Nonsense!

I installed MS-DOS 6.22 on another hard drive and set it up the same way.

MSD again reports 581KB free conventional memory.

Wolfenstein 3-D runs fine however.

The only difference is the DOS version. So Wolfenstein 3-D is not compatible with the DOS version from Win9x? What?

Wrong forum. This one is for modern systems. Use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

How much RAM do you have installed in this computer?

I seem to recall that the Win9x version of HIMEM supports a larger amount of RAM (i.e. it can create more extended memory) than the MS-DOS version – possibly too much RAM for Wolfenstein to handle. That's my best guess, anyway.
http://www.msfn.org/board/topic/159631-testin … os-limitations/

If that's the case, then you can circumvent the problem by using HIMEMX to limit the RAM to 64 MB. (Or you can try using the MS-DOS version of HIMEM with the Windows 98 command.com, but that might not work.)

collector wrote:

Wrong forum. This one is for modern systems.

Maybe this is a modern system?

r00tb33r wrote:

The only difference is the DOS version. So Wolfenstein 3-D is not compatible with the DOS version from Win9x? What?

Maybe because Wolfenstein 3D wants to run in real mode and the DOS version under Windows 9x uses protected mode? There's a difference in how memory is accessed.
Re: real/protected mode dos games

on my system I can play wolf3d just fine with DOS from 98SE (not dos under 98se but boot in dos mode) and I have 128MB installed. No issues whatsoever.

skitters wrote:

r00tb33r wrote:

The only difference is the DOS version. So Wolfenstein 3-D is not compatible with the DOS version from Win9x? What?

Maybe because Wolfenstein 3D wants to run in real mode and the DOS version under Windows 9x uses protected mode? There's a difference in how memory is accessed.
Re: real/protected mode dos games

No... Just pure MS-DOS 7.1, no Win98 GUI boot.

keropi wrote:

on my system I can play wolf3d just fine with DOS from 98SE (not dos under 98se but boot in dos mode) and I have 128MB installed. No issues whatsoever.

Yeah, that's what I was doing, a DOS mode boot (no GUI). Didn't work, don't know why. Weird.

collector wrote:

Wrong forum. This one is for modern systems. Use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

Don't know what you mean. Machine is a Slot 1 P3, mfg 1999.

r00tb33r wrote:

collector wrote:

Wrong forum. This one is for modern systems. Use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

Don't know what you mean. Machine is a Slot 1 P3, mfg 1999.

This forum is for modern systems. For old hardware like yours use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

collector wrote:

r00tb33r wrote:

collector wrote:

Wrong forum. This one is for modern systems. Use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

Don't know what you mean. Machine is a Slot 1 P3, mfg 1999.

This forum is for modern systems. For old hardware like yours use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

Just a observation. You seem to have to repeat yourself many times throughout this forum (DOS and Windows) that "This is the wrong forum and is for modern systems only". And maybe because of the forum name might be a reason why people might get confused. You have it titled "Getting old DOS games working".

When perhaps it should say.... "Getting old DOS games working on modern hardware only, if you are talking about older hardware, don't bother asking here because i will move your topic to
Marvin, the Paranoid Android forum."

I guess what I'm saying is, given the first thing you see on the main page sub titles of DOS, and Windows. Both of which just have a description of "Getting old DOS/Windows games working" and makes no reference to you meaning only on Modern machines. I can see why people would get confused and instantly go into the DOS forum and ask questions about getting a DOS game to work regardless of the age of hardware as there is no mention that you only mean MODERN hardware until you insert your comment. And maybe its just me. But maybe change a few things. Just a suggestion.

Blades wrote:

Just a observation. You seem to have to repeat yourself many times throughout this forum (DOS and Windows) that "This is the wro […]
Show full quote

collector wrote:

collector wrote:

Wrong forum. This one is for modern systems. Use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

This forum is for modern systems. For old hardware like yours use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

Just a observation. You seem to have to repeat yourself many times throughout this forum (DOS and Windows) that "This is the wrong forum and is for modern systems only". And maybe because of the forum name might be a reason why people might get confused. You have it titled "Getting old DOS games working".

When perhaps it should say.... "Getting old DOS games working on modern hardware only, if you are talking about older hardware, don't bother asking here because i will move your topic to
Marvin, the Paranoid Android forum."

I guess what I'm saying is, given the first thing you see on the main page sub titles of DOS, and Windows. Both of which just have a description of "Getting old DOS/Windows games working" and makes no reference to you meaning only on Modern machines. I can see why people would get confused and instantly go into the DOS forum and ask questions about getting a DOS game to work regardless of the age of hardware as there is no mention that you only mean MODERN hardware until you insert your comment. And maybe its just me. But maybe change a few things. Just a suggestion.

Indeed. I read the description for the forum section so I'm certain my topic fit the bill. I think members like that should either become a moderator (with that attitude they will never be a moderator on a thriving forum community), or start their own forum and do their thing there.

Personally I don't think a P3 is old enough to be old. It's reasonably modern... Perhaps a little old. Kind of blurry there I think.

No, I think a P3 is pretty old at this point. It would be pretty questionable to get Wolfenstein 3D running on anything newer, at least.

Back to the matter at hand: how much RAM do you have in this system? Did you try HIMEMX? (Did you miss my post entirely..?)

Moved to Marvin > Software.

Sorry for falling behind on the thread moves, collector, I've been a little too busy.

Blades wrote:

collector wrote:

r00tb33r wrote:

Don't know what you mean. Machine is a Slot 1 P3, mfg 1999.

This forum is for modern systems. For old hardware like yours use Marvin. Marvin, the Paranoid Android

Just a observation. You seem to have to repeat yourself many times throughout this forum (DOS and Windows) that "This is the wrong forum and is for modern systems only". And maybe because of the forum name might be a reason why people might get confused. You have it titled "Getting old DOS games working".

Do people still understand that the name of the forum, "VOGONS", is a backronym for "Very Old Games On New Systems"?

The first two subforums you find on the forum index... "On New Systems" should be presumed. Back when the forum was created, that was in 2002 so that was Windows XP. 😉

Generally speaking, *I think* the preferred interpretation is "running DOS-compatible games natively on an NT-based OS" and "running Win3.1/9x/Me-compatible games natively on an NT-based OS". And yes, we realize that the compatibility layers used back in those times were only really 32-bit friendly, so there's less use for these forums anymore aside from gently steering people towards emulators/VMs.

I guess the subforum descriptions will change. Again. But they're historic, so we try not to mess with them too much.

So if OP had been running Windows XP or Windows 2000 on his P3, and trying to run Wolfenstein 3-D natively, that would have been an appropriate thread for that forum. 😀

Jorpho wrote:

No, I think a P3 is pretty old at this point. It would be pretty questionable to get Wolfenstein 3D running on anything newer, at least.

Back to the matter at hand: how much RAM do you have in this system? Did you try HIMEMX? (Did you miss my post entirely..?)

Ah sorry. No, I haven't tried HIMEMX... But, on both 7.1 and 6.22 I was using the included HIMEM... Are they different and do they produce a different result?

The machine has one stick of 128MB at the moment, because I didn't think I'll need more for anything I could possibly run in DOS.

Wolfenstein 3D can be run with "wolf3d.exe noems noxms", which should just force it to use conventional instead, and there was enough conventional memory there, but it was giving the memory error anyway. I did try that on 6.22 and it did in fact not use anything beyond conventional memory, and there was enough of it, and it worked.

r00tb33r wrote:

But, on both 7.1 and 6.22 I was using the included HIMEM... Are they different and do they produce a different result?

That would be the subject matter of my previous post, yes. 😒

But then, as noted above, Mr. Keropi has the same amount of RAM and has no problems.

Are you using the latest version of Wolfenstein 3D? There were several different official versions. (At the moment I cannot seem to locate a proper list of them and what might have changed between them, aside from the cheat codes.)

Jorpho wrote:

That would be the subject matter of my previous post, yes. :blah: […]
Show full quote

r00tb33r wrote:

But, on both 7.1 and 6.22 I was using the included HIMEM... Are they different and do they produce a different result?

That would be the subject matter of my previous post, yes. 😒

But then, as noted above, Mr. Keropi has the same amount of RAM and has no problems.

Are you using the latest version of Wolfenstein 3D? There were several different official versions. (At the moment I cannot seem to locate a proper list of them and what might have changed between them, aside from the cheat codes.)

Yeah, latest It's the re-release with Activision publisher branding on the startup screen. There exist at least two other publisher brandings on the startup screen, Apogee and GT.

r00tb33r, were you able to resolve your issue?

I'd be curious to see what would happen in your case if you use DOS 7.1 to boot, but use HIMEM.SYS (and EMM386.EXE) from DOS6.22 in your CONFIG.SYS.
I know this combo works as I use it in some cases.

I suspect that Wolf3D doesn't like more than 64MB of RAM.