect sense and be an extremely easy way to cash in on the franchise.


I'm forwarding this to the Vice Admiral at Bethesda's Imperial headquarters.
If they move ahead with your suggested deployment, you can expect at least 10 bCoins to be credited to your bWallet. If I'm lucky, they will grant me some leniency credits, which I desperately need (fearing my next run in with Bethesda's Gaming Regulation guards).
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby SirNickity » 2019-6-24 @ 18:30

bifo78 wrote:I don't understand why this exists. Keen is a dead franchise, the only value it holds is in nostalgia for the people who grew up with it and with the retrogaming crowd who have tried it out since it died. This won't appeal to young people because they have no idea what Keen is, it won't appeal to anyone who has ever played a Keen game because it's a micro-transaction card game, and it's pissing into an ocean of identical micro-transaction games with the only unique thing about it being the relation to Keen.


My thoughts too. Nobody who knows who Keen is will care, and for those who don't know Keen, the name adds zero value. It's essentially a new property. What's the point? This is the Atari VCS of IP games.
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Re: The Death of Commander Keen

Postby leileilol » 2019-6-24 @ 21:01

It's obviously not marketed for children with that "don't give a fuck" in the theme song so they've pretty much lost everyone.


maybe except for that one iphoner here.
by the way, DOSBox is not for running Windows 9x
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