SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Getting old software/games running on older hardware.

SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Samir.Habib » 2018-11-28 @ 20:52

:lol:
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby SW-SSG » 2018-11-28 @ 22:31

If you actually meant this as a serious question, only Vista will be doing any especially extensive writing to the SSD (SuperFetch, indexing, etc). The others are unlikely to wear down the write cycles too quickly, especially if you don't use the PC containing the drive 24/7/365. In any case, modern SSDs tend to have decent garbage-collection algorithms, so a lack of TRIM support is unlikely to be a real problem. I would worry more about the life of whatever vintage hardware you're performing this hypothetical experiment on than the life of the SSD, so long as you stick to name-brands (Samsung, Crucial, Toshiba, etc).
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby agent_x007 » 2018-11-29 @ 07:44

I highly doubt you can have all four on one drive.
In general, try CompactFlash and IDE adapter for DOS (as I don't see why you would want something faster for pure DOS, unless you need Win98's 7.11 version for greater capabilities).
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Samir.Habib » 2018-11-29 @ 09:13

I created this topic with absolutely serious intention. There is now need to use one SSD for difrent OS's.
I have five builds:
PC based on Intel Pentium-S 133 P54CS
ASUS P/I-P55TP4XE with 256K Cache based on Intel 430FX chipset
Intel Pentium-S 133 66 MHz FSB
32 Mb EDORAM PC66 (4 x 8 Mb)
2 Gb IDE HDD
MS-DOS 6.22
Windows for Workgroups 3.11
Matrox Millennium 4mb
Creative Sound Blaster AWE32 CT3990

PC based on Intel Pentium II 450 Deschutes
ASUS P2B based on Intel 440BX chipset
Intel Pentium II 450 MHz, 512K Cache, 100 MHz FSB
192 Mb SDRAM PC100 (3 x 64 Mb)
10 Gb IDE HDD
Windows 95 OSR 2.5; DirectX 6
nVIDIA RIVA TNT 16 Mb Direct3D + OpenGL
Creative Sound Blaster Live! CT4620
3Dfx Voodoo2 12 Mb only Glide API (TR1,CARM1,NFS2, GTA1, Unreal)

PC based on Intel Pentium III 1.0EB Coppermine
ASUS CUSL2-C based on Intel 815EP chipset
Intel Pentium III 1000 MHz 256K Cache, 133 MHz FSB
320 Mb SDRAM PC133 (2 x 128 + 64 Mb)
40 Gb IDE HDD
Windows 98 SE; DirectX 7
Nvidia GeForce2 Ultra 64 Mb
Creative Sound Blaster Live! 5.1 SB0060

PC based on Intel Pentium 4 2.8 Northwood
ASUS ASUS P4T533 based on Intel 850E chipset
Intel Pentium 4 2800 MHz 512K Cache, 533 MHz FSB
512 Mb RDRAM PC4200 (2 x 256 Mb)
80 Gb IDE HDD
Windows ME; DirectX 8.1
Nvidia GeForce4 Ti4600 128 Mb
Creative Sound Blaster Audigy 2 SB0240

PC based on Intel Core 2 Duo E6700 Conroe
ASUS P5B Deluxe based on Intel P965 chipset
Intel Core 2 Duo 2667 MHz, 4M Cache, 1066 MHz FSB
4 Gb Corsair Dominator DDR2-1066 (4 x 1 Gb)
150 Gb SATA WD1500AHFD Raptor
Windows XP Pro SP2 64-bit; DirectX 9c
Nvidia GeForce 7900 GTX 512 Mb
Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi SB0460

DOS build HDD making very scary noise, i don't know, how long will it take. Win 98 build vey slow, and noisy. For 95 & ME works acceptable, but it only matter of time. Win XP Raptor also very noisy. So i started to think upgrade hhd's one by one.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Samir.Habib » 2018-11-29 @ 09:21

2gb ide ssd are already exist
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby oeuvre » 2018-11-29 @ 14:15

On the DOS rig, I'd just use a CF to IDE adapter... and the SSD is really only worth it in that Core 2 Duo rig IMO.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby SW-SSG » 2018-11-29 @ 22:14

Yeah, may want to just use CF cards with IDE adapters on all but the C2D machine, which should be new and fast enough that the extra speed and capacity of a SATA SSD wouldn't go (at least completely) to waste.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Samir.Habib » 2018-11-30 @ 09:59

Ok, about DOS PC best option SD with IDE adapter.

Win 9x, Philipp from PhilsComputerLab using modern SATA HDD's,
and also in one video i saw him using real 2,5 SSD with Windows ME.
Druaga 1 installing everything what he can on SD card.

I also found out that Win XP does not support AHCI, and ofcourse TRIM.

So if bying 2 gb SD card is not an issue, new SSD i wold like keep working well as long as possible.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby hwh » 2018-12-09 @ 00:59

Samir.Habib wrote:I also found out that Win XP does not support AHCI, and ofcourse TRIM.


Yes it does. I don't really understand the confusion here...you install in IDE mode, then install your chipset drivers which obviously have to support AHCI, then switch to AHCI in the BIOS. You can check by benchmarking before and after;

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Notice any differences?

TRIM is something that you can run in software. For instance, Samsung's terrible Magician software does it. I also have a mini-PCI SSD without any software support on an XP laptop. For that I have SSD tweaker which allegedly does TRIM. I don't have much um, confidence in it but it's in there.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby cyclone3d » 2018-12-09 @ 01:36

Most of the new SSDs have automatic garbage cleanup built-in so you don't even need TRIM support in the OS or even through a utility as I understand it.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby swaaye » 2018-12-12 @ 19:24

Decent SSDs seem to be able to handle hundreds of terabytes of writing. Good luck achieving that with retro nonsense. :lol:
https://techreport.com/review/27909/the ... e-all-dead
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Samir.Habib » 2018-12-13 @ 20:28

Thanks to everyone, for comments. In the near future, I will give upgrade first to my P5 machine, with 2gb SD card.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby doaks80 » 2018-12-13 @ 21:23

cyclone3d wrote:Most of the new SSDs have automatic garbage cleanup built-in so you don't even need TRIM support in the OS or even through a utility as I understand it.


Wat. Without TRIM the GC has no idea that deleted blocks are garbage in the first place. That's the whole point. Use a spinning disk with SSD inbuilt cache...no need for GC or TRIM as the LRU blocks are considered "free space" once the SSD fills up.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Samir.Habib » 2018-12-17 @ 16:42

hwh wrote:
Samir.Habib wrote:I also found out that Win XP does not support AHCI, and ofcourse TRIM.


Yes it does. I don't really understand the confusion here...you install in IDE mode, then install your chipset drivers which obviously have to support AHCI, then switch to AHCI in the BIOS. You can check by benchmarking before and after;

Image
Image

Notice any differences?

TRIM is something that you can run in software. For instance, Samsung's terrible Magician software does it. I also have a mini-PCI SSD without any software support on an XP laptop. For that I have SSD tweaker which allegedly does TRIM. I don't have much um, confidence in it but it's in there.


hwh, about AHCI..... After i finished installation of Win XP, i install all drivers, chipset ofcourse includes. Then i go to the bios, change HDD IDE mode to AHCI, and then...blue screen......
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby dr_st » 2018-12-18 @ 11:23

This is because Windows is stupid like that, and if it's been installed in "IDE" mode, it will not enable the AHCI driver on startup, even if you install it. There are methods to make it work. Search for something like "XP switch to AHCI after install".
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby gdjacobs » 2018-12-18 @ 19:44

FWIW, I used another controller (onboard in this case) while switching modes from IDE to AHCI. The appropriate driver was installed, I switched back to the original SATA port, and everything reconfigured as intended.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby FFXIhealer » 2018-12-20 @ 14:00

The process goes something like this (I've had to do this at least once myself):

1. Set SATA mode to IDE in the BIOS.
2. Install Windows XP.
3. Install all chipset drivers.
4. Open REGEDT32.EXE (registry editor).
5. Navigate to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\services\msahci
6. Right click on the Start registry DWORD and select Modify.
7. Set the value to 0 and click OK.
8. Restart your machine and IMMEDIATELY enter the BIOS.
9. Change SATA mode to AHCI.
10. Allow Windows XP to fully boot (takes a little bit longer as it sets up the AHCI drivers during boot).

You're done.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby oeuvre » 2018-12-20 @ 14:07

Yea, have done that regedit method before and can confirm it works.
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby dr_st » 2018-12-20 @ 15:25

Except XP doesn't have msahci; it's Vista or later. For XP, you'll need to enable the manufacturer's SATA/AHCI driver (e.g., iaStor if it's Intel).
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Re: SSD with MS-DOS, Win9x, XP & Vista. how long will it stay a live?

Postby Jo22 » 2018-12-21 @ 01:21

Also, XP, Vista and 7 don't use native 4K transfer for HDD/SSD access yet, only 512 bytes per sectors.
This was added ca. around Win 8.x or 10, if memory serves.

4K transfers are insofar interesting as they fit to 4K the memory blocks that Windows uses in 32-Bit/64-Bit Protected Mode (Win 3.x onwards).
Btw, this is also reminds me of Win98(SE): Unlike Win95, it could run programs directly from disk cache, *if* their EXE files were aligned to 4K boundaries. :)
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