VOGONS


The OS/2 discussion thread

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Reply 20 of 55, by Jo22

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The full version of OS/2 (blue spine) was a complete set.
Windows 3.1 or DOS wasn't needed (but could be integrated). It had them already built-in and ready to use.

OS/2 Connect was based on OS/2 3.x and had networking features like WfW 3.11.
OS/2 Warp 4 (codename "Merlin") had it included, too, but also supported real networking.
It also had other nice features, like GRADD, Dive and OpenGL. And speech pattern recognition..

Last edited by Jo22 on 2016-10-31, 20:50. Edited 1 time in total.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 21 of 55, by Elia1995

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Oh, cool... I'll try Warp 4 when I get a chance.
For now the only OS/2 I have is this "OS/2 Warp Version 3.0" (that's all it says in this CD case), I have no box and no booklets so I don't know anything more about what "exact" version this is... all I know is that it's a "Warp version 3.0"... and it has that win mode thing which didn't work at all (I dunno why, I don't even know what it actually is anyway) and so it certainly doesn't have windows 3.11 "built in" (or else it would have worked right away, right ?)

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard

Reply 22 of 55, by Jo22

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Warp 3 is fine, too. Most programs and drivers will also work with that one. 😀

Edit: "Win mode" probably means the full session of Windows. OS/2 can run Windows 3.1 programs either "seamless" on the OS/2 desktop
or it can them run on the Win 3.1 desktop. That way, you have better compatibility with programs that do strange things with the GDI
system or requiere full screen mode or maximum performance. Or it's simply for people who prefer to have both, the Windows 3.1 environment
and maximum performance of OS/2: Memory managment*, networking and disk access is still beeing done by OS/2.

Last edited by Jo22 on 2016-10-31, 21:02. Edited 2 times in total.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 23 of 55, by Elia1995

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Jo22 wrote:

Most programs and drivers will also work with that one. 😀

Is this how my AWE32 and CD-ROM drivers didn't work in there yesterday ? 🤣

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard

Reply 24 of 55, by Jo22

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Elia1995 wrote:
Jo22 wrote:

Most programs and drivers will also work with that one. 😀

Is this how my AWE32 and CD-ROM drivers didn't work in there yesterday ? 🤣

Yikes, now you're touchin' a sore spot (in OS/2)! 😁
Yes, that indeed was problem. Apparently, there's one driver which is supposed to work..

http://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php/The_Of … _with_OS/2_Warp

http://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php/Instal … tive_Labs_Audio
http://www.os2world.com/wiki/index.php/Things … tive_Labs_Audio

https://www.russharvey.bc.ca/os2/awe64os2.html

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 25 of 55, by Elia1995

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And... what about the other, MORE IMPORTANT thing ?

The CD DRIVE !!! I mean... the installation and everything was on CD, yet when I used OS/2 yesterday I had NO CD drive and I couldn't even use this other CD called "BonusPak" to see what software is in there...

there were only drives A: B: (even though I have no floppy 5,25" in this PC...) and C: and no D: CD drive.... very strange, and I couldn't find any driver to get it to work... so that was the main reason I then proceeded in installing what I currently am using in there (MS-DOS 6.22)

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard

Reply 26 of 55, by stamasd

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🤣 this thread brings back memories...back in 1998-2000 I was using at work a legacy piece of equipment that only had drivers and application programs for OS/2 2.11... And since I was the heaviest user of that equipment, I was christened system administrator for the computer that ran it. A 486/66 with 16MB and an Adaptec AHA1542CF that was used both for a 8GB SCSI drive (internally) and the equipment in question (externally - an automated FPLC chromatograph).

People kept breaking that system regularly. I did it too a few times. I can't even remember how many times I had to reinstall the OS and application on it. Eventually after a few years we upgraded to a more modern system, and the old one was scrapped. I kept two pieces of it, which I still have: the Adaptec card, and the 22-floppy boxed set OS/2 2.11 installation. 😀

I/O, I/O,
It's off to disk I go,
With a bit and a byte
And a read and a write,
I/O, I/O

Reply 27 of 55, by Jo22

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brostenen wrote:

Had to think a bit.... (and write a little guide, hence two posts)
[..]

Thanks for that guide! I never installed Win9x right beside OS/2 before.
I'm sure for Elia1995 and the rest of us this will come in handy sometime.

Elia1995 wrote:

And... what about the other, MORE IMPORTANT thing ?

The CD DRIVE !!! I mean... the installation and everything was on CD, yet when I used OS/2 yesterday I had NO CD drive and I couldn't even use this other CD called "BonusPak" to see what software is in there...

there were only drives A: B: (even though I have no floppy 5,25" in this PC...) and C: and no D: CD drive.... very strange, and I couldn't find any driver to get it to work... so that was the main reason I then proceeded in installing what I currently am using in there (MS-DOS 6.22)

OS/2 contains floppy images. So you can make your own installation disks.
You only need about two or three packages of high-density "Micro Floppies". 😁

Besides, Warp 4 also comes with IDE/ATAPI drivers. Don't know about Warp 3, though.
I think I had an old Mitsumi or Philips drive back in the 90s.

stamasd wrote:

🤣 this thread brings back memories...back in 1998-2000 I was using at work a legacy piece of equipment that only had drivers and application programs for OS/2 2.11... And since I was the heaviest user of that equipment, I was christened system administrator for the computer that ran it. A 486/66 with 16MB and an Adaptec AHA1542CF that was used both for a 8GB SCSI drive (internally) and the equipment in question (externally - an automated FPLC chromatograph).

People kept breaking that system regularly. I did it too a few times. I can't even remember how many times I had to reinstall the OS and application on it. Eventually after a few years we upgraded to a more modern system, and the old one was scrapped. I kept two pieces of it, which I still have: the Adaptec card, and the 22-floppy boxed set OS/2 2.11 installation. 😀

Oh yes, OS/2 2.11! ^^ I also have got a copy of that. Glad you kept yours, too.
Both v2.1x and Warp 3 were from the golden age of OS/2 (that was, before Win95 came along).

And at least you can say you were an OS/2 admin back in the day! That's something!

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 28 of 55, by Anonymous Freak

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My first experience with OS/2 was running the OS/2 2.0 beta (yes, beta!) on an IBM PS/2 model 30/286 that had a 386 upgrade, the bare-minimum 4 MB RAM, and a 20 MB hard drive partitioned in to a DOS drive and an OS/2 drive. Needless to say, it was painfully slow (seeing as it was only *EXACTLY* the minimum specs, and even that was only via a kludgey upgrade.)

Ran up to OS/2 Warp 4 as my "primary OS" for many years. But always had to maintain a real DOS partition for games. For non-game DOS apps and Windows (pre-Win95) apps, it worked great. Rock solid, and generally very fast/responsive when run on more than absolute-minimum hardware.

Still have boxed retail copies of 2.0, 2.1, 3.0 and 4.0. I currently have 2.1 installed on one of my PS/2s.

Reply 29 of 55, by Jo22

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Cool! Funnily, later OS/2 versions needed less memory. Warp 3 was said to need less than 2.1 (but what about 2.0, 1.x ?)

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 30 of 55, by Elia1995

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I'm trying to install OS/2 right now along with MS-DOS 6.22 using that guide.
I made a partition with the letter E: (because D: was all set up for the CD already) and installed the "Boot Manager"
but now... right after the screen where I should choose wheter to quick format or long format, it's stuck at "Checking your system. Please wait..." for like 30 minutes... what should I do ? Should I keep waiting or not ? The CD isn't even spinning anymore...

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard

Reply 31 of 55, by Jo22

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If the drives don't spin anymore, it perhaps crashed. 🙁 30min is quite long.
There were updated installation disks, but they are only for the English version I'm afraid.
That's something I didn't like about OS/2, btw. They focused on their native version,
but not so much on the localized European, Asian, etc. versions.
http://www.warpdoctor.org/downloads.html

PS: Also interesting (found here)..:
http://arstechnica.com/business/2013/11/half- … agedy-of-os2/5/

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 32 of 55, by Elia1995

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Well, still worth a try... I just downloaded them, should I just use them instead of my current floppies ?

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard

Reply 33 of 55, by Jo22

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I think so (haven't tried yet).

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 34 of 55, by Elia1995

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Ok, I'm extracting those things into the floppies I previously used from DOS (didn't work with DOSBox this time...)

Do you think OS/2 would have any problem with the built-in ethernet port in my PC-CHIPS M754MLRTP motherboard ?

Well... I made the floppies, but the installation still proceeds with the CD-ROM and never takes a look at those floppies...
I dunno :\

Well, no problems installing OS/2 with the micro floppies now.
But still no CD-ROM drive 🙁 I hope there's a fix... especially because there's this "BonusPak" CD I can't try.

Last edited by Elia1995 on 2016-11-01, 11:45. Edited 1 time in total.

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard

Reply 35 of 55, by Jo22

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PM sent.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 36 of 55, by ynari

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I used OS/2 as my main operating system both personally and professionally between 1992 and 1999 (so, mostly the 32 bit versions of OS/2 rather than 16 bit), and still have it installed on real hardware and in a VM.

It does have some decent parts, but to be perfectly honest I would run it in a VM these days. There's very little software that needs to be run bare metal. Gaming wise there's little that's worth playing in OS/2 : Galactic Civilisations 2 is an excellent game, and is where the series originated. Avarice was interesting but flawed. I heard Links was excellent, but it also existed on Windows.

To answer some of your questions, and others you haven't asked.

Newer drivers can be downloaded to make the AWE32 work

For multi booting operating systems, always use the OS/2 boot manager. Never use its dual boot on a FAT partition facility, it doesn't work well. If you run OS/2, you should be using HPFS.

OS/2 supports large disks, the limitation is on the boot partitions being within the first 1024 cylinders. My retro PC runs DOS, OS/2, XP, Linux, and OpenBSD together without an issue. DOS needs to be on a primary partition, everything else supports logical partitions.

CDROMs work fine, but you later drivers may be used. The DANIs drivers are much better than the stock offerings.

To run modern OS/2 software, you'll need to patch Warp 3 up to date including the latest Warp 4 kernel. Once one of the latest Warp 3 fixpacks (thirty something) has been applied, Warp 3 kernel is brought up to the level of Warp 4, and Warp 4 kernel fixpacks may be applied. This does not apply to the other subsystems (networking), which stay on the Warp 3 track - not that this makes too much difference, because all but the server or post retail offerings of Warp 4 are still on the 16 bit networking stack. The workplace shell is not updated, either, but there's enough third party options to work round the minor Warp 4 enhancements. Speech recognition isn't worth it, and OpenGL is useless apart from running one package of screensavers - it is never GPU accelerated.

It's possible to create a bootable fully patched OS/2 install CD, but this works best on OS/2. It's supposedly also possible to do this in Windows - never tried.

You could buy a copy of eComstation, or the upcoming Arca Noae ArcaOS/BlueLion (coming Q4) and run OS/2 on modern hardware with much less hassle than shoehorning something from the mid nineties.

It is possible to install Warp 3/4 from floppy, but you really don't want to. If for some reason it's completely impossible to read the CDROM within OS/2, it's possible to copy all the install files onto a hard disk partition, and use that as a source. It's best to get the CDROM working though, as otherwise the networking install will be a little painful.

I may look at writing a document on how to install Warp 3/4 in a VM, but really, unless you're a die hard fan with a large amount of legacy software, and like using it as a boot manager (like me), why are you bothering with real hardware?

Reply 37 of 55, by Jo22

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I agree with you. I'm mainly interested in it because of technical and historical reasons.
OS/2 wasn't perfect, though. It also had its shortcomings, of course.

But it was and is (hey, eComstation isn't dead yet) a fascinating piece of software.
Also from a philosophical point-of-view (Family API, Star Trek references, focus on compatibility and longevity).

It was the only OS I know of which aimed for co-existence. Support for DOS and Windows 3.1 wasn't just half-hearted,
but really tried to be better than the original. Even more, it allowed the existing system(s) to be part of
it's own. If you wished, they were still working as fully stand-alone products.

From a user's point of view, this really was a good thing.
At least until Win95 came and compatibility with new software was going down the hill.
The limited PnP support of OS/2 did the rest of it.. And many drivers never left beta stage.

Some people say, that it was too good and failed because of this (BeOS where are you ?).
I guess, it's a bit like native Linux apps vs. Windows apps+Wine (I like WINE).

But perhaps the whole business speech in the GUI also detracted people.
As a kid, I couldn't stand it - Windows 3.1 was much more friendly to me.
I'm fine with it now, but it kinda reminds me of the language politicians use.

"Time, it seems, doesn't flow. For some it's fast, for some it's slow.
In what to one race is no time at all, another race can rise and fall..." - The Minstrel

//My video channel//

Reply 38 of 55, by zstandig

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I've played with eComstation 2.1. Mostly because I was toying with the idea of getting a Lennovo Thinkstation, equipping it with my HGST Deskstar, Unicomp Keyboard, and Lexmark Printer then pretending it's a modern IBM machine....

But, eComstation OS/2... I admit I don't know how to use it very well. From fooling around with it I can say that it is a step above Windows 98, but I just didn't know how to do basic operating system things. (installing software, getting software). It's obviously a "nerdy" OS because there's tons of information all over the place and it feels like an overwhelming about of options are there. The most interesting and useful part is that it seems to have the ability to make DOS and Win16 windows so you can have a bunch of those apps running and not worry about it crashing the whole system which would be a boon to any organisation that relies on custom legacy software.

The only real downside to eComstation other than the learning curve is that it's expensive and isn't compatible with the latest features (still 32bit)

Reply 39 of 55, by Elia1995

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In all these years, I've never tried OS/2 in a VM for the simple fact that I had no clue on how to install it.
Neither VMWare nor Parallels nor VirtualBox have the "OS/2" in the Operating Systems list and (I didn't know about the fact that I had to make 2 floppies from the batch file in the root of the CD yet) the CD didn't boot for installation.
But now that I have these floppies everything changes and I'll try to install it as a VM in my main PC (I hope) soon.

For now I'll probably keep it like that... dual booting with MS-DOS 6.22/Windows 3.11 in this Celeron PC.

Ah yeah, I almost forgot !!! I am very disappointed of Warp 3's "fdisk" utility !!! It works like crap and I really mean it !!! Here's what happened.... when I wanted to install it back from the floppies, since the CD version failed and got stuck at "Checking your system. Please wait..." (although that wasn't actually Warp 3), when I got to the fdisk part to choose a partition to make bootable... well I couldn't do anything !!! I pressed enter in the "Free space", every option is "blue" (like being "greyed out" normally) and nothing was selectable, I could only delete the MS-DOS partition, but why the hell would I want to do that ?
So basically I was stuck. I had my hardisk perfectly partitioned already, I had the primary partition with DOS and the second partition I made earlier with the other version of disk of the CD version of OS/2 which is completely different and much more working, and it didn't appear in this fdisk, I only saw these "primary partition", letter C, of 2047 MB with the FAT16 file system, another partition of 7 MB which is the boot manager and then "Free space" 20k MB, on which I pressed "Enter" but I couldn't do anything. Bug ? Glitch ? I've used OS/2 for the first time only 2 days ago and I am already hating its installation glitches.

Currently assembled vintage computers I own: 11

Most important ones:
A "modded" Olivetti M4 434 S (currently broken).
An Epson El Plus 386DX running MS-DOS 6.22 (currently broken).
Celeron Coppermine 1.10GHz on an M754LMRTP motherboard